Aorist Active Infinitive of γινσωκω

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Aorist Active Infinitive of γινσωκω

Postby GlennDean » March 8th, 2012, 10:19 am

Hi:

I'm trying to parse the word γνωναι and Perseus, my Lexicon, and my Interlinear all say it's the aor act inf of γινσωκω.

Am I forming the aor act inf correctly:

"aorist active stem" + ειν (it's 2nd aorist active so that's why I'm using the ending ειν)

γνω + ειν (how does this become γνωναι)

Glenn
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Re: Aorist Active Infinitive of γινσωκω

Postby cwconrad » March 8th, 2012, 10:46 am

GlennDean wrote:Hi:

I'm trying to parse the word γνωναι and Perseus, my Lexicon, and my Interlinear all say it's the aor act inf of γινσωκω.

Am I forming the aor act inf correctly:

"aorist active stem" + ειν (it's 2nd aorist active so that's why I'm using the ending ειν)

γνω + ειν (how does this become γνωναι)

Glenn


γνῶναι is correct. There are, in fact, three different types of aorist: first or "sigmatic" aorist with active stems -σα-, second aorists of the "thematic" type with alternating -ο/ε- linking vowel between the stem and ending, and second aorists of the "non-thematic" or "athematic" type with stems in long vowels (short in the participles) to which endings attach directly. When I was teaching, I used to call these last ones "third aorists." For the active infinitive, the three types are exemplified in (1) ποιῆσα (ἐποίησα), (2) μαθεῖν (ἔμαθον), and (3) βῆναι (ἔβην).

You're trying to put a second aorist thematic infinitive ending on a second aorist non-thematic stem.

It would appear that you're trying to read texts before you've gotten all the morphology in hand. The ancient Greek verb is a sizable task to undertake; in some ways it's akin to obtaining a clear grasp of the political and geophysical arrangement of our planet. The good news: that is a finite task, and it can be accomplished.
Carl W. Conrad
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Re: Aorist Active Infinitive of γινσωκω

Postby Mark Lightman » March 8th, 2012, 11:50 am

I'm trying to parse the word γνωναι...


Hi, Glenn,

The text in question:

Mt 13:11 ὑμῖν δέδοται γνῶναι τὰ μυστήρια τῆς βασιλείας τῶν οὐρανῶν.


Method One: Τo you it has been granted to know the mysteries of the Kingdom of heaven.

Method Two: third aorist active infinitive of γιγνώσκω. Non-dislocated in middle position to topicalize it as the theme of the sentence.

Lightman’s Method Three: ὁ Θεὸς μὲν οὖν δίδωσι ὑμῖν τὴν γνῶσιν τῆς βασιλείας.

Robie’s Method Four: τὸ ἀόριστον ἐνεργητικὸν ἀπαρέμφατον. τὸ ρῆμα ἐστιν ἀκίνητον ἐν μέσῳ τόπῳ διότι ἀξιόλογον ἐστιν.

Carlson’s Method Five: In his interlinear, Glenn crosses out the English words “to know” and writes in the Greek words τὴν γνῶσιν τοῦ.
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Re: Aorist Active Infinitive of γινσωκω

Postby GlennDean » March 8th, 2012, 11:53 am

Thanxs for the info Carl!

I'm self taught in Greek so much of how I understand things is possibly incorrect (and it's showing LOL!!). May be it might be helpful if I explain how I would get the aorist active infinitive and then you could pinpoint where I'm going wrong?

1. Determine the "aorist active tense stem"

I looked at the 3rd principal part, which is εγνων, and broke this down into:

augment + "aorist active tense stem" + connecting vowel + "1p ending"
ε + γνω + o + ν (ωo contracts to ω)

I concluded that the aorist active tense stem is *γνω

2. Is it 1st aorist active or is it 2nd aorist active

I then went "if it were 1st aorist I would have seen the tense formative "σα", but what I see is the connecting vowel so this must be 2nd aorist

3. finally, form the aorist active infinitive

since it's 2nd aorist, the 2nd aorist active infinitive ending is ειν (if it were 1st aorist then ending would be σαι)

The formation of the 2nd aorist active infinitive is

"aorist active tense stem" + ειν
γνω + ειν

Glenn
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Re: Aorist Active Infinitive of γινσωκω

Postby Stephen Carlson » March 8th, 2012, 12:06 pm

Hi Glenn,

Carl's explanation is correct, and to my mind clear. If you're still struggling over it, I think it might be helpful if you could point out which reference works you're using and if I've got them I'll try to find where or if they discuss athematic second aorists--what Carl calls third aorists. (By the way, the Mounce primer does not discuss them at all as far as I can tell.)

Stephen
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Re: Aorist Active Infinitive of γινσωκω

Postby GlennDean » March 8th, 2012, 12:15 pm

I'm working off of "Basics of Biblical Greek" by Mounce. He outlines the infinitive endings in Ch 32 p. 307 (2nd Edition Mounce), and in Ch 32 p. 299 (3rd Edition Mounce)
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Re: Aorist Active Infinitive of γινσωκω

Postby Stephen Carlson » March 8th, 2012, 12:50 pm

GlennDean wrote:I'm working off of "Basics of Biblical Greek" by Mounce. He outlines the infinitive endings in Ch 32 p. 307 (2nd Edition Mounce), and in Ch 32 p. 299 (3rd Edition Mounce)


OK, thanks. I've got the 3d ed. of Mounce, so all my cites are to that.

It is true that p.299 of ch. 32 lays out a chart of infinitive endings that seems complete, but it is not. They are only for the so-called "thematic conjugation."

It is in ch. 34, p. 319 that Mounce introduces the concepts of a "thematic" and an "athematic conjugation" so all the forms prior to that belong to the thematic conjugation. On p. 323, Mounce briefly notes that the aorist infinitive of δίδωμι is δοῦναι. Note the athematic infinitive ending and how it does not fit on his earlier chart on p.299. On p.327 in ch. 35, Mounce lays out the infinitives of δίδωμι with two athematic infinitive endings διδόναι and δοῦναι with the "There are no surprises here." I suspect this note is in reference to the pattern of reduplication, not to the athematic infinitive ending.

You may get the idea from Mounce that athematic = μι verbs, but that's not quite correct because some verbs are thematic in the present but athematic in the aorist, of which γινώσκω and βαίνω are the most prominent.

Croy's first-year Greek textbook mentions the special second aorist forms of γινώσκω and βαίνω in a late chapter, but Mounce's does not. I don't have Mounce's book on morphology; perhaps he deals with these verbs there.

Stephen
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Re: Aorist Active Infinitive of γινσωκω

Postby GlennDean » March 8th, 2012, 1:03 pm

Thanxs Stephen! I would of never guessed that γινωσκω "acted" like a ui-verb in the infinitive!

Thanks to everyone for their help - I sure do need it!
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Re: Aorist Active Infinitive of γινσωκω

Postby cwconrad » March 8th, 2012, 1:13 pm

Mark Lightman wrote:
I'm trying to parse the word γνωναι...


Hi, Glenn,

The text in question:

Mt 13:11 ὑμῖν δέδοται γνῶναι τὰ μυστήρια τῆς βασιλείας τῶν οὐρανῶν.


Method One: Τo you it has been granted to know the mysteries of the Kingdom of heaven.

Method Two: third aorist active infinitive of γιγνώσκω. Non-dislocated in middle position to topicalize it as the theme of the sentence.

Lightman’s Method Three: ὁ Θεὸς μὲν οὖν δίδωσι ὑμῖν τὴν γνῶσιν τῆς βασιλείας.

Robie’s Method Four: τὸ ἀόριστον ἐνεργητικὸν ἀπαρέμφατον. τὸ ρῆμα ἐστιν ἀκίνητον ἐν μέσῳ τόπῳ διότι ἀξιόλογον ἐστιν.

Carlson’s Method Five: In his interlinear, Glenn crosses out the English words “to know” and writes in the Greek words τὴν γνῶσιν τοῦ.


"Method One" is, I suppose, "consult an English version, preferably an interlinear." "Method Two" is "consult a parsing guide and (if you know where to find it) Steve Runge's Discourse GNT or someone's gobbledygook." I don't see how any of these "methods" gets Glenn to where he wants to go, which is, I presume, ability to recognize this word or to guess intelligently how this particular verb-form (γνῶναι) is formed and how it relates to what he already knows about Greek verbs. IF that's what he wants, how does he get there? The old-fashioned way is to learn all the paradigms of the Greek verbs, including the formative elements, the roots, and the principal parts of all irregular verbs so as to be able to predict where to expect athematic second aorists ("third aorists"). Or, if one has a good grasp of the structure of the Greek verb, one can consult a good lexicon which will list at the outset the unpredictable forms of a particular verb and tell you what they are. Another alternative is to learn Greek in the first place as a spoken and listened-to, written and read vehicle of communication and so acquire γνῶναι as an item within one's repertory of elements of Koine Greek. But getting to that point of recognizing the form when one sees it requires more than consulting reference works; it requires the effort of learning the language, one way or another.
Carl W. Conrad
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