Mendele: Yiddish literature and language
______________________________________________________
Contents of Vol. 4.010
May 27, 1994

1) Hebrew grammatical constraints in Yiddish (Mikhl Herzog)
2) Names (H. Davidson)
3) Zishe, zushe, zisye, zusye, ziske, zisl (Dovid Braun)
4) Fonye, poplinik (Bob Rothstein)
5) German-Slavic conflations in Yiddish (Mikhl Herzog)
6) Superstition? (Mikhl Herzog)
7) Hebrew words in Yiddish (Avrom-Yitzkhok Blair)

1)----------------------------------------------------
Date: Thu May 26 11:37:43 1994
From: ZOGUR@CUVMB.CC.COLUMBIA.EDU
Subject: Hebrew grammatical constraints in Yiddish

As background for this query, I offer the following:

In its integration of words and phrases of Hebrew and Aramaic origin,
Yiddish overrides the grammatical constraints of the source language.
Several examples:

i) Hebrew feminine "shabbAt", plural "shabatOt", Yiddish masculine "der
shAbes/shabOsim".

ii) Hebrew masculine "beshatO", feminine "beshatA" 'in his/her time',
although spelled differently in Yiddish too, are both realized as Yiddish
"beshAte".

iii) Hebrew "avOt avotEYnu" 'our ancestors', which is clearly marked for
first person plural, but Yiddish "mayne, dayne, zeyere Oves-ovesEYnu.

I could go on. Thus far, however, I would generalize by saying that even
speakers with a sophisticated knowledge of Hebrew grammar will use the
cited Yiddish forms.

My query concerns one expression in which this doesn't seem to hold
today, perhaps because of increased knowledge of Hebrew grammar among
people learning Yiddish. In my own recollection it SHOULD apply, and I
seek possible confirmation from native speakers or others with similar
recollections of family usage. Thus,

Hebrew makes a gender distinction in the "rest in peace" formula as
follows:

Masc "alAv hashalOm", Fem "alEha hashalOm". Yiddish continues to spell
them differently but my own recollection is that we spoke of both "der
zeyde" and "di bobe" "olevashOlem" and NOT "di bobe olEho hashOlem".

What say you?

Mikhl Herzog

2)----------------------------------------------------
Date: Thu May 26 15:15:57 1994
From: IBIDHAD@MVS.OAC.UCLA.EDU
Subject: names

I posted this notice once before.  Those interested in Hebrew names,
their spellings, and by implication phonology, should go to rabbinic
texts on gittin. Start with Bet Shemuel commentary on Shulhan Arukh, Eben
ha-Ezer chapter 129 & the equivalent section in the Lebush. Then use the
subject command on good computerized library catalogue.  UCLA's computer
brought up several dozen items of which about a dozen were informative
when I needed a name.  Among the works that I remember were helpful were
one by S. Ganzfried (best know for his Qissur Shulhan Arukh) and one by a
European-American rabbi at turn of century named Aharon Gordon.

H. Davidson

3)----------------------------------------------------
Date: Thu May 26 15:47:23 1994
From: dovid@MIT.EDU
Subject: zishe, zushe, zisye, zusye, ziske, zisl

These names may be related to the Talmudic Aramaic name Zusya.  If so,
the male names are not related to _zis_ 'sweet' (and are therefore not
glossed as such by Harkavy) but the female names zisl, zisle, and zise
ARE.

Dovid Braun

4)----------------------------------------------------
Date: Thu May 26 16:49:06 1994
From: rar@slavic.umass.edu
Subject: Fonye, poplinik

Rising to Michael Alpert's challenge, I'll offer my two-cents' worth
(also known as wild speculation) in re _fonye_.  If the word originally
referred to a Russian soldier and only later expanded metonymically to
refer to the tsar or too any Russian, then it might be connected with the
Russian _soldafon_, a disparaging term for a boorish soldier.  Vasmer's
etymological dictionary connects _soldafon_ (from _soldat_ 'soldier')
with one of the Russian names that has been cited in the discussion of
_fonye_ here, namely, Agafon.  Vasmer also cites _mitrofon/mitrofonia_, a
non- standard term for sailor (cf. the name Mitrofan).

On another word:  Larry Rosenwald asked (4.006) about Peretz's use of the
expression "tsufallen vi tsu a heysn poplinik."  Stutchkoff gives the
form _popelnik_, which suggests an association with the Slavic word for
ashes. I've found a Belorussian term from the Pinsk area _paplonik_, said
to be related to Polish _podp/lomyk_ 'a kind of flat bread or pancake
baked on the coals'.  BTW, Stutchkoff gives as a synonym "tsufaln vi tsu
heyse lokshn."

Bob Rothstein

5)----------------------------------------------------
Date: Thu May 26 18:36:36 1994
From: ZOGUR@CUVMB.CC.COLUMBIA.EDU
Subject: German-Slavic conflations in Yiddish

Meyshke Alpert: "makhn mit der hant" meaning 'to wave' is certainly a
conflation. Other likely ones are "khapn" (if it were strictly Slavic,
you'd expect a thematic 'e' in the paradigm), similarly "goln";
regionalloy a few nouns: "hleym" (hard to say, no?) "nyest". Others?

Mikhl Herzog

6)----------------------------------------------------
Date: Thu May 26 18:59:09 1994
From: ZOGUR@CUVMB.CC.COLUMBIA.EDU
Subject: Superstition?

Rick Gildemeister: The Litvish euphemism "avu veynstu" 'where do you
live?' was not a feature of class. Rather than think of it as a
consequence of superstition, it's probably more fruitful to see it as a
consequence of linguistic change, in this case of phonological change
(the merger of oy and ey) on lexical choice. Litvish shows a similar
change, resulting from Litvish Yiddish merger of "s" and "sh" is the pair
"fisnoge" 'feet, legs' and "fisribe 'fish'. There is no shortage of
examples of these entailed changes.

Mikhl Herzog

7)----------------------------------------------------
Date: Thu May 26 23:40:41 1994
From: ablair@bottom.magnus.acs.ohio-state.edu
Subject: Hebrew words in Yiddish

I am a rather elderly (65 yor alt) graduate student in Yiddish at Ohio
State University.  One of the toughest things for me to learn is to read
and pronounce Hebrew words in Yiddish.  I have heard that there is at
least one book dealing with this.  Can anyone steer me to such a book and
tell me where to buy it?

Allan E. Blair (Avrom Yitzkhok)

______________________________________________________
End of Mendele Vol. 4.010

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