RE: permaculture digest: October 14, 2000

["Catherine Jo Morgan" <cjmorgan@hemc.net>]

Thanks, Mindy.  Yesterday I started to do some finishing tests with the
acidic metal cleaner (phosphoric acid, zinc etc.) and realized I just didn't
want to use it any more.  So that solves that part of the rinse water
problem!  (I have a beadblasting cabinet so I can beadblast the iron, then
put on a finish right away.)

Am I really dealing with a "heavy metals" problem?  There's so much iron in
Georgia red clay soil to start with, it hardly seems that a little more
would hurt.  As for other metals - I don't use any cadmium or lead.  Only
use the aluminum cold - no soldering, brazing, or welding of aluminum.

The chemicals of concern to me in the rinse water are waterbased VOCs (I
think) - things like the dibuytl phthalate, and various glycol ethers.

Your description of treatment stages helps a lot.  It looks as if I could
really use an outdoor roofed area for the first stage - letting any sediment
settle.  Even a tarp would do.  Guess I'd better get a few more buckets.

And I like the idea of contacting Ga. Tech.  Thanks!

Cathy Morgan
reply to: cjmorgan@hemc.net <mailto:cjmorgan@hemc.net>


> -----Original Message-----
> From: permaculture digest [mailto:permaculture@franklin.oit.unc.edu]
> Sent: Sunday, October 15, 2000 12:02 AM
> To: permaculture digest recipients
> Subject: permaculture digest: October 14, 2000
>
>
> PERMACULTURE Digest for Saturday, October 14, 2000.
>
> 1. plant beds for treatment of rinse water from metal sculpture studio
> 2. Re: plant beds for treatment of rinse water from metal
> sculpture studio
>
> ----------------------------------------------------------------------
>
> Subject: plant beds for treatment of rinse water from metal
> sculpture studio
> From: "Catherine Jo Morgan" <cjmorgan@hemc.net>
> Date: Sat, 14 Oct 2000 13:50:12 -0400
> X-Message-Number: 1
>
> I'm looking for advice on how to use plants to clean rinse water of
> various VOCs like various glycol ethers, also sometimes very alkaline
> metal cleaners, other times acidic zinc/phosphoric acid metal
> cleaners.
> All the materials are waterbased, and the rinse water has a pretty low
> concentration of the materials.  It seems possible that the right
> selection of plants, in some kind of special treatment area,
> could clean
> the water from my studio before it reaches groundwater.
>
> I'm a sculptor, making iron and mixed media bowls.  I'm
> concerned about
> how to treat the rinse water from cleaning the iron and from
> washing paint
> brushes.  I'm using the least toxic materials I can find.
> Even so, there
> are chemicals I use that I'd rather not drink.  My studio is
> about 35 feet
> uphill from our well.  I have no septic tank, just pour rinse
> water into
> 5-gallon buckets.  I generate perhaps 2 to 4 gallons of rinse
> water a day,
> so I could carry it to a water treatment system a hundred feet or more
> from the well - if I had one.
>
> I'm located in the foothills of the Blue Ridge, in northeast Georgia.
> First frost is usually mid-October, last frost usually early
> to mid-April.
>  The land here is acidic, clay, covered with mostly
> hardwoods, some pine,
> with light undergrowth.  Not much of the land is cleared, and
> most of that
> is under the electricity lines.  But if sunshine is necessary, I could
> probably locate the treatment area in a sunny area.  There's
> just a lot
> more shady woods to choose from.
>
> I'd greatly appreciate information and leads on how to set up such a
> system, what to consider in designing it, what plants to use,
> etc.  All
> help will be much appreciated.
>
> ----------------------------------------------------------------------
>
> Subject: Re: plant beds for treatment of rinse water from
> metal sculpture studio
> From: "Kevin Topek" <ktopek@bellsouth.net>
> Date: Sat, 14 Oct 2000 17:24:34 -0400
> X-Message-Number: 2
>
> Sounds like you have a pretty complex waste water problem, and should
> probably use a few steps to minimize impact. Because you live
> in a pretty
> cool location, your biological treatment (plants) may have to
> be seasonal,
> so you should optimize your physical/chemical treatment options.
>
> Just like in industrial settings your first step should be solids
> separation. That is, you should have a primary holding tank
> to allow the
> particles to settle out. Depending on the specific chemical
> properties of
> the VOC's, they will either sorb to the solids, volatilize to
> the atmosphere
> or stay in the water. You may add some granulated carbon
> (charcoal) or some
> clay to the mix to drag out the organic bad guys.
> Alternatively, set your
> buckets out far away from you so you don't have to breath the VOC's.
> Organics that are water soluble will break down by bacteria in the
> water/soil along your treatment train. Allow the water to
> settle for several
> hours to days. Be careful not to mix too many different kinds
> of waste, lest
> they react and cause more problems. If you know the water is
> particularly
> acidic, you may want to add some baking soda. Because heavy
> metal chemistry
> is really complex, and even more so in the presence of
> fluctuations in acid
> and base, it is hard to predict the effect of further
> chemical additions.
> Just be observant.
>
> The water should then be decanted into the next treatment
> step. The settling
> tank can be drained periodically with the solids dried and
> disposed of as
> hazardous solid waste (another problem).
>
> Secondary treatment often includes some sort of oxygenation
> step. This can
> be spraying the water out like a fountain or some other
> bubbling, sloshing
> and mixing. You could then run the water through some sand,
> which would act
> like a filter to remove any left over particulate. Finally,
> the water can
> run through plants. I would suggest a warm damp area with
> some hearty weeds,
> less clay and more sand and gravel. Myriophyllum species may
> be good (water
> milfoil). Mustards tend to bio-accumulate heavy metals. Other
> than that, I
> would just look for plants that would grow, survive and are
> not edible. Most
> of the biological treatment will be done by bacteria in the
> soil/root zone.
>
> You may get better advice by contacting someplace like
> Georgia Tech Dept. of
> Environmental Science and Engineering. Check their web site
> for anyone doing
> physical/chemical/biological treatment of heavy metal waste
> water and send
> them your email. This is a cool little problem and may be a good class
> project for some aspiring environmental engineers. They may
> have something
> clever to say--maybe not, but it wouldn't hurt.
>
> Good luck, and remember, your little contribution is nothing
> compared with
> the Savannah River Facility in Augusta!
>
> Mindy Vanderford
> Research Assistant
> University of North Carolina Chapel Hill
> Dept. Environmental Science and Engineering
> Chapel Hill, NC 27599
>
>
> ----- Original Message -----
> From: Catherine Jo Morgan <cjmorgan@hemc.net>
> To: permaculture <permaculture@franklin.oit.unc.edu>
> Sent: Saturday, October 14, 2000 1:50 PM
> Subject: plant beds for treatment of rinse water from metal
> sculpture studio
>
>
> > I'm looking for advice on how to use plants to clean rinse water of
> > various VOCs like various glycol ethers, also sometimes
> very alkaline
> > metal cleaners, other times acidic zinc/phosphoric acid
> metal cleaners.
> > All the materials are waterbased, and the rinse water has a
> pretty low
> > concentration of the materials.  It seems possible that the right
> > selection of plants, in some kind of special treatment
> area, could clean
> > the water from my studio before it reaches groundwater.
> >
> > I'm a sculptor, making iron and mixed media bowls.  I'm
> concerned about
> > how to treat the rinse water from cleaning the iron and
> from washing paint
> > brushes.  I'm using the least toxic materials I can find.
> Even so, there
> > are chemicals I use that I'd rather not drink.  My studio
> is about 35 feet
> > uphill from our well.  I have no septic tank, just pour
> rinse water into
> > 5-gallon buckets.  I generate perhaps 2 to 4 gallons of
> rinse water a day,
> > so I could carry it to a water treatment system a hundred
> feet or more
> > from the well - if I had one.
> >
> > I'm located in the foothills of the Blue Ridge, in
> northeast Georgia.
> > First frost is usually mid-October, last frost usually
> early to mid-April.
> >  The land here is acidic, clay, covered with mostly
> hardwoods, some pine,
> > with light undergrowth.  Not much of the land is cleared,
> and most of that
> > is under the electricity lines.  But if sunshine is
> necessary, I could
> > probably locate the treatment area in a sunny area.
> There's just a lot
> > more shady woods to choose from.
> >
> > I'd greatly appreciate information and leads on how to set up such a
> > system, what to consider in designing it, what plants to
> use, etc.  All
> > help will be much appreciated.
> >
> > ---
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