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Re: OU+PAS (Romans 9:6 reconsidered)

In a message dated 97-06-03 10:43:05 EDT, beale@uconect.net (Jim Beale)
writes:

> I've found two kinds of verses in which OU+PAS is found.  In the
>  first kind, OU is construed with PAS.  In these OU negates the
>  universal affirmative proposition producing a particular negative
>  proposition; ~(All a is b) becomes (Some a is not b).  In the second
>  kind, OU is construed with the verb, producing a universal affirmation
>  (or negation depending on the way the relation is written).  Of this
>  latter class are two important verses: Rom 3:20, Gal 2:16.

The awkward thing about applying this idea to Romans 9:6 is the presence of
the resumptive hOUTOI.  It does not make sense, as Piper rightly points out,
to sum up an indefinite OU PANTES (not all = some) with the very definite
hOUTOI.  We would not say, "Not all the people at the party?  Those were the
ones having fun."  Something similar is found in Romans 7:15 (about which, I
have discovered, there was much discussion here some years ago).  Again, it
seems best to me to take the OU as negating the entire concept which follows:
 It is not the case that "PANTES hOI EX ISRAHL, hOUTOI ISRAHL."
 Interestingly enough, this fits modern slang:  "'All who are of Israel,
these ones are Israel'--NOT!"   =)

Thanks for the input, Jim.

Regards,

John
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