Luke 8:23 συνεπληροῦντο

Forum rules
Please quote the Greek text you are discussing directly in your post if it is reasonably short - do not ask people to look it up. This is not a beginner's forum, competence in Greek is assumed.
George F Somsel
Posts: 172
Joined: May 9th, 2011, 10:11 am

Re: Luke 8:23 συνεπληροῦντο

Post by George F Somsel »

Carl Conrad wrote:
μετὰ φόβου καὶ τρόμου τὴν ἐμαυτοῦ σωτηρίαν ἐλπίζω
OK, Soren. :D
george
gfsomsel



… search for truth, hear truth,
learn truth, love truth, speak the truth, hold the truth,
defend the truth till death.



- Jan Hus
Jonathan Robie
Posts: 4165
Joined: May 5th, 2011, 5:34 pm
Location: Durham, NC
Contact:

Re: Luke 8:23 συνεπληροῦντο

Post by Jonathan Robie »

cwconrad wrote:μετὰ φόβου καὶ τρόμου τὴν ἐμαυτοῦ σωτηρίαν ἐλπίζω.
Ἐπιστάτα ἐπιστάτα, ἀπολλύμεθα
ἐξίσταντο δὲ πάντες καὶ διηποροῦντο, ἄλλος πρὸς ἄλλον λέγοντες, τί θέλει τοῦτο εἶναι;
http://jonathanrobie.biblicalhumanities.org/
Thomas Dolhanty
Posts: 401
Joined: May 20th, 2014, 10:13 am
Location: west coast of Canada

Re: Luke 8:23 συνεπληροῦντο

Post by Thomas Dolhanty »

Jonathan Robie wrote:
cwconrad wrote:μετὰ φόβου καὶ τρόμου τὴν ἐμαυτοῦ σωτηρίαν ἐλπίζω.
Ἐπιστάτα ἐπιστάτα, ἀπολλύμεθα
Shines a light on what he meant by γρηγορεῖτε, doesn't it? While they were 'wide-eyed awake', and full of dread - ἀφύπνωσεν. On the other hand, when he was full of dread and very much awake - ἔρχεται πρὸς τοὺς μαθητὰς καὶ εὑρίσκει αὐτοὺς καθεύδοντας.
Matthew 26:38, 41 wrote:38 τότε λέγει αὐτοῖς• περίλυπός ἐστιν ἡ ψυχή μου ἕως θανάτου• μείνατε ὧδε καὶ γρηγορεῖτε μετ᾽ ἐμοῦ. 39 … 41 γρηγορεῖτε καὶ προσεύχεσθε, ἵνα μὴ εἰσέλθητε εἰς πειρασμόν• τὸ μὲν πνεῦμα πρόθυμον ἡ δὲ σὰρξ ἀσθενής.]
γράφω μαθεῖν
Stephen Hughes
Posts: 3323
Joined: February 26th, 2013, 7:12 am

Re: Luke 8:23 συνεπληροῦντο

Post by Stephen Hughes »

My thinking on ἀγρυπνεῖν and γρηγορεῖν has developed a little since last year. The similarity, I think between ἀγρυπνεῖν "forgo sleep" and γρηγορεῖν "stay alert / awake" is that they are both an act of will. If there is a difference, ἀγρυπνεῖν (ἀγρυπνία) can be for a self absorbed activity (such as prayer) - "want to sleep, but find something better to do than sleep", while γρηγορεῖν often means keep one's attention on what might happen - "really want to sleep, but stay awake despite the lingering desire to sleep". How does that seem to you?

FWTW: Another thing that could have been included with those lists last year is ἄυπνος, ἀυπνία insomnia - the desire to sleep, but inability to.
Γελᾷ δ' ὁ μωρός, κἄν τι μὴ γέλοιον ᾖ
(Menander, Γνῶμαι μονόστιχοι 108)
Thomas Dolhanty
Posts: 401
Joined: May 20th, 2014, 10:13 am
Location: west coast of Canada

Re: Luke 8:23 συνεπληροῦντο

Post by Thomas Dolhanty »

Lexical chains - teaching/learning packets/bundles. I haven't given enough thought to that. One does some of it spontaneously, in the nature of things, but how much more effective to plan it deliberately. Not only effective associations, but wonderful possibilities to make the task more interesting. Few things have been written, in my humble opinion, which are more interesting than Lewis Carroll's "Jabberwocky" - the Everest of nonsense poetry, speaking of strange associations!
Stephen Hughes » March 18th, 2014, wrote:Yes. There will be a few more steps after this:
• The next step is to go through Louw & Nida for each of the possible chains.
• The third step would be to think about what is (logically) missing from the set.
• The fourth is to look in Woodhouse (Attic) and the τριανταφυλλίδης λεξικό (Modern Greek) for possible things to fill in the gap. This is quite time consuming.
• The fifth is to check whether those possible words were used in the Koine period. This basically involves looking at the LSJ entry on Perseus and seeing which authours are quoted. It is a rough-shod approach at best.
• The sixth is to try to work out the possible relationships between the words by considering the contexts which they are used in, especially when when they are used together. This is a text-intensive stage with the most creative input from the compiler.
Paul-Nitz » March 18th, 201 wrote:Bear with me. Try this sentence out. The verbs and nouns are nonsense but the forms and structure are Greek. What can a person figure out in this sentence?

ὀνάνων τὸν γάρα ὁ μιπάκος ἐταμάγγασεν ὑπὸ τῆς μιτέκῆς.
cwconrad » March 18th, 2014 wrote:Well, we have a μπάκος who was ὀναν-ing the γάρα when he ταμάγγα-ed under the μπέκη. The problem is: ἐταμάγγασεν should be an aorist active verb but there's no object -- unless the γάρα is a common object of both ὀνάνων and ἐταμάγγασεν. Another problem: ὑπὸ τῆς μιτέκῆς looks like an agent construction, but that wouldn't work with the active verb form ἐταμάγγασεν, which is why I thought it's possibly something under which the action took place.

This is sort of like Lewis Carroll's "Jabberwocky" where we don't know what the nouns and verbs mean but there is nevertheless a reasonably clear narrative pattern.
That brief, but very interesting discussion from last year ought to be revisited.
γράφω μαθεῖν
Stephen Hughes
Posts: 3323
Joined: February 26th, 2013, 7:12 am

Re: Luke 8:23 συνεπληροῦντο

Post by Stephen Hughes »

Thomas Dolhanty wrote:That brief, but very interesting discussion from last year ought to be revisited.
If you've got something to add to it, you could always pick it up again and bring it back from what appears to be the dead.
Matthew 9:24 (cf. Mark 5:39, Luke 8:52) wrote:οὐ γὰρ ἀπέθανεν τὸ κοράσιον, ἀλλὰ καθεύδει.
Γελᾷ δ' ὁ μωρός, κἄν τι μὴ γέλοιον ᾖ
(Menander, Γνῶμαι μονόστιχοι 108)
cwconrad
Posts: 2112
Joined: May 5th, 2011, 5:52 pm
Location: Burnsville, NC 28714
Contact:

Re: Luke 8:23 συνεπληροῦντο

Post by cwconrad »

Stephen Hughes wrote:
Thomas Dolhanty wrote:That brief, but very interesting discussion from last year ought to be revisited.
If you've got something to add to it, you could always pick it up again and bring it back from what appears to be the dead.
Matthew 9:24 (cf. Mark 5:39, Luke 8:52) wrote:οὐ γὰρ ἀπέθανεν τὸ κοράσιον, ἀλλὰ καθεύδει.
Lordy, Lordy, these people with weird predilections for "necroposts"! No wonder zombies are so big in certain literary circles these days.
οὔτοι ἀπ’ ἀρχῆς πάντα θεοὶ θνητοῖς ὑπέδειξαν,
ἀλλὰ χρόνῳ ζητέοντες ἐφευρίσκουσιν ἄμεινον. (Xenophanes, Fragment 16)

Carl W. Conrad
Department of Classics, Washington University (Retired)
Thomas Dolhanty
Posts: 401
Joined: May 20th, 2014, 10:13 am
Location: west coast of Canada

Re: Luke 8:23 συνεπληροῦντο

Post by Thomas Dolhanty »

No interest in corpses here, but seminal ideas are always fresh. I mean, think of the mind-expanding, vocabulary building, expression enriching possibilities of relaying the Hunting of the Snark (http://literature.org/authors/carroll-l ... er-01.html) to a Koine Greek audience! Of being assigned the task to appear each day at ἡ σχολή in 2nd century Corinth with the next stanza from the Τὸ Σνάρκ! Seriously, who could resist checking every day to read the latest installment? And who could honestly say that “Ἰάββερβοκ” or "φρούμiους Βάνδερσνατ" was already part of his or her vocabulary?
Lewis Carroll wrote:`Twas brillig, and the slithy toves
Did gyre and gimble in the wabe:
All mimsy were the borogoves,
And the mome raths outgrabe.
I, at least, would never dare to touch that piece of genius, but …with apologies to the great genius, and to Greek grammarians everywhere:

Προσέχετε ἀπὸ τῶν Ἰάββερβοκ, υἱέ μου
Αἱ σιαγόνες αἵ δάκνουσιν, οἱ ὄνυχες οἲ κρατοῦσιν
Βλέπετε τὸ πετεινὸν τὸ Ἰούβιουβ, και ἐκκλίνετε
ἀπὸ τὼν ὁ φρούμiους Βάνδερσνατ

(http://www.jabberwocky.com/carroll/jabb ... wocky.html)

Jonathan's "stick around" is looking more prophetic every post!
γράφω μαθεῖν
Post Reply

Return to “New Testament”