Subject: Re: Building a Steam Boiler

From: [email-masked] (Chuck Sherwood)
Date: 6 Dec 1996 04:34:33 GMT

>Sounds like a lot of work.  Why not just get the boiler kit from PM research.
>Tom

Well, building the PM boiler is a lot of work too. It has flues which may
make it more work. It also uses tables for fuel which are not cheap.
They also start at over 100 dollars and I could build this one from scape
for very little. I would have to buy the heating elements, but the PM
boiler does not have any either.

chuck sherwood

-- 
--
Chuck Sherwood
[email-masked]

---

From: [email-masked] (Fitch R. Williams)
Date: Sat, 07 Dec 1996 22:24:24 GMT

[email-masked] (Chuck Sherwood) wrote:

>Hi Everyone.

>Ive been thinking about building a boiler for my PM engine #5. (5/8 bore)
>Yes, I know this is a project that should be approched with the greatest
>concern for safetly. Any good references would be appreciated.

<snip>

>What do you guys think?

>[email-masked]

Not to long ago Live Steam had an article about building an
electric boiler  exactly the uses you mention.  You might
consider reviewing that article to see if it would do what
you need.

Fitch

---

From: Elliot Burke <[email-masked]>
Date: Sat, 07 Dec 1996 06:01:20 -0800

Chuck Sherwood wrote:
> These are my thoughts.  I think that electric is the safest. No possible
> propane fumes to settle in my basement and get into the furnace.
> Also no flue tubes to install.
> 
> Grainger has some "cartridge" heaters intended for heating dies of plastic
> injection machines of some kind. Maximum sheath temp of 1600 deg.
> They come in sizes from 100-550 watts. 3/8 and 1/2 inch diameter by 4
> inchs long.  I think using a 300 and a 550 would give enough combinations
> (300, 550, 850 watts) to heat up quickly and then reduce power for running.
> Is 850 big enough? The only reference I have is a Jenson catalog. They use
> 450 watt heaters but their engines are smaller than mine. It would be easy
> to use a pair of 550 watt elements, but that limits the combinations to 550
> and 1100 unless some other form of power control is used like a Variac
> or a heavy duty light dimmer.
> 

Take apart an old coffee maker.  Inside is an electric heater with coils
for water that will make low pressure steam very nicely.  If you want to
dry the steam, use two of them.

Maybe you could use the exhaust from your engine to make coffee?

Elliot Burke
HighTide Instruments
[email-masked]

---

From: [email-masked] ("Paul C. Dickie")
Date: Fri, 06 Dec 96 23:37:50 GMT

>make it more work. It also uses tables for fuel which are not cheap.
                    ^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^

Couldn't one burn old chair legs, railway ties or whatever lumber is to hand?

That'd be cheaper...

-- 
< Paul >

---

From: Paul Pierce <[email-masked]>
Date: Fri, 06 Dec 1996 07:59:50 -0700

Tom wrote:.....
> Sounds like a lot of work.  Why not just get the boiler kit from PM research.

Sound like he WANTS to build a boiler...

Anyone with $$$ can buy one, how many build them?
Otherwise it's like hanging someone else's trophy bass on
your wall.

Actually I couldn't believe how fast my old pistol shooting
trophies and medals sold at my garage sale.

-- 
Paul in AJ AZ  NRA Endowment Member

Checkout the Metal Web News at:
new address (11/23/96)

http://www.ten.k12.tn.us/~wgray

Checkout the FAQ at:
http://PLAINS.UWYO.EDU/%7Emetal/index.html

---

From: "PyroWare" <[email-masked]>
Date: Fri, 6 Dec 1996 09:18:36 -0600

I have built the PM boiler... It goes together fairly quick.  I have never
run an electric model boiler, but from what I have read, they don't
deliver consistant pressure.  The PM boiler is easy to convert to
propane... buy at a garage sale a small, camping propane stove, and
cannibalize one of the burners (orifice too) which will bolt to the base
of the PM boiler.

If you do this project, I recommend you paint the aluminum base and
chimney castings with barbeque stove paint or black engine enamel.

Kurt Bjorn

---

From: [email-masked] (Tom)
Date: Thu, 5 Dec 1996 19:26:45 +1000

In article <[email-masked]> [email-masked] (Chuck Sherwood) writes:
>From: [email-masked] (Chuck Sherwood)
>Subject: Building a Steam Boiler
>Date: 5 Dec 1996 19:59:46 GMT

>Boiler: Vertical piece of 4 inch copper pipe. 4-5 inchs for water, 2 inchs
>(or more ?) for steam. The top would be a copper pipe cap. The boiler would
>have a pop off, sight glass and outlet. Water would be fed with a hand pump.

>Bottom: Copper stock 3/4 in thick. Partially turned to fit 1/2 inch inside
>4 inch copper pipe and silver soldered to it.  Two holes would be
>drilled to insert heating rods which would be silver soldered into the base.
>A heating rod would be a 5/8 copper rod reduced on one end to fit the hole
>in the base and silver soldered to the base. The larger diameter part of the
>rod would be inside the boiler. This way, even if the solder joint fails,
>the pressure cannot blow the rod out, because the hole is smaller than
>the rod. The heating rod would be drilled to the size of the heating
>element, which would be inserted into the rod. Heating element spec say
>the hole should be no more that 5 thou larger than the rod.

>One alternate that I have considered for the heating rods is to screw them
>into the bottom. I was thinking about using a 1/2 inch copper to iron
>pipe adapter. The heating rods would be soldered into the pipe adapter
>instead of directly into the bottom plate of the boiler. This would allow
>the heating rods to be removed if necessary. It might insulate the heating
>rods slightly from the boiler. I dont think this should be a problem.

>One person that I talked with suggested a seperator between the steam and
>water sections to keep the steam dryer. The seperator would be a round disk
>with a hole in the middle and tapered towards the hole so that the water 
>would drain back down. He also suggested a seperate heater for the steam
>section to dry the steam. This heater should not be powered up without
>steam pressure, or it will overheat. Any comments here?

---

From: [email-masked] (David William Jenkins)
Date: Sat, 07 Dec 1996 20:28:17 GMT

>> concern for safetly. Any good references would be appreciated.

Don't be too worried about boiler making. Yes, you have to take
care. However, if you follow the precautions of hydraulic testing,
followed by a check that the chosen safety valve will actually
keep the pressure down, then all will be OK.

If you have a local model railway society near you then go and make
some friends - this sort of boiler is peanuts to them, and they
will have knowledgable people who will offer advice and check your
work.  I'm sure that they'll also take a great interest in your
work. 

If you don't have a local society then look at the literature for
model locomotive boiler making - testing is ALWAYS covered.

David Jenkins              -- aka --             Lathyrus Computers Ltd
%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%

From jam@ olywa.net Tue Dec 17 14:02:21 EST 1996
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who cares?Magnus Paterson <[email-masked]> wrote:

>Brent Beal wrote:
>> 
>> NEKOEYES <[email-masked]> wrote:
>> 
>> >Beautiful Patchwork Quilts handmande with Aloha in Hawaii.
>> 
>> >From "Doll" size to Bed Size
>> 
>> >100% Cotton fabrics used
>> 
>> >Unique & Beautiful fabrics used
>> 
>> >E-Mail for details.
>> 
>> are they handcarved---hehehe

>Oddly enough, YES.  Well, not really, but a few visits ago, I bought
>my wife a trinket box made from koa (acacia) wood, which was carved
>with traditional Hawai`ian quilting patterns. Yeah, lookat me,
>I got LOTS of brownie points!

>Incidentally, I lurk on this NG for quilting info for my significant
>other; I prefer bobbin lace-making.  Really.  Honest; Torchon just
>now, but trying to learn Beds/Maltese.  I also drink beer,
>watch football (soccer) and listen to Steve Vai CDs.  Maybe I'm
>confused.

>Cheers,
>Magnus

>****  Magnus J Paterson           email  [email-masked]   
>****  Royal Observatory           ph     +44 (0)131 668 8247
>****  Edinburgh EH9 3HJ           fax    +44 (0)131 668 1130
>****  SCOTLAND                    web    http://www.roe.ac.uk/mjpwww/

---

From: [email-masked] (Michael Horgan [Lughaid])
Date: Sun, 08 Dec 1996 11:20:44 GMT

Glad to see I'm not the only one with a taste for Cappucino and Steam!
I did the same to try out my DODI for the first time!
>In article <[email-masked]>, [email-masked] 
>says...

>In the same vein, I have used a cappucino frother as a boiler for a small 
>engine.  (This is a DODI, built from plans in Modeltec.)  It has safety valves, 
>and can be run on the stove.  I cut off the nozzle, and extended it with some 
>silicone tubing I got from somewhere.  It seems to make about 10 PSI.
>
>Does that make it a Cappucino Choo Choo?
>

Michael Horgan ([email-masked])
http://users.aol.com/Lughaid

---

From: [email-masked] (Andy Dingley)
Date: Sun, 08 Dec 1996 11:30:07 GMT

The moving finger of [email-masked] (Chuck Sherwood) having
written:

>Ive been thinking about building a boiler for my PM engine #5. 

You need the book "Model Boilers and Boilermaking" (by Harris ?),
which was published years ago by one of the UK publishers (MAP ?
Argus?). It's a great book, full of historical detail on different
designs that have been used in full-size practice, techniques for
building your own, and even some reasonably detailed plans.

Great book, and an interesting read. Everyone should have it.

--
Andy Dingley                          [email-masked] 

ISO9000 :- A technique for perfectly managing the development
of a software product so inflexible and hidebound as to be 
completely useless.

---

From: [email-masked] (Kevin Heyes)
Date: 8 Dec 1996 12:37:53 GMT

>Ive been thinking about building a boiler for my PM engine #5. (5/8 
bore)
Try to get hold of:
Model Boiler Making - Pearce - ISBN 0 905100 13 1
Available from Tee Publishing
Regent Street
Hinckley
Leicestershire
LE10 088
UK

Model Boilers - M Evans - ISBN 0 85242 923 1
Probably available from Tee

Model Boilers and Boilermaking
K Harris
Probably out of print, my copy's 1967

Good Luck.

---

From: Abrasha <[email-masked]>
Date: Mon, 09 Dec 1996 01:09:30 -0800

Bryan A. Whitfield wrote:
> 
> Kevin, do you happen to have a phone number for this publisher?
> 
> Bryan
> Royal Oak, Michigan
> 
> Kevin Heyes wrote:
> >

I believe that the address that Kevin posted for TEE publishing is not the correct one. 
Check their Website at http://www.fotec.co.uk/mehs/tee/index.html to get the correct 
information, including phone and fax numbers.

The site contains hundreds of books available from them, which are hard or impossible to 
find in the US.

Abrasha
http://www.abrasha.com

---

From: [email-masked] (Mike Norton)
Date: 8 Dec 1996 02:45:04 GMT

>
>In article <[email-masked]>, Elliot Burke  <[email-masked]> 
wrote:
>Interesting idea. Would have to keep the steam oil out of the coffee though.
>Or we could use castor oil and mix brandy with it to counter its affects.
>(from the radial engine thread) :)

---

From: [email-masked] (Chuck Sherwood)
Date: 7 Dec 1996 06:00:13 GMT

In article <[email-masked]>,
>>make it more work. It also uses tables for fuel which are not cheap.

Opps sorry for the typo. That should be tablets. "little white things that
you hold a match to and hopefully they start burning before the match burns
your fingers" I have not used any for over 20 years, so what do I know..

I think your followup was quite funny. :) Im still grinning. :)
chuck sherwood

-- 
--
Chuck Sherwood
[email-masked]

---

From: "Bryan A. Whitfield" <[email-masked]>
Date: Sun, 08 Dec 1996 10:12:59 -0500

Bryan
Royal Oak, Michigan

---

From: [email-masked] (KEVIN HEYES)
Date: 9 Dec 1996 13:41:05 GMT

>> Kevin, do you happen to have a phone number for this publisher?
.>I believe that the address that Kevin posted for TEE publishing is not the correct one. 
>The site contains hundreds of books available from them, which are hard or impossible to 

Sorry, I wasn't thinking when I posted, fotec has loads of interesting links.
There they are in my bookmarks, but I've had toothache all weekend and it switched me brain off!

Cheers

Kevin

---

From: [email-masked] (Chuck Sherwood)
Date: 7 Dec 1996 15:15:00 GMT

chuck sherwood
-- 
--
Chuck Sherwood
[email-masked]

---

From: [email-masked] (Fitch R. Williams)
Date: Sun, 08 Dec 1996 20:32:25 GMT

>concern for safetly. Any good references would be appreciated.

<Snip good boiler discussion>

I went loooking and came up with some Live steam references.
September 1991 had an electric boiler by D. E. Johnson.
there was a follow up to that, modification of it, published
in the July/August 1995 issue.

I know there was another article about a vertical electric
boiler built to act as a test boiler or for running engines
for display but I can not find it at the moment.

Possibly another person has seen it and can give an accurate
reference.

Fitch