Stephen Carlson wrote:MAubrey wrote:The thing is that I don't think οράω should be an activity at all.
Well, what do you think it is?
I would anticipate that its a state.
Stephen Carlson wrote:MAubrey wrote:If you're going to do this project the first thing you're going to want to do is gather a collection of adverbs for testing collocation. I would anticipate that οράω does not collocate with adverbs like "vigorously" or "quickly" and thus cannot be an activity.
I think the idea of what Jonathan is doing is to churn the waters and get people to propose / debate / dispute the methodology and tests. So, is your test for an activity collocation with adverbs like "vigorously" or "quickly"? Is this test described in the literature?
Those are actually two separate test. Van Valin (2005, 35ff; http://bit.ly/MTUBQY ) has a pretty good summary of the tests along with the caveats that go along with the tests.
Greek doesn't have the same kind of variety in adverbs that English has. However, I think that instances of μέγας where it modifies the verb (and its adverbial derivative μεγάλως) might be useful for testing for dynamic predicates, as in 1 Kingdoms 10:2:
1 Kingdoms 10:2 wrote:εὑρήσεις δύο ἄνδρας πρὸς τοῖς τάφοις Ῥαχὴλ ἐν τῷ ὄρει Βενιαμεὶν ἁλλομένους μεγάλα
"You will find two men at the tomb of Rachel on the mount of Benjamin jumping vigorously."
I just came across this a few days ago. Unfortunately, since μέγας/μεγάλως technically expresses degree, it isn't to activities. As L&N says:
.L&N 78.2 wrote:In a number of languages the expression of intense degree associated with some activity or state is expressed by means of a verb, not an adverb. . . .
With that said, I think its pretty clear when μέγας/μεγάλως has dynamic meaning and when doesn't, at least in translation. Stative predicates prefer a translation that involves "very" or some variation (e.g. "to be very glad")whereas non-stative predicates tend toward other interpretations (e.g. "to roar tremendously" or "to welcome heartily).
Stephen Carlson wrote:(I'm also not sure if the state-activity distinction is as important for Greek as it is for English.)
That's entirely possible, but it is something that would require testing to determine for sure. I'm suspicious, though. It's pretty clear that the Greek lexicon has allowed for the formation of distinct prototypical verbs expressing to be and to do. At the same time, the fact that μέγας can be used with both activities and states might suggest you're right. It's a little extreme of a view for me though. I would still expect that some verbs are more state-like and others are more activity-like.
And now that I think about it, I'd probably also want to talk about some kind of schematic structure for μέγας/μεγάλως in its adverbial usage with a degree schema that is realized a different prototype structure on the basis of the aktionsart class of the predication.
Jonathan Robie wrote:And is there a list of adverbs that you would suggest? Or do we have to develop these as well?
Well, I've made a start above with one, but that's just one. This is something I've started before. Peter Stork has some suggestions about some other tests in his monograph The Dynamic Infinitive that are useful for written texts without native speakers. I'll see if I can find the time to dig those out again. The book is probably in Duke's library...