AESOP

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AESOP

Postby Paul-Nitz » March 20th, 2013, 8:37 am

AESOP'S fables

Aesop might make some very good short stories for TPRS (with modification).
HERE are some initial thoughts to discuss in this thread about Aesop:


Where to get copyright free editions of Aesop's Fables. Are these all copyright free?

Which versions of Aesop are in Koine?
    I heard someone once (Solomon P?) mention that there were versions of the fables that were translated from older Greek into Koine.
What about this particular version? This very interesting old book is a triglot, English Latin and Greek. There are prayers and fables, selections of Lucian's dialogues and more. I sure wish I could read the book better. The pdf image is poor, but more troublesome for me is the script.
Shirley, J. (Shirleius): Εἰσαγωγή sive Introductorium Anglo-Latino-Graecum, complectens colloquia familiaria, Aesopi fabulas et Luciani selectiores Mortuorum dialogos in usum scholarum, Londini 1656.
http://www.vivariumnovum.it/edizioni/

I'll post an image of a page here to save you from a big download...
(ναι, οιδα ὅτι δεδεμενον θεῖναι εικόνας εν επιστολαις ἡμῶν.
απόστρεψον οφθαλμους ὑμῶν απο ἁμαρτιας μου.
θεις εικόνα ὡδε αἰτίαν εχω)
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Re: AESOP

Postby Jonathan Robie » March 20th, 2013, 12:50 pm

Louis had an Aesop reading group, his materials are here:

http://www.letsreadgreek.com/aesop/readingschedule.htm

Maybe that's a good place to start?

This is a pretty good collection of Aesop resources, including various Greek texts:

http://mythfolklore.net/aesopica/index.htm
ἐξίσταντο δὲ πάντες καὶ διηποροῦντο, ἄλλος πρὸς ἄλλον λέγοντες, τί θέλει τοῦτο εἶναι;
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Re: AESOP

Postby Andrew Chapman » June 10th, 2015, 10:10 am

Which versions of Aesop are in Koine?

I heard someone once (Solomon P?) mention that there were versions of the fables that were translated from older Greek into Koine.


Chambry 2 (http://mythfolklore.net/aesopica/chambry/2.htm)

Ἀγαλματοπώλης.
Ξύλινόν τις Ἑρμῆν κατασκευάσας καὶ προσενεγκών εἰς ἀγορὰν ἐπώλει: μηδενὸς δὲ ὠνητοῦ προσιόντος, ἐκκαλέσασθαί τινας βουλόμενος, ἐβόα ὡς ἀγαθοποιὸν δαίμονα καὶ κέρδους δωρητικὸν πιπράσκει. Τῶν δὲ παρατυχόντων τινὸς εἰπόντος πρὸς αὐτόν: "Ὦ οὗτος, καὶ τί τοῦτον τοιοῦτον ὄντα πωλεῖς, δέον τῶν παρ' αὐτοῦ ὠφελειῶν ἀπολαύειν;" ἀπεκρίνατο ὅτι ἐγὼ μὲν ταχείας ὠφελείας τινὸς δέομαι, αὐτὸς δὲ βραδέως εἴωθε τὰ κέρδη περιποιεῖν.
Πρὸς ἄνδρα αἰσχροκερδῆ μηδὲ θεῶν πεφροντικότα ὁ λόγος εὔκαιρος.


Ξύλινόν τις Ἑρμῆν κατασκευάσας καὶ προσενεγκών εἰς ἀγορὰν ἐπώλει seems to me like koine Greek - I am not saying it is, but it's the sort of thing I can understand, without too much difficulty. I was surprised by τινὸς εἰπόντος being genitive - though I can see why it could be - but I don't recall seeing anything like that. It seems quite suitable for those of us wanting to read outside the New Testament - although this may not have been Paul's original point.

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Re: AESOP

Postby Paul-Nitz » June 10th, 2015, 10:17 am

Thanks much for refreshing this post. I had completely forgotten about it.
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Re: AESOP

Postby Paul-Nitz » June 12th, 2015, 9:14 am

AESOP - SHIRLEY
James Shirley, the 15th century playwright, wrote a book titled, “ΕΣΙΑΓΩΗ: Sive, Intrudoctorium. Anglo-Latino-Graiecum. Complectense colloquia familiaria, Aesopi Fabulas, et Luciani Selectiores mortuorum Dialogos (1656), Jacobus Shirleius.

I can find nothing online about this book. I thought it might be good to write up a few notes for anyone searching for information on it. I wondered, too, if this post might illicit some help from others who might know more about it.

There is no introduction to the book and no contents. There is a second title page which I cannot decipher:
      EDOARDO AUREOLO,
      EQUITI,
      OPTIMO VIRTUTIS,
      In peſsima ætate,
      Bonarum literarum PATRONO
      ORNATISSIMO;
      Hanc perexiguam gratæ ſuæ mentis
      TESSERAM
      V. V.
      Jacobus Shirleius.
      A2

Each page has three columns, English, Latin, Greek. The English is written in old spelling (“God ſave you Sir.”). The Greek is running minuscule, but not a terribly difficult form of it. Since three languages are given, a page may have as little as 60 words, in one of the languages.

The first 42 pages are titled “Forms of speaking” (Loquendi formulai sive Colloquia - ΟΙΚΕΙΟΙ Διάλογοι). The “forms of speaking” offered are sometimes phrases, more often simple dialogues. This section is divided into six centuries, or groups of 100 lines. Each “century” is further divided by groups of ten. Here are some samples:

    God save you sir – Salve Domine – χαῖρε Κύριε. (pg. 1)

    What hour is it? – Quota est hora? – Πόσῃ ἐστιν ἡ ὥρα; (pg. 2)

    I am not dry. I have drank enough. – Non sitio. Satis bibi. – Οὐ διψῶ. Ἱκανῶσ ἔπιον. (pg. 6)

    Reverend Master, I pray give me leave to be absent from School at three oclock. I have some business to do. – Praeceptor observande, quaeso ut liceat mihi abesse Scholae hora tertia. Est mihi aliquid efficiendum. -- Ἀιδέσιμε Παιδαγωγὲ, δέομαὶ σου συγχωρῆσαί μοι τῆς σχολῆς ἀπεῖναι τῇ ὥρᾳ τρίτᾳ. Δεῖ γὰρ με ἐπιτελέσαὶ τι. (pg. 9)
The next section of the book is short, pages 43-63. It contains dialogues, I assume composed, between imaginary characters such as George and Luke. From the first dialogue.

    Geo. Are you well? Luk. Examine my countenance. Geo. You shoud rather bid me inspect your Urine. Do you take me for a physician? I do not enquire whether your body be in health, for your face speaks that well. But how you please yourself. Luk. Truly my body is sound, but my mind is not well.

    Γεωρ. Ὀυχὶ ὑγιαίνες; Λου. Εἰσόρα τὸ πρόσωπον. Γεω. Διὰ τί οὐ μᾶλλον ἄ οὖρον κελεύεις; Ἆράγε νομίζεις μέ εἴναι ἰατρόν; Οὐκ ἐρωτῷ, εἰ τῷ σόματι δύναμιν ἔχεις, καὶ γὰρ τὸ πρόσωπον αὐτὸ μαρτυρεῖ σε καλῶς ἔχειν. ἀλλὰ πῶς σεαυτῷ ἀρέσκεις. Λου. Τὸ σῶμα μου εὖ ἔχει, ἀλλὰ ἡμ ψυχὴ κακῶς διὰκειται. (pg. 43)

The third section of the book contains a selection of 40 of Aesop’s fables. I am uncertain what version of the fables he was using, perhaps his own. Here is one for a sample:

    The Lyon and the Frog. Λέων καὶ Βάτραχος. Ποτὲ, λέων ἀκούσας βατράχου μέγα βοῶντος, ἐπιστράφη πρὸς τὴν φωνὴν, οἰόμενος γέγα τι ζῶον εἴναι. Προσμείνας δὲ μικρὸν, ὡς εἴδεν αὐτὸν, κατεπάτησεν.
The final section contains 64 pages of exerpts from Lucian Dialogues of the Dead.

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Re: AESOP

Postby cwconrad » June 12th, 2015, 9:39 am

Paul-Nitz wrote:There is no introduction to the book and no contents. There is a second title page which I cannot decipher:
      EDOARDO AUREOLO,
      EQUITI,
      OPTIMO VIRTUTIS,
      In peſsima ætate,
      Bonarum literarum PATRONO
      ORNATISSIMO;
      Hanc perexiguam gratæ ſuæ mentis
      TESSERAM
      V. V.
      Jacobus Shirleius.
      A2

This is simply a Latin dedication of the book to an otherwise unknown Edward Gold/Golden/Gould(?) asserted to be a very good man and patron of the good arts in a bad era. It tells us more about the author, James Shirley, than it does about the book.
Carl W. Conrad
Department of Classics, Washington University (Retired)
ὁ ἀναγινώσκων νοείτω
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