On Sat 6 Oct 2001 (17:39:01), cwconrad@artsci.wustl.edu wrote: > or at least deScent. I quite agree with you on this one, Clay. It seems > to me that for TA KATWTERA to refer to the incarnation we would have to > assume the fully-dualistic cosmological conception of the created world as a > dark prison for souls never meant to dwell there. I would think to that > the genitive qualifier THS GHS should in this instance mean that TA > KATWTERA designates a region of the earth--and ought not to be viewed > appositionally as identical with the earth. ISTM that there is a parallel in Psalm 139:15 (138:15 LXX) OUK EKRUBH TO OSTOUN MOU APO SOU, *hO EPOIHSAS EN KRUFHi, KAI hH hUPOSTASIS MOU EN TOIS KATWTATW THS GHS*. Here the reference is clearly to gestation in the womb: the indispensible concomitant of Incarnation. So although Psalm 63:9 (62:9 LXX) has EISELEUSONTAI EIS TA KATWTATA THS GHS which can only refer to Sheol/Hades, this does not exhaust the possibilities for TA KATWTERA [MERH] THS GHS in Ephesians 4:9. If Christ's Ascension was from earth to heaven (from the Mount of Olives), then his Descent would logically be from heaven to earth (to Bethlehem), not from earth to Hades (at Calvary). Please excuse me if you've already covered this. I accidentally deleted the thread before reading it 8-( You're so right about the tanker trucksfuls of ink, Clay! ERRWSQH Ben -- Revd Ben Crick, BA CF 232 Canterbury Road, Birchington, Kent, CT7 9TD (UK) http://www.cnetwork.co.uk/crick.htm --- B-Greek home page: http://metalab.unc.edu/bgreek You are currently subscribed to b-greek as: [jwrobie@mindspring.com] To unsubscribe, forward this message to leave-b-greek-327Q@franklin.oit.unc.edu To subscribe, send a message to subscribe-b-greek@franklin.oit.unc.edu