Greek equivalents for Classroom sayings

Greek equivalents for Classroom sayings

Postby Barry Hofstetter » October 19th, 2011, 10:42 pm

In Latin I have a bunch of common classroom statements/questions that I force the students to use, but not so much for Greek. The first one I haven't come up with anything I consider idiomatic. The others I have something for, but would like to see how others might say it. For inspiration, I have included the Latin phrases as well.

"May I use the restroom?" (Velim latrina uti)

"May I get a drink of water?" (Velim aquam bibere)

"Look at the Greek!" (Specta Latinam)

"Read/say the Greek first, then the English" (I know, I should have them paraphrase it in Greek and so forth, but I'm not quite there yet). (Primum lege Latinam et Anglice redde)

"Look at the board!" (Specta tabulam)

"Write it on the board!" (Scribe eam [sententiam/exercitationem] in tabula)

"Get the rabbit out of the mushrooms!" (ok, skip that one, it only happened once) (Porta e boletis cuniculum)

"May I go get paper/pencil/pen..." (Velim chartam/stilum obtinere)

"May I sharpen my pencil?" (Mihi liceat ut stilum acutiorem faciam)

"Keep your hands to yourself!" (Noli tangere alteros discipulos. Lately I have had to add "stilo aut regula)

Any other common classroom sayings that anyone can suggest? There's a lot of support for this type of thing for Latin, but practically nothing for Greek. Having more than one way to phrase it is also good -- I have variations on the above using licet for "may" and "quaeso, amabo te, and si tibi placebit for "please."

χάριν ὑμῖν οἷδα...
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Re: Greek equivalents for Classroom sayings

Postby Mark Lightman » October 20th, 2011, 12:53 am

Hi, Barry,

"Keep your hands to yourself!" (Noli tangere alteros discipulos. Lately I have had to add "stilo aut regula)



μὴ ἅπτου τοῦ πλησίον σου.


"Get the rabbit out of the mushrooms!" (ok, skip that one, it only happened once) (Porta e boletis cuniculum)


ἔξελε τὸν λαγὼν ἐκ τῶν μανιταρίων.


Any other common classroom sayings that anyone can suggest?


The most useful thing for students under the age of 30 to know is

μηδὲν ἄγαν.


Especially in regards to rabbits and mushrooms.
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Re: Greek equivalents for Classroom sayings

Postby Louis L Sorenson » October 20th, 2011, 6:04 am

Here is a list of some classroom objects and classroom banter. A pdf can be found at http://www.letsreadgreek.com/teachingresources/ and I'm sure it can be improved upon.

Ioannides "Sprechen Sie Attich" has a "Im der Schule" section (B §21-35). Carl Conrad did the translation into English. It can be found at http://www.letsreadgreek.com/phrasebook/

PEOPLE
• Student μαθητής –οῦ, ὁ / μαθήτρια, -ας, ἡ
• Teacher διδάσκαλος, -ου, ὁ
• Guest ξένος, -ου, ὁ
OBJECTS
• Board (White/Black) πίναξ, πίνακος, ὁ (acc. πίνακα)
• Tablet πινακίδιον, -ου, τό
• Pen/Pencil καλαμός, -οῦ, ὁ
• Paper χάρτης –ου, ὁ
• Ink μέλαν, μέλανος, τό
• Table τράπεζα, -ης, ἡ
• Chair καθέδρα, -ας, ἡ
• Wall τεῖχος, –ου, ὁ
• Floor ἔδαφος, –ους, τό
• Book
o βιβλίον, -ου, τό
o βίβλος, -ου, ἡ
o βιβλαρίδιον, -ου, τό
• Bible ἡ ἁγία γραφή | αἱ ἅγιαι γραφαι
o Old Testament ἡ Παλαία Διαθήκη
o New Testament ἡ Καινὴ Διαθήκη
• Backpack πήρα, -ας, ἡ
• Box θησαυρός, -οῦ, ὁ | κιβωτός, -οῦ, ἡ
• Guitar κίθαρα, -ας, ἡ
WRITING, LETTERS, ETC.
• a letter (of the alphabet) γράμμα, -ατος, τό
• a letter (from someone) γράμματα, -ατων, τά | ἐπιστολή, -ῆς, ἡ
• a line γραμμή, -ῆς, ἡ
• a jot, small serif κεραία, -ας, ἡ
• Chapter κεφάλιον, -ου, τό
• Verse, line στίχος, -ου, ὁ
• Vowel φωνῆεν, -εντος τό
• Consonant σύμφωνον, -ου, τό
• Period ἡ τελεία στιγμή
• Comma ἡ ὑποστιγμή | τὸ κόμμα
• Question mark ἡ ὑπερτελεία στιμή
• Semicolon ἡ μεση στιγμή | ἄνω τελεία
• Word; saying λόγος, -ου, ὁ
• Text τὸ κείμενον (the lying-before-you thing)
READING
• Open your book ἄνοιξον τὸ βιβλίον σου! (>ἀνοίγω I open)
• Close your book κλεῖσον τὸ βιβλίον σου! (>κλείω I shut)
• I read / am reading ἀναγινώσκω
• Read! ἀναγνωθί
• Passage (Selection) τόπος –ου, ὁ | περιοχή, -ῆς, ἡ | γραφή, -ῆς, ἡ
• Find (the passage) ζήτει…ζητεῖτε.... τὴν περιοχήν. (>ζητέ-ω I seek)
• Go to chapter ἴδε / ἴδετε τὸ κεφάλιον τὸ ____(number)____ (>εἶδον I see)
• Go to verse XX ἴδε /ἴδετε τὸν στίχον τὸν ____(number)___
• Start reading….! ἄρχου ἀναγινώσκων (m) / ἀναγινώσκουσα (f) (>ἄρχομαι I begin)
• Stop reading....! παύε ἀναγινώσκων (m) / ἀναγινώσκουσα (f) (>παύω I pause, stop)

REMEMBERING / FORGETTING / LEARNING
• I learn/ am learning μανθάνω
o I (just) learned (ἄρτι) ἔμαθον
• It escapes my memory αὐτὸ λανθάνει με. (λανθάνω I escape notice)
o It slipped by me (= I forgot it) αὐτὸ ἔλαθέν με
• I am forgetting it ἐπιλανθάνομαι αὐτοῦ
o I forgot it ἐπελαθόμην αὐτοῦ
• I (don’t) remember (οὐ) μνημονεύω αὐτοῦ
o I remembered it ἐμνημόνευσα αὐτοῦ
• Remind me! ἀναμιμνῃθητί με (let me be reminded) (>ἀναμιμνῄσκω I remind)
o Remind me! ἀναμέμνησό με
• I understand
o I got it κατέλαβον αὐτό (>καταλαμβάνω)
o I put it together σύνηκα αὐτό (>συνίημι)
• I know this! τοῦτ’ οἶδα
TEACHING
• I am teaching you διδάσκω σε
o I taught you ἐδίδαξα σε
o You taught me ἐδίδαξάς με.
ASKING QUESTIONS
• I put before you a question ἐρώτημα προτίθημι σοι (ἐρωτά-ω I ask)
• I ask you ἐρωτῶ σε...
o I asked you ἠρώτησά σε
• Answer the question! τὸ ἐρώτημα ἀπεκρίνου (>ἀποκρίνομαι I answer)
• Give me the answer! δός μοι τὴν ἀπόκρισιν (>δίδωμι I give)
• Say no more. σίγα!/σιώπα! | οὐ σιγήσει;
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Re: Greek equivalents for Classroom sayings

Postby David Lim » October 21st, 2011, 8:51 am

Haha I have a few questions:

• Pen/Pencil καλαμός, -οῦ, ὁ
Doesn't "καλαμος" refer to "reed / quill" or was there something similar to today's pens and pencils that were used at that time?

• Ink μέλαν, μέλανος, τό
Doesn't "μελαν" refer specifically to "black / black ink", or does it include inks of other colours as well?

• a letter (of the alphabet) γράμμα, -ατος, τό
• a letter (from someone) γράμματα, -ατων, τά | ἐπιστολή, -ῆς, ἡ
If the plural must be used for a non-alphabetic letter, why is the singular used in Luke 16:6?
δαυιδ λιμ
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Re: Greek equivalents for Classroom sayings

Postby Louis L Sorenson » October 21st, 2011, 11:13 pm

Modern Greek "ink" is μελάνι (Modern Greek 'black' is μαύρος). Modern Greek pencil is μολύβδι (>μόλυβδος / μόλιβος 'lead') -- the modern 'lead pencil' is a misnomer, since there is no lead in them, only graphite.

Wikipedia: The archetypal pencil may have been the stylus, which was a thin metal stick, often made from lead[dubious – discuss] and used for scratching in papyrus[dubious – discuss], a form of early paper. They were used extensively by the ancient Egyptians[dubious – discuss] and Romans.[1] The word pencil comes from the Old French word pincel, a small paintbrush, ultimately deriving from the Latin word penicillus a "little tail" — pincellus is Latin from the post-classical period.[2



Modern Greek 'pen' is πέννα. But it's not that far from using the main writing tool of the Koine era for the main writing tool of the modern. I like using the word καλαμός for 'pen, pencil, marker' because when someone reads an ancient text, they will know exactly what it means. That's the point of using Koine words for modern English equivalents or near-equivalents, anyways. If I use 'καλαμός' for any writing utensil that applies 'ink', my students will generalize the meaning. It is not a 'chisel'. Could it be a 'stylus'? I don't know. But they could get that from context. The point is to get students of Greek to use/hear the word, and use/hear it used it in its correct forms.

The word only occurs several(?) times in the NT, but the form is used thousands+++. The point is to get students to use words and forms - the mind will put it together (red 'ink' = red 'black-ink')? It will be understood.
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Re: Greek equivalents for Classroom sayings

Postby Barry Hofstetter » October 23rd, 2011, 5:40 pm

Thanks, guys, so far so good. I have Sprechen Sie Attich printed out and sitting on my desk at school! However, nobody answered the really burning question – how might you say "May I please got to the restroom" in Koine? :shock:
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Re: Greek equivalents for Classroom sayings

Postby Mark Lightman » October 23rd, 2011, 9:11 pm

However, nobody answered the really burning question – how might you say "May I please got to the restroom" in Koine?


Barry, have you been waiting this whole time to go? :D

δός μοι, παρακαλῶ, πρὸς τὸν ἀφεδρῶνα ἐλθεῖν.

ἐγὼ μὲν οὖν ἀπουροίην.

δεῖ με χρᾶσθαι τῷ λουτρῷ.
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Re: Greek equivalents for Classroom sayings

Postby Stephen Carlson » October 23rd, 2011, 11:19 pm

Mark Lightman wrote:δός μοι, παρακαλῶ, πρὸς τὸν ἀφεδρῶνα ἐλθεῖν.


Why δός and not, say, ἄφες?

Stephen
Stephen C. Carlson, Ph.D. (Duke, New Testament)
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Re: Greek equivalents for Classroom sayings

Postby Mark Lightman » October 24th, 2011, 9:13 pm

ἠρώτησεν ὁ Στέφανος,

Mark Lightman wrote:δός μοι, παρακαλῶ, πρὸς τὸν ἀφεδρῶνα ἐλθεῖν.


Why δός and not, say, ἄφες?


χαῖρε Στέφανε,

Yes, ἄφες also works well here. Thus the old Koine knock, knock joke:

κρούω δή.
τίς εἶ σύ?
Καιάφας.
Καιάφας τίς?
καὶ ἄφες ἡμῖν ἀπουρῆσαι.
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Re: Greek equivalents for Classroom sayings

Postby Mark Lightman » November 7th, 2011, 5:17 pm

how might you say "May I please got to the restroom" in Koine?


I wanted to make one more suggestion:

πέμψον με, παρακαλῶ, πρὸς τὸ μπάνιο.

μπάνιο, of course, it the modern Greek word for bathroom, with the μπ representing the b sound. Presumably the word is borrowed from a Romance Language.

I might use μπάνιο simply because it sounds good to my ears. One could give it a Koine form, βάνιον, so you can use it in the dative, or you can leave it the way it is.
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