McMaster & B-Greek

Questions and discussion about B-Greek policies or the B-Greek forum.

McMaster & B-Greek

Postby Jonathan Robie » May 25th, 2011, 1:25 pm

On Mike Aubrey's blog, he says I’ve never actually seen either students or professors from MacDiv participating in the discussions on the B-Greek list..

There are currently 15 comments discussing why. What can we learn from this discussion? Which things can a change of software help with? Which things might require a change in policy?
ἐξίσταντο δὲ πάντες καὶ διηποροῦντο, ἄλλος πρὸς ἄλλον λέγοντες, τί θέλει τοῦτο εἶναι;
Jonathan Robie
 
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Re: McMaster & B-Greek

Postby Mark Lightman » May 25th, 2011, 8:47 pm

Which things might require a change in policy?


We could have a section where theology and other topics which have hitherto been considered out of bounds would be allowed. People who are uninterested or offended could just stay out of this section. If a thread got closed, people resume it there.
Mark Lightman
 
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Re: McMaster & B-Greek

Postby Jonathan Robie » May 26th, 2011, 5:21 pm

Markos wrote:
Which things might require a change in policy?


We could have a section where theology and other topics which have hitherto been considered out of bounds would be allowed. People who are uninterested or offended could just stay out of this section. If a thread got closed, people resume it there.


I actually think the fact that we have not allowed this has been key to the success of B-Greek.

There are lots of places to discuss theology and such. And that kind of discussion tends to overwhelm real discussion of Greek.
ἐξίσταντο δὲ πάντες καὶ διηποροῦντο, ἄλλος πρὸς ἄλλον λέγοντες, τί θέλει τοῦτο εἶναι;
Jonathan Robie
 
Posts: 1454
Joined: May 5th, 2011, 5:34 pm

Re: McMaster & B-Greek

Postby cwconrad » May 26th, 2011, 5:52 pm

Jonathan Robie:
I actually think the fact that we have not allowed this has been key to the success of B-Greek.

There are lots of places to discuss theology and such. And that kind of discussion tends to overwhelm real discussion of Greek.


We have well over 1500 subscribers worldwide to B-Greek, most of whom never contribute anything to the discussion but are inactive onlookers. I don't know exactly what it is that they find useful in the list-discussions as currently regulated, but they evidently think it's worth subscribing. We have had a few egregious instances of individuals who have so much objected to our ruling out discussion of theological and hermeneutical issues that they have tried hard to bend or change the rules and, failing to do so, have left or been removed by administrators. I can't remember more than two handfuls at the most who fall into that category. My role at this point is only advisory, but I certainly wouldn't advise altering this policy.
Carl W. Conrad
Department of Classics, Washington University (Retired)
… ἐπειδὴ καὶ τὸν οἶνον ἠξίους
πίνειν, συνεκποτέ’ ἐστί σοι καὶ τὴν τρύγα Aristophanes, Plutus 1085
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Re: McMaster & B-Greek

Postby Louis L Sorenson » May 26th, 2011, 8:51 pm

Perhaps we can suggest a few sites where B-Greek discussions gone-theological can go to discuss things from a theological perspective? I don't know where that would be, but I'm sure there are a few sites which would qualify. My two cents are to keep a tight lid on theological discussions. It detracts from the Greek. Language can say almost anything in any way. Most interpretation comes from epistemological, theological, and hermeneutic assumptions, and not from limitations on the Greek text. It's just that people have a hard time separating the Greek from the rest. The result of a list which has gone beyond it's original intentions and has a loose control can be both the B-Hebrew list and one I had not heard of today call the Ancient Hebrew Poetry list http://www.ancienthebrewpoetry.typepad.com/.
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Re: McMaster & B-Greek

Postby cwconrad » May 27th, 2011, 5:44 am

Just to set the record straight, "Ancient Hebrew Poetry" is not a discussion list but rather is John Hobbins' own blog and its blog entries are directly controlled by the blogger. Blogs generally do invite reader comments, and such comments sometimes entail a good deal of dialogue about the original blog entry. I don't by any means agree with John Hobbins' perspectives on some matters, but I think his deeply-informed, often extensive essays (his specialty is Biblical Hebrew) are very thoughtful and provocative, although probably not everybody's cup of tea. But a blog is a personal sounding board that may invite dialogue; it is NOT to be confounded with a content-regulated well-moderated discussion list, where an initial post may be inappropriate for the list's parameters or a reply in the course of the dialogue may cross the line of the list's parameters and invoke other polemical responses. The extent to which any blog is wide-open to controversy is controlled by the blogger him/herself. Bloggers themselves and the blogs which they publish on the internet run the whole gamut of the good, the bad, and the ugly. I personally think that John Hobbins' "Ancient Hebrew Poetry" is one of the more interesting and useful among the dozens of existing so-called "Biblioblogs."
Carl W. Conrad
Department of Classics, Washington University (Retired)
… ἐπειδὴ καὶ τὸν οἶνον ἠξίους
πίνειν, συνεκποτέ’ ἐστί σοι καὶ τὴν τρύγα Aristophanes, Plutus 1085
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Re: McMaster & B-Greek

Postby cwconrad » May 27th, 2011, 6:21 am

llsorenson:
Perhaps we can suggest a few sites where B-Greek discussions gone-theological can go to discuss things from a theological perspective? I don't know where that would be, but I'm sure there are a few sites which would qualify.


I have often recommended Barry Hofstetter's BibExegesis list (http://bibexegesis@yahoogroups.com) to B-Greek list-members who wish to discuss background issues of general interpretation or theological implications of Biblical Greek (Hebrew, too) texts. Barry, as we well know from his posts on B-Greek and as a new Moderator here, is a knowledgeable and prudent moderator of BibExegesis, which is a well-oiled and hospitable environment for the kind of discussions that we have chosen to exclude from our own forum. I have no compunctions whatsoever about warmly recommending Barry's list as a venue for this sort of discussion.
Carl W. Conrad
Department of Classics, Washington University (Retired)
… ἐπειδὴ καὶ τὸν οἶνον ἠξίους
πίνειν, συνεκποτέ’ ἐστί σοι καὶ τὴν τρύγα Aristophanes, Plutus 1085
cwconrad
 
Posts: 1252
Joined: May 5th, 2011, 5:52 pm
Location: Burnsville, NC 28714

Re: McMaster & B-Greek

Postby Jonathan Robie » May 27th, 2011, 10:17 am

I just added this comment:

I’m the list owner for B-Greek, and I’ve been reading this with interest. And several of the leaders of the list have been participating here, I agree with what they have been saying.

We’re considering moving to a more modern format. I agree that listservs are an old technology, and that there are better choices today, including forum software. I’m fairly active on some phpBB forums and vBulletin forums, and I like that approach. We’re likely to change the software.

But do you think simply changing the software would change participation?

We have to decide who our target audience is. I think the people who want to focus on Greek are not the same people who want to focus on theological debate. And there are other places for theological debate.

A forum like B-Greek has one real advantage over The Refectory at Duke Divinity: people who aren’t at Duke can participate, and we can draw together experts from all over the world. We also have a disadvantage: we don’t serve Chicken Sausage Gumbo. I don’t think we can replace face to face contact for those who have it, but there are many people who don’t. And many people who want to talk with people beyond the circle that is geographically close.

Jonathan
ἐξίσταντο δὲ πάντες καὶ διηποροῦντο, ἄλλος πρὸς ἄλλον λέγοντες, τί θέλει τοῦτο εἶναι;
Jonathan Robie
 
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Re: McMaster & B-Greek

Postby Mike Baber » May 30th, 2011, 11:39 pm

Perhaps we can add a Latin section here, because whenever I need critical insight into a Latin text, I always want to come here first. But, unfortunately, I know Latin doesn't have a place here.
Mike Baber
 
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Re: McMaster & B-Greek

Postby Jonathan Robie » May 31st, 2011, 9:54 am

Mike Baber wrote:Perhaps we can add a Latin section here, because whenever I need critical insight into a Latin text, I always want to come here first. But, unfortunately, I know Latin doesn't have a place here.


I have no idea where people go to discuss Latin - but I don't think it belongs here.
ἐξίσταντο δὲ πάντες καὶ διηποροῦντο, ἄλλος πρὸς ἄλλον λέγοντες, τί θέλει τοῦτο εἶναι;
Jonathan Robie
 
Posts: 1454
Joined: May 5th, 2011, 5:34 pm

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