RE: gennawing males

From: James Ernest (jernest@hendrickson.com)
Date: Wed Dec 01 1999 - 14:39:16 EST


Bart,
I probably shdn't bring the corrupting influences of the fourth
century into the conversation; naturally the Arian controversy
produced a need to distinguish more carefully between genhtos and
gennhtos. No need to get into that here.

But to the point of "Father" language: in Athanasius, gennao
with regard to the Son generally has to do with his relation
to God as "Father". E.g., in Contra Gentes 47:

   e)n au)tw=| de\ kai\ di' au)tou=, kai\ e(auto\n
   e)mfai/nei, kaqw\s o( Swth/r fhsin: )Egw\ e)n tw=|
   Patri\ kai\ o( Path\r e)n e)moi/: w(/ste e)c a)na/gkhs
   ei)=nai to\n Lo/gon e)n tw=| gennh/santi, kai\ to\n
   gennhqe/nta su\n tw=| Patri\ diaiwni/zein.

Also De Decretis 3.2, hitting highlights of the creed of Nicea,
Christ as gennhma:

   o(/ti mh/te kti/sma h)\ poi/hma mh/te tw=n genhtw=n
   e)stin o( tou= qeou= ui(o/s, a)lla\ ge/nnhma e)k th=s
   ou)si/as tou= patro/s e)stin o( lo/gos.

He also can use gennhsis where physical birth and
the mother are more in view, e.g., De incarnatione 33.3:

   Profh=tai me\n ga\r a)/nwqen peri\ tou= kata\ th\n
   parqe/non qau/matos kai\ th=s e)c au)th=s genome/nhs
   gennh/sews proemh/nuon, le/gontes: ")Idou\ h( parqe/nos
   e)n gastri\ e(/cei kai\ te/cetai ui(o/n, kai\
   kale/sousi to\ o)/noma au)tou= )Emmanouh/l, o(/ e)sti
   meqermhneuo/menon, meq' h(mw=n o( Qeo/s."

Later in De incarnatione (43.7) Athanasius quotes Plato using
gennao for the relationship of God to kosmos:

   Ei) ga\r dh\ kai\ o( para\ toi=s (/Ellhsi qaumazo/menos
   Pla/twn fhsi\n o(/ti o(rw=n to\n ko/smon o( gennh/sas
   au)to\n xeimazo/menon kai\ kinduneu/onta ei)s to\n th=s
   a)nomoio/thtos du/nein to/pon, kaqi/sas e)pi\ tou\s oi)/akas
   th=s Yuxh=s bohqei=, kai\ pa/nta ta\ ptai/smata diorqou=tai:

I think Athanasius might find "giving birth" too physical
a way of saying what the Father does with respect to the Son,
which is not unrelated to its suggesting "motherhood" rather than
"fatherhood" for God. I.e., he clearly theologizes "father"
language in a way that makes its use acceptable because he
finds "father" language in the biblical texts; but I don't
recall that he ever theologizes "mother" language in the same
way. Do you think the situation is different with Clement?

--But even if you can satisfy yourself that Clement is picturing
God as father rather than as mother, I would not use "fathered"
in the translation. To my ear it hammers home the gender of the
begetter which in the biblical text (and I expect in Clement) is
merely presumed. But "gave birth" is worse because it does the
same thing in the opposite direction, against the grain (I'm
guessing) of Clement's reading. I.e., it isn't a matter of what
we think we know about God, but of what we think Clement thought
about God. Right? It would be nice to find something better
than "have begotten you" but I haven't seen it yet.

James Ernest

-----Original Message-----
From: Bart Ehrman [mailto:behrman@email.unc.edu]
Sent: Wednesday, December 01, 1999 1:03 PM
To: Biblical Greek
Subject: gennawing males

   The reason I'm interested in GENNAW just now is because 1 Clement
quotes Ps. 2:7 (or, at least, quotes the quotation of Ps. 2:7 in Heb.
1).
Why *not* translate it: "You are my son, today I have given you birth"?
Is it only because we know that God is a man instead of a woman, and so
can't give birth? Seems like the logic of that could be pushed in lots
of
directions (e.g., the pressure points: "know," "man," "and so"). But
are
there other reasons?

-- Bart Ehrman
   University of North Carolina at Chapel Hill

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