Joh 17,2 some questions on the sentence

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Stephen Carlson
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Re: Joh 17,2 some questions on the sentence

Post by Stephen Carlson »

Barry Hofstetter wrote:Well, this is all highly annoying. I think my reading of the text makes better sense out of the syntax, but I'll have to look at this more closely. As I tell my students, if everyone disagrees with you on your understanding of the text, then it's probably you, not them...
Probably, but not always. Occasionally the herd is wrong. Syntactically, the translations are like a triple-bank shot in pool: a lot of valid but marginal constructions have to line up just right for it to work.
Stephen C. Carlson, Ph.D.
Melbourne, Australia
Bruce McKinnon
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Re: Joh 17,2 some questions on the sentence

Post by Bruce McKinnon »

For what it's worth, Barrett in his commentary on John says that αὐτοῖς shows that πᾶν (even though neuter singular) refers to the disciples: by using the neuter singular John stresses the unity of the disciples ("the whole" rather than "all").
Barry Hofstetter
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Re: Joh 17,2 some questions on the sentence

Post by Barry Hofstetter »

Bruce McKinnon wrote:For what it's worth, Barrett in his commentary on John says that αὐτοῖς shows that πᾶν (even though neuter singular) refers to the disciples: by using the neuter singular John stresses the unity of the disciples ("the whole" rather than "all").
That strikes me as an over theological interpretation. Robertson discusses the use of the neuter singular (Grammar, p. 653)

Sometimes the neuter singular was used in a collective sense
for the sum total (cf. English "the all"). Thus, in Jo. 6:37, 39,
pa?n o! (5, 17:24 o!, where persons are meant.

And from Word Pictures, John 17:2

Whatsoever (παν ὁ [pān ho]). A peculiar classical Greek idiom, the collective use of the singular παν ὁ [pān ho] as in 6:37, 39 and ὁ [ho] in 17:24 and the nominative absolute (nom. pendens) with αὐτοις [autois] (to them), the dative plural explaining the construction. See Robertson, Grammar, p. 653.

I'm still not convinced, but I seem to be that lone voice crying in the wilderness.
N.E. Barry Hofstetter, M.A., Th.M.
Ph.D. Student U of FL
Instructor of Latin
Jack M. Barrack Hebrew Academy
καὶ σὺ τὸ σὸν ποιήσεις κἀγὼ τὸ ἐμόν. ἆρον τὸ σὸν καὶ ὕπαγε.
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