Mendele: Yiddish literature and language ______________________________________________________ Contents of Vol. 4.255 December 31, 1994 1) Gefonfet (Evelyn Feins) 2) Davenen (Khayem Bochner) 3) Seyg (Herbert Davidson) 4) Zhe (Zellig Bach) 5) Lemberg/Lemberik (Bob Rothstein) 6) Wish for the New Year (Louis Fridhandler) 1)---------------------------------------------------- Date: Fri, 30 Dec 94 16:40:00 UTC From: m.feins@genie.geis.com Subject: Gefonfet I must agree with Abe Bloom (Mendele 4-284) that gefonfet is equivalent to the expression "muttered in his beard." My parents, two people with very opposing viewpoints, would read the Forvitz in the evening and have discussions on every topic. When my mother ran out of a logical reply, she would start to hum and my father would say "in beardl aron". Now, after all these years, I realize he was saying she lost the argument, and was fonfenen. :-) Evelyn Feins 2)---------------------------------------------------- Date: Fri, 30 Dec 94 12:08:16 -0500 From: bochner@das.harvard.edu Subject: Davenen Anno Siegel: Most likely an entirely different word, i.e. "gedabert". "dabern" is loshn-koydesh word; Weinreich says: 'babble, (contemptuous) talk', which seems to fit your context pretty well. The trilled "r" is presumably a stylistic nuance of Bikel's, adding the stigma of the less-common version of "r" to the stigma of the word. Khayem Bochner 3)---------------------------------------------------- Date: Fri, 30 Dec 94 11:16 PST From: ibidhad@mvs.oac.ucla.edu Subject: Seyg [Mikhl Herzog:] Could "seyg" be an abbreviated form of our old friend "shegets"? Herbert Davidson 4)---------------------------------------------------- Date: Fri, 30 Dec 1994 14:34:36 -0500 From: zellig@aol.com Subject: Zhe Dialogue between Ellen Prince and the undersigned: Zellig Bach (quoted by Ellen Prince): "_Zhe_ is not a word in its own right, nor is it a suffix. It cannot begin or end a sentence. Nor can it stand alone. Unlike marine barnacles that attach themselves permanently to ship bottoms or floating timber, _zhe_ is a "floater," and is usually tacked on to one or another word, according to the speaker's choice, occasion, and mood" (from Mendele, Vol. 4.251, 2). Ellen Prince: That's what it means to be a particle or a clitic, which is what we've been calling it. Z.B. Yes, but _der khilek_ [the difference] is that what I wrote can be understood by many, while particle or clitic is understood by specialists only. Linguists need, of course, a precise and concise terminology, but I wonder: Could not the two styles be combined where a general readership is concerned? End of dialogue (reprinted with permission). As I stated on several previous occasions, I sense in the Mendele khavruse a strong, unquenchable desire to learn Yiddish--grammar, syntax, etymology, history. It should therefore be helpful if specialists, when using technical, or even semi-technical terms, would explain them, if I may say in "chewable" prose, for lay members on our list (and I count myself among them). By way of example: In his recent column _On Language_ in the New York Times Magazine (12/25/94), William Safire used the term "enclitic," and promptly explained it: "An 'enclitic' is an attachable word-element, like a suffix, from the Greek _klit_, slope." Although I believe I defined _zhe_ correctly in non-technical terms, as shown in Ellen's quotation from my posting and in her comment, Safire's explanation of 'enclitic" helped me even to get a better grasp of 'clitic.' I firmly believe that the suggestion to explain technical terms should, in the long run, be reciprocally beneficial. Zellig Bach 5)---------------------------------------------------- Date: Thu, 29 Dec 1994 22:01:12 -0500 (EST From: rar@slavic.umass.edu Subject: Lemberg/Lemberik In a previous posting I called Lemberg the Yiddish and German name for Lviv/Lvov/Lwow. According to Dr. Mordkhe Schaechter (_Laytish mame-loshn_, vol. 1, pp. 34-35), however, there is a tradition for using the form _Lemberik_ as the Yiddish name and considering _Lemberg_ as an unnecessary Germanism in Yiddish, i.e., as being _daytshmerish_. Al kheyt... Bob Rothstein 6)---------------------------------------------------- Date: 30 Dec 94 16:21:40 EST From: 74064.1661@compuserve.com Subject: Wish for the New Year Convention? This electronic phenomenon is a kind of convention. Mendele is a meeting ground for a wide range of personal involvement with Yiddish language and literature. A healthy variety. Now at this latter end of 1994, I wish all on Mendele a freylekhn, a gliklekhn nayem sekularn yor. Anshot "New Year's Resolutions" vil ikh tsugebn epes andersh. I'd like to share an impression, and a wish. Impression: I see many introductions, but not so many follow through with contributions. Some seem to be intimidated by those who display great depth of knowledge and insight. Wish: More participation by learners at all levels. I want to see more. Let's have contributions, more questions, more trials, and (inevitably) more errors. Let the errors fall where they may. I will hope for corrections of my own. That never feels particularly good, but so what! The errors will get straightened out, the ruffled feathers soothed. Advice is not always welcome, it may even at times be erroneous. But questions, questions, trials and errors make for interactions that transmute lead into gold. Sometimes I feel we are in a desperate struggle for survival, but Yiddish language and literature has a number of vigorous allies. Sometimes that feeling of struggle against great odds gives way to a glorious sense of victory against all odds. Listen to the fourth movement of Beethoven's Fifth Symphony, or the coda of his Egmont overture, and you'll know what I mean. The more introductions, the better I feel. Best of all, when the new people participate. Louis Fridhandler [A fine way to end a forgettable year. Best wishes to all from the shames. nm] ______________________________________________________ End of Mendele Vol. 4.255 Mendele has 2 rules: 1. Provide a meaningful Subject: line 2. 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