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From: U001295@HNYKUN11.URC.KUN.NL (R. Schalk)
To: riscy@pyramid.com
Subject: MIPS 4000 cheaply!!!!
Date: Thu, 01 Jul 93 22:34:52 MET
Organization: Universitair Centrum Informatievoorziening
Status: RO
X-Status: 

For those of you guys that cannot read netnews: I picked up this in c.o.l.
Read it good, maybe the R4K2 becomes a viable alternative, the only problem
I see is that it works at 3V and the price 55$ is great in comparison
to the R3K, I guess we should wonder if the R3K doesn't become obsolete.
I mean how long will it be produced, the same is happening now with the
386sx and 386dx, they are either out of production, or soon to be dropped.
I'm totally guessing now, but how long does this project take, half a year?
I guess that's not discussed yet, I believe.

Ronald Schalk

>Here is a news article from Byte Magazine,
>July 1993, p28.  Copyright (c) 1993 by McGraw-Hill, Inc.
>
>LOW-POWER RISC FROM MIPS
>
>Promising "Pentium performance in a notebook,"
>Mips Technologies (Mountain View, CA) has announced
>the first power-saving chip in its R4000
>microprocessor family, an important step toward
>moving RISC chips from workstations to mainstream PCs.
>The R4200 is intended primarily for laptops that
>can run Windows NT.
>  Sample silicon wasn't available at press time, so
>all performance specifications are preliminary.
>According to Mips, the 3-V chip will use only 1.5 W at
>its top internal clock speed of 80 MHz (the external
>bus runs at 40 MHz).  A reduced-power mode
>requires only 0.4 W, and a power-down mode turns
>off the chip altogether.  Mips says the R4200 can be
>powered down and reactivated so quickly that a
>system could force the chip into power-down mode
>between keystrokes when you're typing.
>  Mips estimates the R4200 will deliver 55 SPECmarks
>for integer operations (SPECint92) and 30 SPECmarks
>for floating-point operations (SPECfp92).
>By contrast, Intel's Pentium delivers
>64.5 SPECint92 and 56 SPECfp92, respectively.
>The R4200 lacks the parallel pipelines found in
>the Pentium, but it does have separate hardware units
>for integer and floating-point instructions.
>  Based on 0.6-micron process technology, the
>R4200 squeezes 1.3 million transistors onto a small
>die of 9.2 by 9.8 millimeters.  It has a 16-KB
>instruction cache and an 8-KB data cache.  The caches,
>MMU (memory management unit), and system interface
>can be removed from the chip, so the logic
>core can be used in embedded applications.
>  Mips says the R4200 will be available in quantity
>late this year.  Versions will be manufactured by
>Mips, NEC Electronics, and possibly other partners.
>No pricing was announced, but Mips says the goal
>is to sell the chip for $55, or $1 per SPECint.
>                     -- Tom R. Halfhill
>(transcription and posting by Larry Doolittle doolittle@cebaf.gov)
>(I actually got written permission from Byte to post this!)
>
Greetings Ronald Schalk


 ********************************************************************
 * ing. Ronald Schalk                                               *
 * sectie COOS                                                      *
 * Universitair Centrum Informatievoorziening (UCI)                 *
 * Katholieke Universiteit Nijmegen (KUN)                           *
 * e-mail : R.Schalk@uci.kun.nl   snailmail: Geert Grooteplein 41   *
 * tel.   : +31 80 617993                    6525 GA Nijmegen       *
 * fax   :  +31 80 617979                    Nederland              *
 ********************************************************************


 
From caret@pyramid.com  Ukn Jul  1 17:31:45 1993
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From: caret@pyramid.com (Neil Russell)
Message-Id: <9307012129.AA15988@sword.eng.pyramid.com>
Subject: Re: MIPS 4000 cheaply!!!!
To: riscy@pyramid.com
Date: Thu, 1 Jul 93 14:29:36 PDT
In-Reply-To: <9307012117.AA20959@gossip.pyramid.com>; from "R. Schalk" at Jul 1, 93 10:34 pm
X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.3 PL11]
Status: RO
X-Status: 

> I see is that it works at 3V and the price 55$ is great in comparison
> to the R3K, I guess we should wonder if the R3K doesn't become obsolete.
> I mean how long will it be produced, the same is happening now with the
> 386sx and 386dx, they are either out of production, or soon to be dropped.
> I'm totally guessing now, but how long does this project take, half a year?
> I guess that's not discussed yet, I believe.


As I understand it, 3.3V and 5V stuff have the same histeresis levels,
so can interface directly.  If that is not the case, there is certainly
parts around that are designed to interface 3.3V to 5V.

$55 is probably in very large quantities.  We could probably expect to
pay a lot more.  Still it may be no more than the $300 we are expecting
to pay for the 3081E.

If we use this chip, we will have to put this project on hold for 6 months
at least.  However, given the problems I'm having trying to get hold
of info and stock of the IDT 3730, we might have to do this anyhow.
Details on the IDT 3730 will follow soon.

-- 
Neil Russell		(The wizard from OZ)
Pyramid Technology			Email:  caret@pyramid.com
3860 N. First Street			Voice:  (408) 428-7302
San Jose, CA 95134-1702			  FAX:  (408) 428-8845

 
From drew@juliet.cs.Colorado.EDU  Ukn Jul  1 17:46:15 1993
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To: caret@pyramid.com (Neil Russell)
Cc: riscy@pyramid.com
Subject: Re: MIPS 4000 cheaply!!!! 
In-Reply-To: Your message of "Thu, 01 Jul 1993 14:29:36 PDT."
             <9307012129.AA15988@sword.eng.pyramid.com> 
Date: Thu, 01 Jul 1993 15:43:46 -0600
From: Drew Eckhardt <drew@juliet.cs.Colorado.EDU>
Status: RO
X-Status: 


    As I understand it, 3.3V and 5V stuff have the same histeresis levels,
    so can interface directly.  If that is not the case, there is certainly
    parts around that are designed to interface 3.3V to 5V.

Many of our other chips (ie, the NS UARTs, 8390, etc) are available
in 5V only.  How hard is it to interface 3.3 to 5V?  Is the R4200
available in 5V?  What about pricing on other MIPS R4000 series
chips with a reduced bus?
    

 
From caret@pyramid.com  Ukn Jul  1 18:20:35 1993
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From: caret@pyramid.com (Neil Russell)
Message-Id: <9307012218.AA26080@sword.eng.pyramid.com>
Subject: Re: MIPS 4000 cheaply!!!!
To: riscy@pyramid.com
Date: Thu, 1 Jul 93 15:18:27 PDT
In-Reply-To: <199307012143.AA18446@juliet.cs.Colorado.EDU>; from "Drew Eckhardt" at Jul 1, 93 3:43 pm
X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.3 PL11]
Status: RO
X-Status: 

>     As I understand it, 3.3V and 5V stuff have the same histeresis levels,
>     so can interface directly.  If that is not the case, there is certainly
>     parts around that are designed to interface 3.3V to 5V.
> 
> Many of our other chips (ie, the NS UARTs, 8390, etc) are available
> in 5V only.  How hard is it to interface 3.3 to 5V?  Is the R4200
> available in 5V?  What about pricing on other MIPS R4000 series
> chips with a reduced bus?

3.3V is to reduce power consumption, which in turn allows the CPU to go
faster.  The top of the line R4200 would only be available in 3.3V.

The *only* information I have on this is the article that was posted
here in this list.  I will (probably next week) try to get information
out of MIPS (SGI).  Last time I called SGI though, it was a nightmare.

-- 
Neil Russell		(The wizard from OZ)
Pyramid Technology			Email:  caret@pyramid.com
3860 N. First Street			Voice:  (408) 428-7302
San Jose, CA 95134-1702			  FAX:  (408) 428-8845

 
From tor@tss.no  Ukn Jul  2 10:20:26 1993
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From: tor@tss.no (Tor Arntsen)
Date: Fri, 2 Jul 1993 16:13:32 +0200
X-Mailer: Mail User's Shell (7.2.5 10/14/92)
To: riscy@pyramid.com
Subject: Re: MIPS 4000 cheaply!!!!
Status: RO
X-Status: 

On Jul 1, 10:34pm, R. Schalk wrote:
> Subject: MIPS 4000 cheaply!!!!
[you've already read it]

I would love to have a R4 (I could keep the box longer before it gets
obsolete), but it's up to those who will actually do the board design
(and that's not me) to decide if it is too much trouble to handle 64 bit
or not.

Tor	(tor@tss.no, on vacation mid-July to mid-August, not reading mails)


 
