Subject: Trumpets and the like

From: Bob Mueller <[email-masked]>
Date: Fri, 5 Jul 1996 09:54:12 +02

The brass musical instruments are impressive pieces of workmanship.  How are
these long, conical pieces fabricated?   They look seamless when finished.
     I have a job in which this sort of technology would be handy and I
suspect I am not alone!

                        Bob

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From: [email-masked] (Jim Shockey)
Date: 5 Jul 1996 08:38:03 -0700

>     I have a job in which this sort of technology would be handy and I

Hi, Bob. I recall seeing a television program on 
this subject. It was quite some time ago and I 
don't recall if it was on the Discovery or the PBS. 
I don't remember much of the detail, but the 
process was quite interesting to watch. I'd try 
some search engines. 

For the most part they are cylindrical and only 
become conical toward the business end. I don't 
remember how the tubes were made (seamless?) 
to start with; but, they filled them with something 
like beeswax when they started putting the curves 
into them. 

Will you give us a report on what you find? 

Good luck, 

--jim			<[email-masked]>

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From: [email-masked] (John Swensen)
Date: 5 Jul 1996 17:00:54 GMT

Every brass instrument I have examined is constructed of seamed, brass sheet
stock. If you look very closely at a the bell, you should be able to detect a
reddish line where the brass was brazed or hard soldered with a different metal.
(There is at least one instance of a pure silver trumpet from the Baroque period
in a museum somewhere in Germany, I believe).

The roughly cylindrical sections are made by cutting some sheet stock, forming
a rough cylinder, soldering, then placing it over a slightly tapered mandrel
and drawing though one or more holes in lead plate. Very subtle differences
in the taper can have dramatic influences on the tone and intonation of the
instrument.

For the more conical bell sections, a piece of flat sheet is, again, bent around
to meet itself and soldered, but then the piece is slipped over a mandrel and
either hammered or spun (or both) to shape. The best trumpets have one-piece
bells, but cheaper trumpets (and, perhaps, instruments with extreme flares like
French horns) have the flare section soldered to the more conical section upwind
of it.

Gentle bends are formed by filling the tube with pitch or lead and bending
over a form, although severe bends (like around the valves) may be made by
soldering stamped halves of the bend together.

After all the pieces are formed, they are soft-soldered together.
-- 

John Swensen, who once played baroque and modern trumpets
email to: [email-masked]

In article <[email-masked]>, Bob Mueller <[email-masked]> writes:
|> The brass musical instruments are impressive pieces of workmanship.  How are
|> these long, conical pieces fabricated?   They look seamless when finished.

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From: Fabo <[email-masked]>
Date: Fri, 05 Jul 1996 00:22:19 -0700

Bob Mueller wrote:
>                         BobThe actual process of bending is done by first filling the instrument 
with water , then freezing it.

Thats all I have to say about that !
Fabo
[email-masked]

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From: James Foster x2912 <[email-masked]>
Date: Fri, 05 Jul 1996 23:16:06 -0500

> reddish line where the brass was brazed or hard soldered with a different metal.

Actually it's usually not reddish, but rather a "brighter" brass
look to my eye. You can sometimes see the squares in the edge because
they're usually stamped out with a "square wave" edge in order to make
it easier to align the edges when hard soldering them.

> French horns) have the flare section soldered to the more conical section upwind

Actually a lot of good trumpets may have two piece bells, and french
horn bell sections are spun in one piece just like smaller instruments
are. 

> soldering stamped halves of the bend together.

Tuning slide crooks are, as far as I know, bent to shape just like
any other piece of the horn. Tuning slides are an assembly of the 
crook, ferrules, slides, and braces, so only the end pieces are involved
in getting a tight bend.

> After all the pieces are formed, they are soft-soldered together.

Pretty much, but the valve assembly is treated as one piece and the
pistons, connecting tubes, and tuning slide stubs are all silver
soldered together. The valve bodies also have their tubing silver
soldered in place.