From DING@vaxld.ameslab.gov  Sun Apr  3 23:01:24 1994
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Date: Sun, 03 Apr 1994 22:59:20 -0600 (CST)
From: DING@vaxld.ameslab.gov
Subject: Re: Memo #6 Reimbursement for Bai Yan and Quarterly Financial Report
To: labhgz@unix.cc.emory.edu
Cc: council-l@ifcss.org, ifcss@wam.umd.edu
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Dear Changsheng and HQ staff,                                          
                                                                       
As for Bai Yan's reimbursement, I think I have sent the paperwork to   
the HQ twice, one addressed to the treasurer, the other to Changsheng  
by certified mail.                                                     
                                                                       
To make sure everything is right, I have sent out another copy of 
Bai Yan's air ticket to you for reference. If I could be of any 
further assistance in regard of this matter, please feel free to
let me know.


Yungui Ding

From ifcss@wam.umd.edu  Tue Apr  5 17:32:51 1994
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From: IFCSS HQ <ifcss@wam.umd.edu>
Message-Id: <199404052230.AA29442@rac4.wam.umd.edu>
To: chair@ifcss.org, council-l@ifcss.org
Subject: Proposal for hosting 6th IFCSS Congress
Status: O


Hi SongYun,
	I am forwarding this proposal again, and hopefully I will get
answer back as soon as possbile. I can't let the housing office hold
the rooms for a long period time, cause they are running on very high
occupation rate during summer time.

Thank you for your consideration!

Regard,
Xiang Liu


Hi SongYun,
	The fellowing is our proposal for hosting 6th IFCSS Congress at
San Francisco Bay Area. Thank you for your consideration and I am looking
forward to hear from you soon.

Regard,
Xiang Liu

--------------------------------------------------------------------

	Application for Hosting 6th IFCSS Congress at San Francisco
			Bay Area

Hosts:	
	University of San Francisco
	San Francisco State University
	City College of San Francisco 
	San Jose State University
	City College of San Jose
	California State University, Hayward
	University of California at Berkeley

Time:
	July 1 - July 4, 
	Friday	- Monday, long weekends of Independt Day 

Transportation:

	There are three major international airport in S.F. Bay Area.
in less than 50 miles radius.

	San Francisco International Airport :
		--- 	Major international and national air hub.
		---	25 minutes to hosting campus. 
		---	Easy freeway access.

	Oakland International Airport :
		---	Major regional airport hub for West Coast region
		---	15 minutes to hosting campus
		--- 	Easy freeway and public access - BART (Bay Are
			Rapid Tranport, the subway system in Bay Area)

	San Jose International Airport :
		---	One of the busiest airport on West Coast region
			located at Silicon Valley
		---	35 - 40 minutes to hosting campus
		---	Easy freeway access

Room :
	$15.25/person one day. Every apartment has two bedrooms, living room,
	kitchen, and private bothroom.

Meal :
	$15/person day for the all delicious CHINESE FOODS 
	or $15.75/person day for buffet style meals provided by housing
	office.




From DING@vaxld.ameslab.gov  Thu Apr  7 20:06:52 1994
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Date: Thu, 07 Apr 1994 20:04:58 -0500 (CDT)
From: DING@vaxld.ameslab.gov
Subject: Council's Teleconference coming soon
To: council-l@ifcss.org, council-wn@ifcss.org
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This is a reminder that the Council's quarterly Teleconference is
coming soon. Please be prepared. It will be most probably on next
Saturday (4/16/94).

Please start early to prepare any resolutions you want to bring to
the Conference. 

Two things may need to be reminded in particular:
1. the conference minutes of last two times. We will have to finish
   the old business before we get down to the new in the Telecon.
2. The Financial Taskforce (it's real this time :-), please 
   push yourself/HQ/related parties to make things move.

The Council has been quiet.  Please wake up, folks!
There are a lot, a lot, of things waiting for our attention.


Yungui Ding

From DING@vaxld.ameslab.gov  Thu Apr  7 20:07:51 1994
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Date: Thu, 07 Apr 1994 20:05:44 -0500 (CDT)
From: DING@vaxld.ameslab.gov
Subject: (fwd) Zhang Qingsong's article on IFCSS Newsletter
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From:	IN%"liuc@simon.wustl.edu"  7-APR-1994 17:34:10.88
To:	IN%"'ifcssvc@ifcss.org'@WUGATE.wustl.edu"
CC:	
Subj:	The article in IFCSS Newsletter Vol.5, No.5

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Date: Thu, 07 Apr 1994 17:11:00 -0500
From: liuc@simon.wustl.edu
Subject: The article in IFCSS Newsletter Vol.5, No.5
To: "ifcssvc@ifcss.org"@WUGATE.wustl.edu
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Hi, all,

After read the article written by Mr. Qingsong Zhang in IFCSS Newsletter, Vol.5
, No.5, I feel it's unneccessary and biased. Being an involved party, you betternot to write that kind of article as there's no conclusion in D.C. meeting and
the appeals are still pending. Specifically, I don't like the way you mention
CND as if CND is part of the plot. What CND have done is to carry both party's opinion or publish some public opinion. After the open letter, I asked council and HQ to express their opinion, I got nothing. So my CND fellow can only publish
the public opinion, include Anzhi, Shizhong, Jinghong, etc. There's no biased
intention on CND side.

Secondly, I think in the long run, open letter has its merit to correct some
of the `traditional' behavior. The volcano will active sooner or later if we
do nothing to professionalize our operation. Just think about the trend this
term has created: Shusheng's committee, open letter and New Comers committee
to mention a few. Is this the healthy trend? We are supposed to learn
how democratic operation should be rather than to claim who is the boss or
simply use the CCP fashion proceed the problem.

IFCSS Newsletter is the official publication, it should represent the opinions
all or most of the officials hold. To publish such a kind of article has 
something to do with abuse power though it's not the exact word should be used
here. I think involved party shouldn't write history. It's the public or our 
successor who should give us a candidate record.


Chengyan

From DING@vaxld.ameslab.gov  Thu Apr  7 20:09:39 1994
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Date: Thu, 07 Apr 1994 20:07:46 -0500 (CDT)
From: DING@vaxld.ameslab.gov
Subject: (fwd) Zhang Qingsong's article ... (II) from Liu Chengyan
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From:	IN%"liuc@simon.wustl.edu"  7-APR-1994 18:49:38.35
To:	IN%"'ifcssvc@ifcss.org'@WUGATE.wustl.edu"
CC:	
Subj:	Zhang Qingsong's article on IFCSS Newsletter

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Date: Thu, 07 Apr 1994 18:35:43 -0500
From: liuc@simon.wustl.edu
Subject: Zhang Qingsong's article on IFCSS Newsletter
To: "ifcssvc@ifcss.org"@WUGATE.wustl.edu
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Hi, all,

After read the appendix below Zhang's article, I feel it's necessary to ask
Qingsong why not include Ms. Jiang Zuihong's financial statement? You couldn't
misquote open letter in your article. Let me write down the whole sentence
in the second paragraph of IT's open letter:

"As a result of auditing the Financial Statements prepared by Jiang Zuihong,
the treasurer of IFCSS, the Inspection Team (IT) of Finance Committee has
noticed some alarming irregularities in the Financial Statements of Fiscal
Year 1992-93 and Fiscal ear 1993-94 (1st Quarter)."

If you want to comment on something, you should quote the whole sentence rather
than part of it. It's a misleading article and is unproper to publish this
kind of article in the official publication of IFCSS.


Chengan

From DING@vaxld.ameslab.gov  Thu Apr  7 20:10:21 1994
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Date: Thu, 07 Apr 1994 20:08:26 -0500 (CDT)
From: DING@vaxld.ameslab.gov
Subject: (fwd) Zhang Qingsong's article on ... (III).  (from Liu Chengyan)
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From:	IN%"liuc@simon.wustl.edu"  7-APR-1994 19:33:03.06
To:	IN%"'ifcssvc@ifcss.org'@WUGATE.wustl.edu"
CC:	
Subj:	Zhang's article in IFCSS Newsletter

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Date: Thu, 07 Apr 1994 18:57:33 -0500
From: liuc@simon.wustl.edu
Subject: Zhang's article in IFCSS Newsletter
To: "ifcssvc@ifcss.org"@WUGATE.wustl.edu
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Hi, all,

Another question, could Qingsong tell me where can I find the original English
in open letter:

~{8CPEIy3F@mJB;a2iUJP!WiTZ2FNqIO7"OVAK!0AnHK>/>u5D2;U}3#OVOs#,!1!!SP=|6~J.~}
~{MrC@T*2;V*H%Or#,!!R*GsH+C@Q'Iz9XW"Ub8vNJLb#,!!2"0oVz2iUJP!Wi0QJ'WY5DG.UR~}
~{;X@45H5H#(Gk<{8=B<5D9+?*PET-ND#)!#~}

#tThe last sentence: ~{2"0oVz2iUJP!Wi0QJ'WY5DG.UR;X@45H5H!#(!#!#!##)!#~}!!is 
questionable, there's no sentence in the open letter that I can translate them
into Chinese as your wrote. This point may demonstrate that you haven't read
through the original text carefully, what you write is what you imagined or
some one in public wrote it. You couldn't put everything including your
reasoning and public opinion in the shoe of IT. If you want to comment, you
should read the original text carefully and quote them correctly.

There's no need to publish such an article if you feel the original mislead
the public. Your article cause the same image or even worse.

If you want to report what happended inside the administration (include council
and all the officials) to public, why don't you report what happend toward
New Comers in D.C. meeting? Is it fair? As your logic, I may make a big noise
than you did in public concerned of how New Comers being treated by IFCSS.
You as an acting editor and the involved party (4th term official) should put
your opinion in IFCSS ofificial publication.                              ^not

Your behavior worth another appeal to SVC though I have no intention to do so.

Be careful, as your job suppose to represent the nam,e of IFCSS, not personal,
not 4th term IFCSS HQ or anything else!

Chengyan

From labhgz@unix.cc.emory.edu  Fri Apr  8 09:14:38 1994
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Date: Fri, 8 Apr 1994 09:49:49 -0400 (EDT)
From: Hongguang  Zhou <labhgz@unix.cc.emory.edu>
Subject: Memo #7 Reimbursement for Bai Yan and Quarterly Financial Report
To: ifcss <council-l@ifcss.org>, ifcss@WAM.UMD.EDU, svc93@ifcss.org,
        ifcssvc@ifcss.org
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From:	Zhou Hongguang (signed)
	IFCSS Council Member from the Southeast, 
	Acting Chair of IFCSS Council Finance Committee

To:	Lin Changsheng, IFCSS President

Date:	April 8, 1994

Memo #7 on Reimbursement for Bai Yan


Changsheng and Xiaozhu:

	Please be reminded this is the 7th memo concerning the reimbursement 
of the air ticket for Bai Yan has not been reimbursed. Since last memo of 
Number 6 dated April 1, 1994, I have left at least 2 messages on 
the answering machine at the Songyun's home, 1 message on Changsheng's 
answering machine and 1 message on the HQ answering machine. However, I 
have failed to receive any response to my calls so far and it 
seems so far the matter has not yet resolved either. Again, I urge you to 
proceed the issue and reimburse Bai Yan at your earliest convenience. 

        In case you have already done the reimbursement, please ignore
this message.

        Your prompt action on this matter would be appreciated. Thanks
for your attention.

	Meanwhile, in the capacity of the acting Chair of the IFCSS Council 
Finance Committee, I would like again to have your attention to the 4th 
Quarter of Year 1993 review of the HQ financial report, which we believe 
it should be in an professional format because IFCSS has hired Mr. Jeff 
Lin to do the compiling job. 

As a record, I am again attaching the notes from Liqun  and Yungui again as 
below.

Thanks and regards.

Enc:

---------- Forwarded message ----------
Date: Tue, 15 Mar 1994 15:17:44 -0600 (CST)
From:DING@vaxld.ameslab.gov
To: ifcss@wam.umd.edu
Cc: council-wn@ifcss.org, council-l@ifcss.org
Subject: Re: Reimbursement for Bai Yan, and Hongguag

Dear Changsheng and HQ staff,

I agree with Liqun that the reimbursement is a simple issue and should
be not be a problem. Please inform the Council of any progress regarding
this matter. Please also feel free to contact me if I could be of 
further help. 

I have enclosed Liqun's message to the HQ to avoid repeating the points.

Sincerely,

Yungui Ding

---------------------------------------------------------------------
Date: Fri, 11 Mar 1994 16:35:00 -0800 (PST)
From: Liqun Dong <dlq@u.washington.edu>
To: IFCSS HQ <ifcss@WAM.UMD.EDU>
Cc: Zhou Hongguang <labhgz@unix.cc.emory.edu>,
    IFCSS Council <council-wn@ifcss.org>
Subject: Reimbursement for Bai Yan, and Hongguang

Dear Changsheng and Xiaozhu:

      As we discussed at DC meeting, there shouldn't be a big dispute on 
the reimbursement for Bai Yan and Hongguang after the meeting. It makes 
many council members feel aweful if IFCSS even leaves a simple thing 
unsolved after several months pasted. Let's set down it and focus on many 
other more important issues. Here, I formally require to reimburse Ban 
Yan (inspection work to DC) and Hongguang (airplane ticket and Van rental 
for DC round table meeting).

      BTW, has Jeff Lin finished all parts of IFCSS financial report and 
recommondation on the IFCSS finance regulation and formats? Please 
forward them as soon as posibble to Ding Yungui, Qi Bin, Liu Chen, Zhou 
Hongguang, and Bai Yan. 

      Keep in touch.


Liqun (signed)
Chair of the IFCSS Council







From labhgz@unix.cc.emory.edu  Fri Apr  8 09:29:25 1994
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Date: Fri, 8 Apr 1994 10:02:26 -0400 (EDT)
From: Hongguang  Zhou <labhgz@unix.cc.emory.edu>
Subject: Finance Committee Chair
To: ifcss <council-l@ifcss.org>, ifcss@WAM.UMD.EDU, svc93@ifcss.org
Cc: ifcssvc@ifcss.org
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Status: RO

From:	Zhou Hongguang (signed)
	IFCSS Council Member from the Southeast, 
	IFCSS Council Finance Committee

To:	Ding Yungui, Chair of IFCSS Council,
	IFCSS Council
	
Cc:	IFCSS HQ, 
	IFCSS SVC

Date:	April 8, 1994

Suj:	Finance Commmittee Chair

As per the intention expressed by Shen Tong during the Febuary meeting in 
Washington, DC, to resign from the Chair of the IFCSS Council Fiannce 
Committee, because of her relocation to Chicargo and other reasons, plus 
the fact that Yungui and I have been unable to reach her due the 
disconnecting of her telephone number 708-637-0320, I am assuming the 
responsibility of the Chair of the IFCSS Council Finance Committee. I 
would request the formal confirmation of my position by the Council in the 
coming Council telecomference.

Thanks and regards.

From DING@vaxld.ameslab.gov  Fri Apr  8 10:36:43 1994
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Date: Fri, 08 Apr 1994 10:34:47 -0500 (CDT)
From: DING@vaxld.ameslab.gov
Subject: Teleconference Date
To: council-l@ifcss.org
Cc: council-wn@ifcss.org
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This is to clarify the date of the Teleconference date.

When I sent out my previos note, I forgot we have had our regular
confernences in the second months of every quarter although the
Council bylaw sets it at the first month. (forgot whether it was
formally amended or not).  Thank Chen Dong for reminding me.

Then, I guess we will follow our traditional second month schedule
unless an emergent conference is needed.

What a relief! --We can have a breath for another month :-)
Folks, please take this time to warm up and get prepared for the
issues of IFCSS. We really need to get up and have actions.

Please bring issues that you think are important to the Council
and inform me to put into the agenda.


Yungui Ding

From labhgz@unix.cc.emory.edu  Fri Apr  8 17:00:27 1994
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Date: Fri, 8 Apr 1994 17:47:09 -0400 (EDT)
From: Hongguang  Zhou <labhgz@unix.cc.emory.edu>
Subject: on the IFCSS NL issue (fwd)
To: ifcss <council-l@ifcss.org>
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---------- Forwarded message ----------
Date: Fri, 8 Apr 94 15:08:31 CDT
From:liu@cae.wisc.edu
To: ifcssvc@ifcss.org
Subject: on the IFCSS NL issue

I am very disappointed by the mails from Qingson and Jinghong. At the same time
they were accusing irrationality of Chengyan's mail, they did the same!

Basically, I agree the assessment of Chengyan. Qingsong, the one involved in
the recent dispute over the IFCSS financial problem, should stay away from
the issus when editing IFCSS NL. Throughout the recent IFCSS NL, I see no point
to "control" the so-called demage to the IFCSS society. Rather, it worsens the
situation: the NL failed to give a complete and fair report of the whole dispute.
Therefore, the NL leaves an impression that IFCSS HQ dealed with the financial 
issues wisely and promptly. However, I don't think this is the case.

I am so dissapointed and upset to see Jinghong and Qingsong, both are IFCSS
veterans, used such irration "word" to attack Chengyan's mail. They just does 
not make any senses. IFCSS is an organization for the whole Chinese community.
It does not belong to you two only.


Zhendong
a self-proclaimed IFCSS activist

From labhgz@unix.cc.emory.edu  Fri Apr  8 16:57:58 1994
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Date: Fri, 8 Apr 1994 17:44:31 -0400 (EDT)
From: Hongguang  Zhou <labhgz@unix.cc.emory.edu>
Subject: Agree with Chengyan, about Qingsong's article (fwd)
To: ifcss <council-l@ifcss.org>, ifcssvc@ifcss.org, svc93@ifcss.org
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---------- Forwarded message ----------
Date: Fri, 08 Apr 1994 10:05:24 -0500 (CDT)
From:DING@vaxld.ameslab.gov
To: ifcssvc@ifcss.org
Subject: Agree with Chengyan, about Qingsong's article


I have the same feeling as Chengyan. 
Qingsong's article, serving as an editorial, is very biased and
inapproriate. The title is about the "DC Joint Meeting", but about
half of the article is spent to a very "subjective" description
of the IT's work. 

I don't want to repeat the debate about the details. We have been 
doing it for such a long time. Just point out a few small points:

1. Qingsong accuses the IT of postponing the trip.
   Is it really the sole responsibility of the IT?

2. Qingsong comments on Jian Zuohong's accounting practice as
   "JingJing YouTiao"!
   What a JingJing YouTiao!  Really just a joke.

3. Qingsong highly appraises Changsheng's secret trip to China.
   Is that the consensus of the DC Meeting, or just "YiXiao QingYuan".
   Such kind of gambling behavior could be potentially very harmful to 
   an organizations. Such behavior is gross violation of any
   proper procedure of IFCSS. The excuses of such behavior is somewhat
   ridiculous.  Can it be justified by any possible positive result?
   No! Not to mention that we haven't seen any such result at all.

I agree with Chengyan's basic assessment of Qingsong's article:
use the IFCSS Newsletter to voise one's own opinion. 

Qingsong's accusing other media such as CND of "Attacking (GongJi)"
IFCSS made me very sad, since it only indicates a lack of basic
understanding of one of the basic principles in a democratic society.


Yungui

From dong  Fri Apr  8 21:34:26 1994
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From: dong (D.C.)
Message-Id: <9404090234.AA01650@ifcss.org>
To: DING@vaxld.ameslab.gov
Subject: Re: Teleconference
Cc: council-l
Status: RO

Yungui,

I mentioned I would like to have a email meeting as soon as possible.
We don't have much time left now. There are so many things that I don't
think we should drag or can we finish in one teleconference.
So I propose to have the email meeting before teleconference.

There are a few issues I can think of that need to solve as soon as
possible.
1. Select the 6da site.
2. Form 6a Prepareation task force
3. Review Hq finance situation and have preminary report by the finance
   task force.
4. Review of the council finance situation (I heard we might over our budget
   by now, need confirm by finance committee and co-chair.)


We should prepare for 6da as soon as possible. Last year, they started
preparation in Jan.
Also, from pass experience, I think have a email meeting before the 
teleconference, will make us to be more prepared and have a better telecon.

I suggest to have the email meeting Apr. 16.

Dong,

From labhgz@unix.cc.emory.edu  Sat Apr  9 22:53:41 1994
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Date: Sat, 9 Apr 1994 23:51:53 -0400 (EDT)
From: Hongguang  Zhou <labhgz@unix.cc.emory.edu>
Subject: ATTN: Qingsong, $100 for you (fwd)
To: ifcss <council-l@ifcss.org>, ifcssvc@ifcss.org, svc93@ifcss.org
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*-------------------------------------------------------------*
| Hongguang Zhou            Office:             (404)727-0641 |
| Department of Psychology  Home:               (404)373-8053 |
| Emory University          Fax:                (404)727-0372 |
| Atlanta, GA 30322         Internet:labhgz@unix.cc.emory.edu |
*-------------------------------------------------------------*



---------- Forwarded message ----------
Date: Sat, 9 Apr 1994 21:02:50 -0500
From:liuc@simon.wustl.edu
To: "ifcssvc@ifcss.org"@WUGATE.wustl.edu
Subject: ATTN: Qingsong, $100 for you

Qingsong,

Concerned of CND-US, December 18th, 1993, I couldn't answer questions
you raised since I'm not the author of that article. However, I will
make you and IFCSS happy by publish another package if you can answer 
my following questions with facts. Any of your expense involved in 
copying, phone bill and mail usage for presenting facts will be covered 
by my personal check.

a. I know you were 4th term IFCSS Executive Director, could you tell
   me how regular you got your pay check?

b. Was Ms. Jiang Zuihong, IFCSS treasurer, responsible for manage 
   various IFCSS fund while she can authorize check? Was there a 
   time she wrote herself a check? If the answer for above questions
   is true, what's Mr. Jeff Lin's opinion on these respect?

c. Was there any check and invoice missing after IFCSS appointed 
   Ms. Jiang Zuihong as its treasurer?

d. How long Ms. Jiang Zuihong haven't done bookkeeping when IT arrived
   HQ to fulfill their duty?

e. Was Heping's wife got paid in last August?

f. Did IFCSS HQ officials get their rent subsidy as part of their salary?
   What's Mr. Jeff Lin's opinion on this respect?

g. Did every IFCSS check has a clear purpose notes on it before February
   IFCSS Washington D.C. working meeting?

h. Do IT get regular financial report regard IFCSS's financial situation?

i. Why [5th term] IFCSS Council freeze IFCSS HQ's budget? Is there an 
   itemized budget proposal by 5th term IFCSS HQ until today, April 9th,
   1994? Is there a budget proposal for Changsheng's Australia and China
   visit?

j. Why 5th term IFCSS council denied IFCSS HQ's request for employ CPA
   Mr. Jeff Lin? Was there an Council proposal for internal auditing?

After you [Qingsong] give me solid facts, I'll prepare another package
for IFCSS and publish it as soon as possible. My phone number is 
314-726-7971, fax number is 314-935-4156, e-mail address is 
liuc@simon.wustl.edu. My home address is
                         
                         6490 Enright, #409
                         St. Louis, MO 63130.

Please tell me your home address, $100 check will mail to you for expense
coverage. [more money will give to you if so required]


Regards

Chengyan Liu
for CND
   
PS. In order to clear IFCSS's reputation, more question will be raised 
    in the writing process.

From dong  Sun Apr 10 14:23:09 1994
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From: dong (D.C.)
Message-Id: <9404101923.AA27378@ifcss.org>
To: council-l, ifcssvc, labhgz@unix.cc.emory.edu, svc93
Subject: Re:  ATTN: Qingsong, $100 for you (fwd)
Status: RO

Please don't forward mails arround. I alread get so many mail.
Many of them 3 or 4 times. So I suggest don't forward between VC net
and council-l. As they are largely overlap. For other forwarding mail
please do it only when necessary (ie. 1. it's important, 2. other people
otherwise will not be able to read it.)

From DING@vaxld.ameslab.gov  Sun Apr 10 23:30:39 1994
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From: DING@vaxld.ameslab.gov
Subject: Re: Teleconference
To: dong@ifcss.org
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Indeed there are many issues the Council has to settle.
I don't know how many Council members are on-line and available.

Yungui Ding

From dong  Mon Apr 11 10:30:01 1994
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To: DING@vaxld.ameslab.gov
Subject: Re: Teleconference
Cc: council-l
Status: O

Could any council member who saw this please reply ?

---------------
>From DING@vaxld.ameslab.gov Sun Apr 10 23:30:41 1994
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From: DING@vaxld.ameslab.gov
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Indeed there are many issues the Council has to settle.
I don't know how many Council members are on-line and available.

Yungui Ding


From labhgz@unix.cc.emory.edu  Mon Apr 11 16:34:02 1994
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Date: Mon, 11 Apr 1994 17:15:55 -0400 (EDT)
From: Hongguang  Zhou <labhgz@unix.cc.emory.edu>
Subject: Can what Jeff Lin said be used as an evidence?
To: Qingsong Zhang <qsz2u@faraday.clas.virginia.edu>
Cc: liuc@simon.wustl.edu, ifcss <council-l@ifcss.org>, ifcssvc@ifcss.org
In-Reply-To: <199404100600.AA27258@faraday.clas.Virginia.EDU>
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Status: RO

From: 	Zhou Hongguang, CM-the Southeast
	IFCSS Finance Committee

To:	Whom it may conerned

Re:	Can what Jeff Lin said be used as an evidence?

	If you can ask Mr. Jeff Lin to confirm all what he said to the 
Washington meeting in early Febuary as professional advice and 
can be used as an eveidence, it would be a great help. The 
question is, no one has so far confirmed that Jeff Lin is sure to be 
responsible for what he said in the transcribed words. If he says YES, 
many questins may be solved. It seems not appropiate to quote what 
someone says, not in written format, in an occosion as a evidence to against 
others without confirming with the speaker himself first. Pleae be reminded 
that, if the words are regarded as professional advice, the advisor bears 
the legal liability of those words. If the advisor does not confirm what 
he said, then the responsibility should be borne by the person who quotes 
them.

	Thanks and regards.
	


On Sun, 10 Apr 1994, Qingsong Zhang wrote:

> A final comment: You are not a IT member, where did you learn
> that Heping's wife was get paid in August? Do you have hard
> evidence to support your claim? I's suggest you to read
> Jeff Lin's comments in Newsletter 5.5 about "caution."
> 
> Qingsong

From dlq@u.washington.edu  Tue Apr 12 15:43:03 1994
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Date: Tue, 12 Apr 1994 13:40:59 -0700 (PDT)
From: Liqun Dong <dlq@u.washington.edu>
Subject: My Resignation 
To: IFCSS Council <council-l@ifcss.org>
Cc: IFCSS HQ <ifcss@WAM.UMD.EDU>,
        IFCSS Veteran Club <ifcssvc@udcps3.cps.udayton.edu>,
        Tempo Camp <tempo@mead.u.washington.edu>
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Dear IFCSS Council Members, HQ officers, and other IFCSS Activities:

      I've just come back my basetown (Seattle) from several intensive 
trips.  There are several hundred mails in my e-mail account. After read 
them briefly, I deside keeping silent. 

      Because I have graduated from the University of Washington, I am 
not qualified to represent the Northwest Region afterward. Furthermore, I  
will travel a lot in the coming months, it is very hard to reach me 
through phone or e-mail. For the sake of IFCSS's operation, I formally 
resign the position of the Chairperson of IFCSS Council and the council  
member representing Northwest Region at this moment.

      There is no further explanation on my resignation.


Liqun Dong (signed)

From DING@vaxld.ameslab.gov  Wed Apr 13 10:16:55 1994
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Date: Wed, 13 Apr 1994 10:15:03 -0500 (CDT)
From: DING@vaxld.ameslab.gov
Subject: Hold on to it, please!
To: council-l@ifcss.org
Cc: ifcssvc@ifcss.org
Message-Id: <01HB4F1VO0XI4DDR8W@alisuvax.bitnet>
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It is a pity to see Liqun resigning from IFCSS Council.
I wonder whether there is any possibility for Liqun to reconsider
his decision. I understand the pressure and stress each one of us
is facing everyday in this land for our own personal affairs.
Tight schedules to keep, many deadlines to hit, a lot demands and
requirements to meet, etc. We all just do the best we can to volunteer
our time and energy to IFCSS. Therefore, anyone that ever spared any
of their time to this and other CSS community organizations has my
sincere respect. Serving as the Council member and Council Chair, 
Liqun has spent a lot of time on it. So, whatever your decision is,
Liqun, you have my best wishes!

At this moment, I would like to call upon other colleagues in the
Council to hold on to it, Please! And to be active in the IFCSS
issues, as far as you can!

We have also seen Zhang Feng's frank expression of frustration with
working for IFCSS. I hope all IFCSS officials and veteran activists
take it seriously. It is not a problem of Zhang Feng, or Chengyan,
or Yungui, or Hongguang, or Qingsong, or anyone, individually.
It is a problem of IFCSS, of us all. We must ask the question:
What's wrong with IFCSS? 

There may be a lot different answers. I leave it to all of us to
find out and solve the related problems. And we must.


Yungui

From DING@vaxld.ameslab.gov  Wed Apr 13 10:25:47 1994
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Date: Wed, 13 Apr 1994 10:23:56 -0500 (CDT)
From: DING@vaxld.ameslab.gov
Subject: Colleagues, move on!
To: council-l@ifcss.org, council-wn@ifcss.org
Cc: ifcssvc@ifcss.org
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Dear colleagues,

Several issues here I have to raise to your attention:

1. Does anyone know whether there is alternative candidates for 
   the (Northwest region) if Liqun can't come back (I sincerely
   hope Liqun would reconsider the decision and continue to 
   work with us!)?

   If you do, please give me the contact number or address.

2. It is said that Shen Tong has also resigned from the Council.
   Does anyone have contact with her?
   The Council has conferences pending, we must be able to get
   in touch with all our colleagues, or get in new Council members
   for all regions.

3. There are really a lot of issues the Council has to discuss.
   I do see a need to have an emergency conference as Chen Dong
   suggested. 

   Again, I call on my colleagues to show up in the Council network
   and get engaged into the IFCSS business actively.


Yungui

From DING@vaxld.ameslab.gov  Wed Apr 13 12:59:57 1994
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From: DING@vaxld.ameslab.gov
Subject: Re: Colleagues, move on!  (forwarded for Liu Cheng)
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From:	IN%"liuc@wadsworth.ph.albany.edu" 13-APR-1994 12:22:15.10
To:	IN%"DING@VAXLD.AMESLAB.GOV"
CC:	
Subj:	RE: Colleagues, move on!

Return-path: <liuc@wadsworth.ph.albany.edu>
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Date: Wed, 13 Apr 1994 13:21:54 -0500 (EDT)
From: liuc@wadsworth.ph.albany.edu (Cheng Liu)
Subject: RE: Colleagues, move on!
In-reply-to: <01HB4FLJ0LH84DDR8W@alisuvax.bitnet> from "DING@vaxld.ameslab.gov"
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	Hello! New chair and fellow members:
	I am here. I agree with Yungui and Chen dong that we need to have
a emergency teleconference. The majar issue to be decided are, the sponsoring
school of 6da and the MFN survey results. I had a report earlier to the
council net, but I haven't heard anything yet. Another issue is that HQ
never haven't submitted  any financial report of this term yet, now it is
near the end of it already. We should put the task force to work and
reform the financial management system. During the DC meeting, I had given
a proposal from the IT about the possible changes to solicit opinions from
HQ and council members. I have not got any yet.
	There are much discussion about structural changes about bylaw and
charters, Hope we can discuss that as well. We may discuss a little bit
first on the net before teleconference.



                                             Cheng Liu


From DING@vaxld.ameslab.gov  Wed Apr 13 13:13:20 1994
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From: DING@vaxld.ameslab.gov
Subject: Liu Cheng's report on MFN survey result (re-post as requested)
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From:	IN%"liuc@wadsworth.ph.albany.edu" 22-MAR-1994 18:06:19.49
To:	IN%"council-wn@ifcss.org"
CC:	
Subj:	Survey result (fwd)

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From: liuc@wadsworth.ph.albany.edu (Cheng Liu)
Subject: Survey result (fwd)
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Dear fellow council members:
	I am here forwarding the survey data that collected by a joint
effort between council and newcomer committee. In this data a clear message is
being sent about the opinion of students community towards the issue of MFN.
	We all know that the MFN issue is a very important issue that will
affect the fate of US-China relationship for many years to come, and
the fate of China as a nation and Chinese as a collection of different
related races, the fate of China for her cultural and economical revival
under this historical moment. We should be extremely cautious in making
any decisions, if we think we still have interest and responsibility.
	Earlier on, the HQ of this organization had a testmony on capital
hill restated  the support of this organization in attaching condition
to MFN. No discussion and study had been done before that. Since the
global political and economical climate had been changed greatly, the
council, majerity of its members and many activists that involved felt that
there was need for us to have a opinion survey base on which a IFCSS
policy can be established. At the same time we are extremely disappointed by
the HQ in its way of handling important issue. 
	Now, the survey data showed us that the opinion of students toward
the MFN are not only devided, and majerity students do not think attaching
condition is a effective way that can solve the human right problem. In a
question about should the MFN be unlinked from human right the answer of
yes/no/no comment is 300/57/44. This indicated after one year of
condition attachment, people tends to realized that this is not a very
effective way to press China government to change its human right
condition. Almost all participant agree that unconditional will stimulate
the economic growth. Although only less than 10% people think
unconditional MFN will lead to a relaxed political environment in China.
32% people think this will give China a chance to focus on economy, and 40%
participants think this will eventually lead to political changes.
"Eventually political changes can not be ignored when economical development
prevailed".
	Based on these statistics, I think it is a time that IFCSS need to
reassesing its position on the issue of MFN if we still claim that this
organization is representing the student community. As much as we all hope 
the human right condition will be changed in china, we need to think more
about what way to take that will bring about changes most effectively. 
Having thes data at hand, I think we should make it known that the members
of IFCSS have a devided opinion towards MFN, which is much more incline to
favoring unlink the MFN from human right issue rather then attaching
conditions. Towords this end, I propose a joint announcement of IFCSS
council members to clarify this issue to the public. 



                                                     
                                                 Cheng Liu







 > 
> ----------survey begin----------
> 
> 1.   How many years have you lived in U.S.? 
> ( )     a) less than 1 year;
> ( )     b) 1-4 years;
> ( )     c) more than 4 years.
> 
> 2.   Did you participate 1989 pro-democracy movements?
> ( )     a) yes;
> ( )        a1) in U.S.;
> ( )        a2) in China;
> ( )        a3) other than U.S. and China;
> ( )     b) no;
> ( )     c) no comments.
> 
> 3.   Is there any improvement of China's human rights records since then?
> ( )     a) yes;
> ( )        a1) Chinese people have more choice on commodities with full
>                financial resource;
> ( )        a2) Chinese people can emigrate from place to place for living;
> ( )        a3) political prisoners get fair treatment:
> ( )        a4) Chinese people can get external information through foreign
>                radio station's broadcasting;
> ( )     b) no;
> ( )        b1) wage increase be offset by inflation;
> ( )        b2) Chinese government will repatriate emigrants;
> ( )        b3) political prisoners cannot get necessary treatment;
> ( )        b4) Chinese government still try to jam the signals of foreign 
>                radio station
> ( )     c) no comments.
> 
> 4.   How do you think the strategies of the United States on China's MFN
>      status?
> ( )     a) try to solve its trade deficit problem;
> ( )     b) use it as a big leverage to press China to improve its human 
>            rights records;
> ( )     c) try to find a way to cut the linkage between MFN and human 
>            rights issue;
> ( )     d) don't know.
> 
> 5.   If the United States separate MFN with human rights issue, how do
>      you think the responses of Chinese government?
> ( )     a) focus on economic growth;
> ( )     b) relax political control while strngthen economic reform;
> ( )     c) couldn't ignore political reform when market economy prevail;
> ( )     d) no comments.
> 
> 6.   Should U.S. government separate MFN with human rights records and
>      help China's economic reform as well as its political reform?
> ( )     a) yes;
> ( )        a1) send experts to China and teach them market economy;
> ( )        a2) help China to set up a relatively independent central bank
>                to control inflation;
> ( )        a3) help China to establish a relatively independent legislative
>                system;
> ( )        a4) relax export control to China on high tech products for 
>                the purpose of scientific research;
> ( )     b) no;  
> ( )        b1) there's no such a specific budget to send experts to China;   
> ( )        b2) it's a treamendous job to overhaul China's banking system 
>                in a short period;
> ( )        b3) there's no feasible way to train a large amount of Chinese
>                government's functionaries for the operations of the proposed
>                relatively independent lagislative system;
> ( )        b4) for strategic reason, U.S. couldn't export specific 
>                scientific equipment to China;
> ( )     c) no comments.
> 
> 7.   In you opinion, which strategy is better to bring China a prosperous
>      and democratic period?
> ( )     a) solve human rights knot first;
> ( )     b) going through the self-learning process under the structure of 
>            socialist market economy [elementary period];
> ( )     c) professionalize the operation of Chinese government under the
>            conditional MFN;
> ( )     d) set up a complete market economy machanism under the unconditionl 
>            MFN;
> ( )     e) don't know.
> 
> ----------survey end----------
> 
>  * * * THE RESULT OF THE SURVEY ON MFN * * *
> 
> 
>  QUESTION 1:
> 	Total valid answers : 415
> 	a) -- 12, 2pct
> 	b) -- 243, 58pct
>         c) -- 160, 38pct
>  QUESTION 2:
> 	Total valid answers : 416
>         a) -- 309, 74pct
>         	a1) -- 83, 19pct
>                 a2) -- 210, 50pct
>                 a3) -- 7, 1pct
>         b) -- 40, 9pct
>         c) -- 67, 16pct
>  QUESTION 3:
> 	Total valid answers : 369
>         a) -- 250, 67pct
>                 a1) -- 207, 56pct
>                 a2) -- 134, 36pct
>                 a3) -- 46, 12pct
>                 a4) -- 122, 33pct
>         b) -- 69, 18pct
>                 b1) -- 28, 7pct
>                 b2) -- 12, 3pct
>                 b3) -- 47, 12pct
>                 b4) -- 42, 11pct
>         c) -- 50, 13pct
>  QUESTION 4:
> 	Total valid answers : 411
>         a) -- 175, 42pct
>         b) -- 143, 34pct
>         c) -- 81, 19pct
>         d) -- 76, 18pct
>  QUESTION 5:
> 	Total valid answers : 413
>         a) -- 168, 40pct
>         b) -- 72, 17pct
>         c) -- 201, 48pct
>         d) -- 70, 16pct
>  QUESTION 6:
> 	Total valid answers : 398
>         a) -- 300, 75pct
>                 a1) -- 110, 27pct
>                 a2) -- 137, 34pct
>                 a3) -- 129, 32pct
>                 a4) -- 216, 54pct
>         b) -- 57, 14pct
>                 b1) -- 7, 1pct
>                 b2) -- 7, 1pct
>                 b3) -- 17, 4pct
>                 b4) -- 7, 1pct
>         c) -- 44, 11pct
>  QUESTION 7:
> 	Total valid answers : 410
>         a) -- 26, 6pct
>         b) -- 137, 33pct
>         c) -- 58, 14pct
>         d) -- 196, 47pct
>         e) -- 53, 12pct
> 
> 


From ifcss@wam.umd.edu  Wed Apr 13 13:55:31 1994
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Date: Wed, 13 Apr 1994 14:53:30 -0400
From: IFCSS HQ <ifcss@wam.umd.edu>
Message-Id: <199404131853.AA03875@rac4.wam.umd.edu>
To: chair@ifcss.org, council-l@ifcss.org
Subject: Memo on 6th IFCSS Congress
Status: RO

IFCSS HQ Memo

To: IFCSS Council

From: IFCSS HQ

Dear Council members:

It is time to prepare for the 6th IFCSS Congress. HQ received
3 proposals to host the annual conference. The proposals are from

1. University of Wisconsin-Madison,
2. University of North Carolina-Chapel Hill,
3. California State University-Hayward.

Please make your decision as soon as possible.

If you have any questions, please contact
HQ at 1-202-347-0017.

Thank you

From dong  Wed Apr 13 17:11:56 1994
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Date: Wed, 13 Apr 94 17:11:56 CDT
From: dong (D.C.)
Message-Id: <9404132211.AA07602@ifcss.org>
To: DING@vaxld.ameslab.gov, council-l, council-wn
Subject: Re:  Colleagues, move on!
Cc: ifcssvc
Status: RO

So far, I only got Zhang Feng's reply that he is on the net.
So we have
	Ding Yungui,
	Zhang Feng,
	Chen Dong
here.

Any other council member receives this mail ? please reply.

Dong,

From dong  Wed Apr 13 17:28:01 1994
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From: dong (D.C.)
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To: council-l@ifcss.org
Subject: Re:  Colleagues, move on!
Status: O

>From council-l@ifcss.org Wed Apr 13 17:13:10 1994
>From: dong (D.C.)
>
>So far, I only got Zhang Feng's reply that he is on the net.
>So we have
>	Ding Yungui, 
>	Zhang Feng, 
>	Chen Dong 
>here.  

And 	Liu Cheng

>Any other council member receives this mail ? please reply.

Dong,

From ejwang@titan.ucs.umass.edu  Wed Apr 13 20:57:39 1994
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Date: Wed, 13 Apr 1994 21:55:44 -0400 (EDT)
From: ECHO WANG <ejwang@titan.ucs.umass.edu>
Subject: Re: Colleagues, move on!
In-Reply-To: <9404132211.AA07602@ifcss.org> from "D.C." at Apr 13,
 94 05:12:51 pm
To: council-l@ifcss.org
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Status: RO

Wang Jing

From dong  Thu Apr 14 02:55:30 1994
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From: dong (D.C.)
Message-Id: <9404140755.AA25215@ifcss.org>
To: council-l
Subject: What's your idea about 6da's  site ?
Status: O

I.
	We need to pick up a 6da site as soon as possible. The deadline for 
	Zhengdong's Madison to reserve rooms is this Friday. So, please scan
	through the appended proposals and pick up one you like.
	We should consider both the conviennt, economic and available time,
	and the supporting force  of local people.

	So far Hongran thinks North Carolina is the best one.
	Zhang Feng and I prefer Madison.
	Hongguang not decided.
PLEASE MAKE YOUR CHOICE BY TODAY !

II.
	The phone number  of Yungui, Liqun, Shen Tong, Wang Yu, Datong
	are not updated. Could you or anybody knows please mail us the
	numbers ?

III.
	council members that are onlines are :
	Chen Dong, Ding Yungui, Liang Er, Liu Chen, Ren Songlin, Wang Jing,
	Qi Bin, Zhang Feng, Fan Hongran.

	Are you here ?
	Liqun, Shao Qing, Shen Tong, Wang Yu, Datong, Zhang Li, Hongguang.

IV.
	Please try to send mails to council-l@ifcss.org not
	council-wn@ifcss.org. There are already some people complain
	that we use private net, not the open network.


Best Regards,
Dong Chen

From songlin@buphy.bu.edu  Thu Apr 14 08:44:29 1994
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Date: Thu, 14 Apr 1994 13:42:36 GMT
From: Songlin Ren <songlin@buphy.bu.edu>
Message-Id: <199404141342.NAA05145@buphy.bu.edu>
To: council-l@ifcss.org
Subject: Re:  Colleagues, move on!
Status: RO

I'm on the net.

Songlin

From labhgz@unix.cc.emory.edu  Thu Apr 14 09:08:32 1994
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Date: Thu, 14 Apr 1994 10:06:37 -0400 (EDT)
From: Hongguang  Zhou <labhgz@unix.cc.emory.edu>
Subject: Re: Colleagues, move on!
To: "D.C." <dong@ifcss.org>
Cc: Multiple recipients of list <council-l@ifcss.org>
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Status: RO

I'm on.

Hongguang

From DING@vaxld.ameslab.gov  Thu Apr 14 09:21:57 1994
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From: DING@vaxld.ameslab.gov
Subject: Re: Council Member in Northwest
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Thanks, Qingsong, for your information.


Yungui 

From DING@vaxld.ameslab.gov  Thu Apr 14 09:22:21 1994
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From:	IN%"qsz2u@faraday.clas.virginia.edu"  "Qingsong Zhang" 14-APR-1994 01:26:58.30
To:	IN%"ding@VAXLD.AMESLAB.GOV"
CC:	
Subj:	Council Member in Northwest

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Date: Thu, 14 Apr 1994 02:22:37 -0400
From: Qingsong Zhang <qsz2u@faraday.clas.virginia.edu>
Subject: Council Member in Northwest
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I am really sorry to see Liqun's resignation. I'd like to join
Yungui to appeal Liqun to reconsider his decision. Like Yungui
said, let us hang on.

Yungui asked for the name and phone number of the alternative
council member from the Northwest. I found the information.

His name is SHI, Zhe  from Oregon State University.
Telephone number 503-754-7422.


Qingsong

From DING@vaxld.ameslab.gov  Thu Apr 14 09:25:31 1994
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Date: Thu, 14 Apr 1994 09:23:42 -0500 (CDT)
From: DING@vaxld.ameslab.gov
Subject: Re: What's your idea about 6da's  site ?
To: council-l@ifcss.org
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As for the 6Da site, I choose Madison, based on location and accessibility.
Most importantly, a strong supporting team. 


Yungui

From DING@vaxld.ameslab.gov  Thu Apr 14 09:27:21 1994
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Date: Thu, 14 Apr 1994 09:25:31 -0500 (CDT)
From: DING@vaxld.ameslab.gov
Subject: the most current phone # list
To: council-l@ifcss.org
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Chen Dong,

My phone number has not changed recently.
The following is the most current list I kept.

Yungui

------------
Chen Dong       (301)405-5425   dong@fuzzy.umd.edu             
Ding Yungui     (515)296-7691   DING@vaxld.ameslab.gov         
Dong Liqun      (206)323-5529   dlq@u.washington.edu           
Fan Hongran     (305)326-8902   hfan@newssun.med.miami.edu     
Liang Er        (415)751-3606                                  
Liu Chen        (518)427-5883   liuc@violet.ph.albany.edu      
Qi Bing         (716)292-0033   BGQI@medinfo.rochester.edu     
Ren Songlin     (617)773-2753   songlin@buphy.bu.edu           
Shao Qing       (703)951-9697   qshao@VTVM1.CC.VT.EDU          
Shen Tong                                                      
Wang Jing       (413)549-6919   ejwang@titan.ucs.umass.edu     
Wang Yu         (303)494-9684   wangy@rtt.colorado.edu         
Xu Datong       (602)628-7981                                  
Zhang Feng      (612)378-2594   zhan0002@student.tc.umn.edu    
Zhang Li        (817)548-7357                                  
Zhou Hongguang  (404)373-8053   labhgz@unix.cc.emory.edu       


From DING@vaxld.ameslab.gov  Thu Apr 14 09:34:36 1994
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Date: Thu, 14 Apr 1994 09:32:46 -0500 (CDT)
From: DING@vaxld.ameslab.gov
Subject: Re: What's your idea about 6da's  site ?
To: council-l@ifcss.org
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Since our email conference is yet to start (and a decision on the 6th Congress
site will be made then), and the issue is urgent as Chen Dong pointed out,
I suggest the following:

1.  Council members, please voice our your choice/concern/comment now
    for the Council to get a rough idea of the consent.

2.  We'll explore the possibility of postponing the deadline of making
    reservations with the bidding schools.


A formal call of the email conference will be sent out by me and Chen Dong
soon.



Yungui

From songlin@buphy.bu.edu  Thu Apr 14 09:37:00 1994
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Date: Thu, 14 Apr 1994 14:35:07 GMT
From: Songlin Ren <songlin@buphy.bu.edu>
Message-Id: <199404141435.OAA06907@buphy.bu.edu>
To: council-l@ifcss.org
Subject: Re:  What's your idea about 6da's  site ?
Status: O

I prefer San Fancisco CA. 1da, 2da, 4da and 5da were in midwest, and 3da were i
in DC (east). This time should be in west. San Fancisco have a big airport,
the tiket may be lower. 

Songlin

From songlin@buphy.bu.edu  Thu Apr 14 09:42:53 1994
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Date: Thu, 14 Apr 1994 14:41:00 GMT
From: Songlin Ren <songlin@buphy.bu.edu>
Message-Id: <199404141441.OAA07083@buphy.bu.edu>
To: council-l@ifcss.org
Subject: Re:  the most current phone # list
Status: RO

My phone # has been changed. The new # is (617)769-5760 (home) (617)353-2634
(office) (617)255-0228 (fax).

Songlin

From songlin@buphy.bu.edu  Thu Apr 14 10:00:14 1994
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Date: Thu, 14 Apr 1994 14:58:21 GMT
From: Songlin Ren <songlin@buphy.bu.edu>
Message-Id: <199404141458.OAA08032@buphy.bu.edu>
To: council-l@ifcss.org
Subject: Re: What's your idea about 6da's  site ?
Status: RO

The bay area of San Fransico is good place for 6da. Many schools in that area,
UC Berkeley, Stanford, UC San Francisco, San Fransico State U. and so on.
Also, there are very strong chinese community. The term to support 6da will
be very strong. The air tiket will be much lower than Madison. Madison
doesn't have big airport. Some of airline will only reach to Milwaukee, it
is not very convenient. The important thing is that IFCSS congress have
4 times in midwest, but never in west.

Songlin

From songlin@buphy.bu.edu  Thu Apr 14 10:21:13 1994
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Date: Thu, 14 Apr 1994 15:19:17 GMT
From: Songlin Ren <songlin@buphy.bu.edu>
Message-Id: <199404141519.PAA08943@buphy.bu.edu>
To: council-l@ifcss.org
Subject: Re:  Liu Cheng's report on MFN survey result (re-post as requested)
Status: RO

The issue of relation of US and China is very important, we should have a
discussion section of it in 6da. The MFN survey result is not an accurate
measuerment of the views of CCS. We don't how many % of CSS is on the
net. 

Songlin

From songlin@buphy.bu.edu  Thu Apr 14 11:50:39 1994
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Date: Thu, 14 Apr 1994 16:48:47 GMT
From: Songlin Ren <songlin@buphy.bu.edu>
Message-Id: <199404141648.QAA12651@buphy.bu.edu>
To: council-l@ifcss.org
Subject: E-mail Conference
Status: RO


.......................................................................
   Meeting Chair,

   I will be in presence for the Council First E-mail Conference starting
   5pm CST (6pm EST), Saturday, April 16, 1994, in the council email
   network.

   I approve (or disapprove) the proposed conference schedule, order
   and rules.

   Songlin Ren (signed)
   Member of IFCSS 5th Council
   Representing Region: NE 
 .......................................................................


From ejwang@titan.ucs.umass.edu  Thu Apr 14 12:03:33 1994
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 (8.6.4/8.6.4) id MAA15601 for council-l@ifcss.org; Thu,
 14 Apr 1994 12:34:00 -0400
Date: Thu, 14 Apr 1994 12:33:59 -0400 (EDT)
From: ECHO WANG <ejwang@titan.ucs.umass.edu>
Subject: 6da site
To: council-l@ifcss.org
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Status: RO

Chen Dong,

	Thanks for taking the responsibility.  Among the three candidate sites:

> 1. University of Wisconsin-Madison,
> 2. University of North Carolina-Chapel Hill,
> 3. California State University-Hayward.

	For now, I prefer 3. CSU.  

	But if time ever allows, I'd suggest that both HQ and the Council   
should do some more research, like checking the airfare from each of the 
region and get some more details from each of the site candidate.  Might 
not sound practical when quick decision is needed.  We can probably do 
this for the upcoming e-mail mtg.

Wang Jing

From ejwang@titan.ucs.umass.edu  Fri Apr 15 15:51:26 1994
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 (8.6.4/8.6.4) id QAA01634 for council-l@ifcss.org; Fri,
 15 Apr 1994 16:49:17 -0400
Date: Fri, 15 Apr 1994 16:49:17 -0400 (EDT)
From: ECHO WANG <ejwang@titan.ucs.umass.edu>
Subject: E-mail conference sign on
To: council-l@ifcss.org
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Status: O

 	Meeting chair:
 
 	I will be present on net during the second E-mail conference, 6
 pm, April 16, 1994.
 	I approve the proposed meeting orders and rules.
 
 
               Wang Jing (Signed)
                April 15, 1994  

From dong  Sat Apr 16 00:10:45 1994
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Date: Sat, 16 Apr 94 00:10:45 CDT
From: dong (D.C.)
Message-Id: <9404160510.AA18974@ifcss.org>
To: council-l
Subject: Call for second council email confernence
Status: RO


 From:   Yungui Ding (signed) Co-Chair
         Dong Chen (signed)   Secretary
 To:     IFCSS Council, SVC, HQ, all CSS
 Date:   April 14, 1994
 Sub:    Call for the 2nd IFCSS Council Email Conference


There are several issues that the Council should discuss and make 
decision on in a timely manner. The 2nd Email conference is therefore
called.

The Email conference will be held during the time of:

  Start:  6pm Estern Standard Time (EST), Saturday, April 16, 1994
  End:    6pm Estern Standard Time (EST), Saturday, April 23, 1994.

Enclosed please find a tentative schedule, meeting order and rules.

Council members please report to the meeting by signing and posting
the following message to council network before the meeting starts:

.......................................................................
   Meeting Chair,

   I will be in presence for the Council First E-mail Conference starting
   5pm CST (6pm EST), Saturday, April 16, 1994, in the council email
   network.

   I approve (or disapprove) the proposed conference schedule, order
   and rules.

   ----  ---- (signed)
   Member of IFCSS 5th Council
   Representing Region:  ---  ---
 .......................................................................

Interested public readers are welcome to audit the Conference.  Please
be advised that only council members, the IFCSS HQ and invited guests
are permitted to post on the council working network during the
conference.  Any violation shall result in, without warning, immediate
termination of the access privilege.

To audit the council email network (if you are not already on the
council-l net, please send email to:
        listserv@ifcss.org
with the first line of message of:
        sub council-l firstname lastname
Thank you for your attention.

-----------------------------------------------------------------------
                  IFCSS Council 2nd Email Conference
                              Schedule
-----------------------------------------------------------------------

Session Form:       Email conference

Duration:           One week (7 days)

Start Time:         6pm EST, Saturday, April 16, 1994

Proposing Deadline: 9am EST, Monday, April 18, 1994

Close Debate:       6pm EST, Saturday, April 23, 1994

Conference Adjourns:6pm EST, Saturday, April 23, 1994

----------------------------------------------------------------------------
                 Business Order of the Meeting
----------------------------------------------------------------------------

1. On adoption of Email Conference Rules and Order of the Meeting;

2. On IFCSS 6th Congress Location

3. On proposals moved before the proposing deadline;

4. On emergency proposals moved after the proposing deadline - see rules;

5. Vote on resolutions.


----------------------------------------------------------------------------
                    Temporaray Meeting Agenda
----------------------------------------------------------------------------

1. On IFCSS 6th Congress Location, to vote or discuss;

2. On preparation for the 6th Congress;

3. On MFN related issue; Report of MFN Survey;

4. Preliminary Report from the Council's Financial Taskforce;

5. To prepare for the next regular Teleconference.

----------------------------------------------------------------------------
                     Email Conference Rules
----------------------------------------------------------------------------

1.  According to Council Bylaw, Quorum of the meeting is 2/3 of the
    total member of the Council.  Currently, 2/3 of 16 is 11.

2.  According to IFCSS Constitution, resolutions are adopted by vote of
    no less then half of the entire Council membership.

3.  According to Council Bylaw, all council members are required to
    attend the email conference in one of the following two forms:

    a. Post to the Council email network during the conference period;

    b. If no email accounts, a member shall contact, before and during the
       meeting time two or more times with at least one Council member who
       has email access to Council net.  The said member's concern and votes
       shall be forwarded to the council email network.

4.  To be present in the email conference, a council member shall post to the
    Council email network before the Email Conference starts.  According to
    council Bylaw and previous practice, the announcement should be in the
    following form:

 .......................................................................
   Meeting Chair,

   I will be in presence for the Council First E-mail Conference starting
   6pm EST, Saturday, April 16, 1994, in the council email network.

   I approve (or disapprove) the proposed conference schedule, order
   and rules.

   ----  ---- (signed)
   Member of IFCSS 5th Council
   Representing Region:  ---  ---
 ...........................................................................

5.  Proposals are moved by one or more Council members before the proposing
    deadline.   A second is required for all proposals.

6.  Proposals moved after the deadline can only be accepted through the
    following emergency procedure.  It is the emergency proposal's author's
    responsibility to:

    1. Inform all council members at least 36 hours before the scheduled
       conference closing time;
    2. Receive a second;
    3. Receive at least half council members' approval for admitting the
       emergency proposal to the conference.

7.  Council Secretary shall assign a series number for each proposed
    resolution, and keep an official record of all conference related posts;

8.  All votes shall be posted on the council email network directly within
    the voting period (the last two days of the conference), including
    forwarded votes of members with no email access.

9.  Because of the characteristics of email conference, amendments shall not
    be voted on whether or not to be adopted.  Resolution's original author
    should consider suggestions, changes, etc. seriously, and make
    modifications with other member's help.

10. The validation of an email shall be determined by its posting time.

=============================================================================

Attachments:

1. Proposals for hosting IFCSS 6th Congress from three places.
   (will be sent separately.)

2. Resolutions proposed (to be posted)

3. Explanation of email conference procedure
   (Prepared by Chen, Dong for the first email conference)


-------------------------------------------------------------------------

**** Explanation of email conference procedure (Prepared by Chen, Dong)

Dear colleague,

     As this is the first email conference we have, I think it is
necessary to me to explain how the procedure should go. Please notice
this is only my own understanding and suggestion after consulting with
other people who have more experience in this matter. Please do voice
your suggestions.

[sign on]

     First we should sign on the net as soon as possible by sending
mail to "council-l@ifcss.org". In fact, you should sign on now.

[deadline]

     Then start from 6:00pm EST, Jan. 13, you can post your
discussion and vote to the net. Please notice the deadlines, i.e.
        - 11:00pm EST, Jan. 15 for vote of the CPA
        - 6:00pm  EST, Jan. 15 for proposing new resolutions
        - 5:59pm  EST, Jan. 20 for vote of all resolutions.

[vote]

     You can vote any resolutions as soon as the meeting starts.

     Please refer to the series number of the resolution (CP50**) when
you need to mention the resolution.

     Please post you discussion and vote as soon as you can. Don't wait
until the deadline, although I will try to remind you to vote in the
last two days of the meeting.

     You can vote for one issue at a time or combine all of them together.
Please write clearly which resolution you are talking/voting.

     All resolutions have to be voted, there is no unanimous consent.

[writing]

     For clarity, I suggest we write the subject line in this format:
        Subject: [area]<your name> message title
where [area] can be [vote],[discussion],[CP5026],[motion] etc.
the message title can be optional. For example,
Subject: [discussion]<Dong Chen> Who is responsible for the open letter?

     For rules that not defined in the order of the meeting, we should
follow the Robert Rule of Order.
     I suggest everybody check your email at least once per day.

Dong Chen


From dong  Sat Apr 16 01:58:00 1994
Return-Path: <dong>
Received: by ifcss.org (4.1/IFCSS-Mailer)
	id AA21846; Sat, 16 Apr 94 01:58:00 CDT
Date: Sat, 16 Apr 94 01:58:00 CDT
From: dong (D.C.)
Message-Id: <9404160658.AA21846@ifcss.org>
To: council-l
Subject: Agenda for the email meeting
Cc: council-wn
Status: RO


Dear Council members,
	As I talked with Yungui last night, we have these agenda need to
discuss in this meeting.

	1. Decide the 6da site
	2. Set up a 6da preparation taskforce
	3. Preliminary Report from the Council's Financial Taskforce
	4. Report of the council budget situation
	5. Other issues: MFN, IFCSS finance etc.

	We need to reach consent on 1 & 2.
	Also, we should rise issues that need to be prepare for the next
teleconference. Which include the report from financial taskforce set in
the round table meeting, suggestion of 6da agenda and IFCSS consititution/
bylaw.

	For the 6da site, I have talked to many council members. The opinion
are diversed. There are pros and cons for each site.
As Liu Zhengdong suggested, we should consider the site by:
    Transportation Cost
    Population of Schools around
    Medium Coverage
    IFCSS Congress History
    Support Team to Organize 6Da
    Boarding Cost

Here's my comparison after talk to council members and other people,
for your reference.

-Local Support
	All of three sites have great local support. And all place are very
	beautiful.
-Population of Schools around
	The Bay Area has a little bit more local schools. Madison second.
-Transportation
	The flight cost most likely will be high due to July 4th weekend
	for Bay Area, there could be promtion for airticket, but who knows.
	The airport in Madison is a small one, so price could be high.
	Again, if there're promotion, it can be affordable.
	Chapel Hill seems will have the cheapest ticket under normal situation.
-Time Flexibility (reservation time available)
	Chapel Hill are most flexible, Bay Area the least.
-Boarding Cost (lodge+meal):
	Madison:	$25 to $30 /per person-day
	Chapel Hill:	$18 /per person-day
	Bay:		$30.25 to $31/per person-day
-IFCSS Congress History:
	1,2,4,5 da was held in midwest, 3 da held in Mid-altantic
-Medium Coverage
	unknow.

Appendix:	Proposals

1. University of North Carolina-Chapel Hill,
2. University of Wisconsin-Madison,
3. California State University-Hayward.

==================================================================
	University of North Carolina-Chapel Hill

1. Housing

    On-campus housing will be available during the dates of July 18-July 
30,1994. 
    Housing rates: $11.00 per person/double occupancy per night without 
                   linen rental.
                   $13.00 per person/double occupancy per night with 
                   linen rental.

2. Dining

    The daily rate per person is about 5 dollars.(The manager of one 
restaurant is a friend of Liu Jian. He can offer a pretty good price.) 
Delivery will be no problem. 

3. Transportation

    Raleigh-Durham International Airport is about 15-20 miles from Chapel 
Hill. Most of the big airlines such as American, USAir, UA, Delta, NW, 
etc, operate in RDU. (Raleigh was ranked No.1 best city for business by 
Fortune magazine last year. The Triangle area hosts hundreds of foreign 
companies. The transportation is perfect in this area.) 

4. Volunteer

    We'll have 25-30 volunteers during the meeting.      

5. Meeting Place

    We can use a big classroom for free whenever there is no class(That's 
the place we played movies or video tapes to CSS.) 
 
The above are the basic information. If you need further information, 
please let me know.  

Wang Ji Ming
University of North Carolina at Chapel Hill
919-914-1291

====================================================

          Proposal for IFCSS Sixth Congress
                         by
           University of Wisconsin-Madison


Time:     The IFCSS 6th Congress will be held between July 21,                  
          (thursday) - July 24, (sunday)

Lodge:    There will be two person/room and $10.50/person/night.
          Delegates will be staying in center of of school where 
          is about 5 minutes walk from the conference room.

Meal:     At school cafeteria,the breakfast cost $4.50
          the lunch cost $ 5.00 and th dinner cost $10.00
          Note: For the dinner, local chinese restaurent will         
          take care for less than $5.00/person)

Conference:    Rm 3650, Humanity Building which can hold
               500 people in it. Movie can be showed in it.

Volunteer:     There are about 10-30 people helping the
               conference depend on the need.

Airport:  There is a international airport in Madison.
          Also, delegates can fly to Milwaukee, WI. It is about
          one hour drive from Wilwaukee to Madison.


==================================================================

        Application for Hosting 6th IFCSS Congress at San Francisco
                        Bay Area

Hosts:
        University of San Francisco
        San Francisco State University
        City College of San Francisco
        San Jose State University
        City College of San Jose
        California State University, Hayward
        University of California at Berkeley

Time:
        July 1 - July 4,
        Friday  - Monday, long weekends of Independt Day

Transportation:

        There are three major international airport in S.F. Bay Area.
in less than 50 miles radius.

        San Francisco International Airport :
                ---     Major international and national air hub.
                ---     25 minutes to hosting campus.
                ---     Easy freeway access.

        Oakland International Airport :
                ---     Major regional airport hub for West Coast region
                ---     15 minutes to hosting campus
                ---     Easy freeway and public access - BART (Bay Are
                        Rapid Tranport, the subway system in Bay Area)

        San Jose International Airport :
                ---     One of the busiest airport on West Coast region
                        located at Silicon Valley
                ---     35 - 40 minutes to hosting campus
                ---     Easy freeway access

Room :
        $15.25/person one day. Every apartment has two bedrooms, living room,
        kitchen, and private bothroom.

Meal :
        $15/person day for the all delicious CHINESE FOODS
        or $15.75/person day for buffet style meals provided by housing
        office.

Dong,

From dong  Sat Apr 16 02:00:00 1994
Return-Path: <dong>
Received: by ifcss.org (4.1/IFCSS-Mailer)
	id AA21908; Sat, 16 Apr 94 02:00:00 CDT
Date: Sat, 16 Apr 94 02:00:00 CDT
From: dong (D.C.)
Message-Id: <9404160700.AA21908@ifcss.org>
To: council-l
Subject: sign on the email meeting
Status: O

.......................................................................
   Meeting Chair,

   I will be in presence for the Council Second E-mail Conference starting
   5pm CST (6pm EST), Saturday, April 16, 1994, in the council email
   network.

   I approve (or disapprove) the proposed conference schedule, order
   and rules.

   Dong Chen (signed)
   Member of IFCSS 5th Council
   Representing Region:  Mid-Atlantic
 .......................................................................

From dong  Mon Apr 18 04:05:54 1994
Return-Path: <dong>
Received: by ifcss.org (4.1/IFCSS-Mailer)
	id AA07992; Mon, 18 Apr 94 04:05:54 CDT
Date: Mon, 18 Apr 94 04:05:54 CDT
From: dong (D.C.)
Message-Id: <9404180905.AA07992@ifcss.org>
To: council-l
Subject: Call for second council email confernence
Status: O

[I am resending this mail because I haven't receive it after two days myself.

>From dong  Sat Apr 16 00:10:45 1994
Return-Path: <dong>
Received: by ifcss.org (4.1/IFCSS-Mailer)
	id AA18974; Sat, 16 Apr 94 00:10:45 CDT
Date: Sat, 16 Apr 94 00:10:45 CDT
From: dong (D.C.)
Message-Id: <9404160510.AA18974@ifcss.org>
To: council-l
Subject: Call for second council email confernence
Status: R


 From:   Yungui Ding (signed) Co-Chair
         Dong Chen (signed)   Secretary
 To:     IFCSS Council, SVC, HQ, all CSS
 Date:   April 14, 1994
 Sub:    Call for the 2nd IFCSS Council Email Conference


There are several issues that the Council should discuss and make 
decision on in a timely manner. The 2nd Email conference is therefore
called.

The Email conference will be held during the time of:

  Start:  6pm Estern Standard Time (EST), Saturday, April 16, 1994
  End:    6pm Estern Standard Time (EST), Saturday, April 23, 1994.

Enclosed please find a tentative schedule, meeting order and rules.

Council members please report to the meeting by signing and posting
the following message to council network before the meeting starts:

.......................................................................
   Meeting Chair,

   I will be in presence for the Council First E-mail Conference starting
   5pm CST (6pm EST), Saturday, April 16, 1994, in the council email
   network.

   I approve (or disapprove) the proposed conference schedule, order
   and rules.

   ----  ---- (signed)
   Member of IFCSS 5th Council
   Representing Region:  ---  ---
 .......................................................................

Interested public readers are welcome to audit the Conference.  Please
be advised that only council members, the IFCSS HQ and invited guests
are permitted to post on the council working network during the
conference.  Any violation shall result in, without warning, immediate
termination of the access privilege.

To audit the council email network (if you are not already on the
council-l net, please send email to:
        listserv@ifcss.org
with the first line of message of:
        sub council-l firstname lastname
Thank you for your attention.

-----------------------------------------------------------------------
                  IFCSS Council 2nd Email Conference
                              Schedule
-----------------------------------------------------------------------

Session Form:       Email conference

Duration:           One week (7 days)

Start Time:         6pm EST, Saturday, April 16, 1994

Proposing Deadline: 9am EST, Monday, April 18, 1994

Close Debate:       6pm EST, Saturday, April 23, 1994

Conference Adjourns:6pm EST, Saturday, April 23, 1994

----------------------------------------------------------------------------
                 Business Order of the Meeting
----------------------------------------------------------------------------

1. On adoption of Email Conference Rules and Order of the Meeting;

2. On IFCSS 6th Congress Location

3. On proposals moved before the proposing deadline;

4. On emergency proposals moved after the proposing deadline - see rules;

5. Vote on resolutions.


----------------------------------------------------------------------------
                    Temporaray Meeting Agenda
----------------------------------------------------------------------------

1. On IFCSS 6th Congress Location, to vote or discuss;

2. On preparation for the 6th Congress;

3. On MFN related issue; Report of MFN Survey;

4. Preliminary Report from the Council's Financial Taskforce;

5. To prepare for the next regular Teleconference.

----------------------------------------------------------------------------
                     Email Conference Rules
----------------------------------------------------------------------------

1.  According to Council Bylaw, Quorum of the meeting is 2/3 of the
    total member of the Council.  Currently, 2/3 of 16 is 11.

2.  According to IFCSS Constitution, resolutions are adopted by vote of
    no less then half of the entire Council membership.

3.  According to Council Bylaw, all council members are required to
    attend the email conference in one of the following two forms:

    a. Post to the Council email network during the conference period;

    b. If no email accounts, a member shall contact, before and during the
       meeting time two or more times with at least one Council member who
       has email access to Council net.  The said member's concern and votes
       shall be forwarded to the council email network.

4.  To be present in the email conference, a council member shall post to the
    Council email network before the Email Conference starts.  According to
    council Bylaw and previous practice, the announcement should be in the
    following form:

 .......................................................................
   Meeting Chair,

   I will be in presence for the Council First E-mail Conference starting
   6pm EST, Saturday, April 16, 1994, in the council email network.

   I approve (or disapprove) the proposed conference schedule, order
   and rules.

   ----  ---- (signed)
   Member of IFCSS 5th Council
   Representing Region:  ---  ---
 ...........................................................................

5.  Proposals are moved by one or more Council members before the proposing
    deadline.   A second is required for all proposals.

6.  Proposals moved after the deadline can only be accepted through the
    following emergency procedure.  It is the emergency proposal's author's
    responsibility to:

    1. Inform all council members at least 36 hours before the scheduled
       conference closing time;
    2. Receive a second;
    3. Receive at least half council members' approval for admitting the
       emergency proposal to the conference.

7.  Council Secretary shall assign a series number for each proposed
    resolution, and keep an official record of all conference related posts;

8.  All votes shall be posted on the council email network directly within
    the voting period (the last two days of the conference), including
    forwarded votes of members with no email access.

9.  Because of the characteristics of email conference, amendments shall not
    be voted on whether or not to be adopted.  Resolution's original author
    should consider suggestions, changes, etc. seriously, and make
    modifications with other member's help.

10. The validation of an email shall be determined by its posting time.

=============================================================================

Attachments:

1. Proposals for hosting IFCSS 6th Congress from three places.
   (will be sent separately.)

2. Resolutions proposed (to be posted)

3. Explanation of email conference procedure
   (Prepared by Chen, Dong for the first email conference)


-------------------------------------------------------------------------

**** Explanation of email conference procedure (Prepared by Chen, Dong)

Dear colleague,

     As this is the first email conference we have, I think it is
necessary to me to explain how the procedure should go. Please notice
this is only my own understanding and suggestion after consulting with
other people who have more experience in this matter. Please do voice
your suggestions.

[sign on]

     First we should sign on the net as soon as possible by sending
mail to "council-l@ifcss.org". In fact, you should sign on now.

[deadline]

     Then start from 6:00pm EST, Jan. 13, you can post your
discussion and vote to the net. Please notice the deadlines, i.e.
        - 11:00pm EST, Jan. 15 for vote of the CPA
        - 6:00pm  EST, Jan. 15 for proposing new resolutions
        - 5:59pm  EST, Jan. 20 for vote of all resolutions.

[vote]

     You can vote any resolutions as soon as the meeting starts.

     Please refer to the series number of the resolution (CP50**) when
you need to mention the resolution.

     Please post you discussion and vote as soon as you can. Don't wait
until the deadline, although I will try to remind you to vote in the
last two days of the meeting.

     You can vote for one issue at a time or combine all of them together.
Please write clearly which resolution you are talking/voting.

     All resolutions have to be voted, there is no unanimous consent.

[writing]

     For clarity, I suggest we write the subject line in this format:
        Subject: [area]<your name> message title
where [area] can be [vote],[discussion],[CP5026],[motion] etc.
the message title can be optional. For example,
Subject: [discussion]<Dong Chen> Who is responsible for the open letter?

     For rules that not defined in the order of the meeting, we should
follow the Robert Rule of Order.
     I suggest everybody check your email at least once per day.

Dong Chen

From labhgz@unix.cc.emory.edu  Mon Apr 18 12:17:06 1994
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Date: Mon, 18 Apr 1994 13:13:06 -0400 (EDT)
From: Hongguang  Zhou <labhgz@unix.cc.emory.edu>
Subject: sign on the email meeting
To: council-l@ifcss.org
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Status: RO

   Meeting Chair,

   I will be in presence for the Council Second E-mail Conference starting
   5pm CST (6pm EST), Saturday, April 16, 1994, in the council email
   network.

   I approve (or disapprove) the proposed conference schedule, order
   and rules.

   Hongguang Zhou(signed)
   Member of IFCSS 5th Council
   Representing Region:  Southeast

From dong  Wed Apr 20 22:00:26 1994
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From: dong (D.C.)
Message-Id: <9404210300.AA09157@ifcss.org>
To: council-l
Subject: Please vote for 6da site
Status: RO


The first adgenda of this email conference is select the 6da site.
Please cast your vote as soon as possible.

From DING@vaxld.ameslab.gov  Thu Apr 21 13:10:41 1994
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From: DING@vaxld.ameslab.gov
Subject: IFCSS Congress site
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Status: RO


I vote for Wisconsin for the IFCSS Congress site this year.


Yungui Ding

From dong  Thu Apr 21 13:30:26 1994
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From: dong (D.C.)
Message-Id: <9404211830.AA04607@ifcss.org>
To: DING@vaxld.ameslab.gov
Subject: Re:  phone bill reimbursement
Cc: council-l
Status: O

>Dear President Lin Changsheng,
>
>I have sent the telephone bill reimbursement request for the
>Council members in the past season to you. I have reviewed them
>and hereby submit to the treasurer for final examination.
>Please process it as per the regulations.
>
>
>Yungui Ding
>Council Co-Chair
>
>
>List:  Zhou Hongguang
>         Telephone: Jan-Mar 1994     $1079.97

Huh???

>         Postage                     $67.23


Yungui, could you please let us know what's the council budget and spending
situation now ?
Also, can you clearify what is the reimburse review process ?

Dong Chen
Council member

From songlin@buphy.bu.edu  Fri Apr 22 11:00:57 1994
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Date: Fri, 22 Apr 1994 15:58:52 GMT
From: Songlin Ren <songlin@buphy.bu.edu>
Message-Id: <199404221558.PAA06854@buphy.bu.edu>
To: ifcssvc@ifcss.org, council-l@ifcss.org
Subject: Council Phone Bill
Status: O

Dear Council Members:

The phone bill of Honghuang's is really too much. It is over $1,000 in just
3 month period. It means he called about 2 hours long distance every day. I
think we should review the bill before reimbursement.

Yungui, please send the cope of the phone bill to every council member.  
I also like to know the amount of the overspending of council budget.
Yungui or Chen Dong should report it in the email meeting.

Ren, Songlin
Council Member of IFCSS

__________________________________________________________________

>Dear President Lin Changsheng,
>
>I have sent the telephone bill reimbursement request for the
>Council members in the past season to you. I have reviewed them
>and hereby submit to the treasurer for final examination.
>Please process it as per the regulations.
>
>
>Yungui Ding
>Council Co-Chair
>
>
>List:  Zhou Hongguang
>         Telephone: Jan-Mar 1994     $1079.97
>         Postage                     $67.23


From songlin@buphy.bu.edu  Fri Apr 22 11:14:06 1994
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Date: Fri, 22 Apr 1994 16:12:01 GMT
From: Songlin Ren <songlin@buphy.bu.edu>
Message-Id: <199404221612.QAA07538@buphy.bu.edu>
To: council-l@ifcss.org
Subject: VOTE -- 6da site
Status: RO

    
+++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++

The vote for 6da site

++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++

Dear Chair and Council Members:

Considering cost of transportation and boarding, IFCSS congress history
and CCS population of schools, I vote University of North Carolina-Chapel Hill
for 6da site of IFCSS.

Ren, Songlin
Council Member of IFCSS 


==================================================================
	University of North Carolina-Chapel Hill

1. Housing

    On-campus housing will be available during the dates of July 18-July 
30,1994. 
    Housing rates: $11.00 per person/double occupancy per night without 
                   linen rental.
                   $13.00 per person/double occupancy per night with 
                   linen rental.

2. Dining

    The daily rate per person is about 5 dollars.(The manager of one 
restaurant is a friend of Liu Jian. He can offer a pretty good price.) 
Delivery will be no problem. 

3. Transportation

    Raleigh-Durham International Airport is about 15-20 miles from Chapel 
Hill. Most of the big airlines such as American, USAir, UA, Delta, NW, 
etc, operate in RDU. (Raleigh was ranked No.1 best city for business by 
Fortune magazine last year. The Triangle area hosts hundreds of foreign 
companies. The transportation is perfect in this area.) 

4. Volunteer

    We'll have 25-30 volunteers during the meeting.      

5. Meeting Place

    We can use a big classroom for free whenever there is no class(That's 
the place we played movies or video tapes to CSS.) 
 
The above are the basic information. If you need further information, 
please let me know.  

Wang Ji Ming
University of North Carolina at Chapel Hill
919-914-1291

====================================================

          Proposal for IFCSS Sixth Congress
                         by
           University of Wisconsin-Madison


Time:     The IFCSS 6th Congress will be held between July 21,                  
          (thursday) - July 24, (sunday)

Lodge:    There will be two person/room and $10.50/person/night.
          Delegates will be staying in center of of school where 
          is about 5 minutes walk from the conference room.

Meal:     At school cafeteria,the breakfast cost $4.50
          the lunch cost $ 5.00 and th dinner cost $10.00
          Note: For the dinner, local chinese restaurent will         
          take care for less than $5.00/person)

Conference:    Rm 3650, Humanity Building which can hold
               500 people in it. Movie can be showed in it.

Volunteer:     There are about 10-30 people helping the
               conference depend on the need.

Airport:  There is a international airport in Madison.
          Also, delegates can fly to Milwaukee, WI. It is about
          one hour drive from Wilwaukee to Madison.


==================================================================

        Application for Hosting 6th IFCSS Congress at San Francisco
                        Bay Area

Hosts:
        University of San Francisco
        San Francisco State University
        City College of San Francisco
        San Jose State University
        City College of San Jose
        California State University, Hayward
        University of California at Berkeley

Time:
        July 1 - July 4,
        Friday  - Monday, long weekends of Independt Day

Transportation:

        There are three major international airport in S.F. Bay Area.
in less than 50 miles radius.

        San Francisco International Airport :
                ---     Major international and national air hub.
                ---     25 minutes to hosting campus.
                ---     Easy freeway access.

        Oakland International Airport :
                ---     Major regional airport hub for West Coast region
                ---     15 minutes to hosting campus
                ---     Easy freeway and public access - BART (Bay Are
                        Rapid Tranport, the subway system in Bay Area)

        San Jose International Airport :
                ---     One of the busiest airport on West Coast region
                        located at Silicon Valley
                ---     35 - 40 minutes to hosting campus
                ---     Easy freeway access

Room :
        $15.25/person one day. Every apartment has two bedrooms, living room,
        kitchen, and private bothroom.

Meal :
        $15/person day for the all delicious CHINESE FOODS
        or $15.75/person day for buffet style meals provided by housing
        office.

Dong,

From DING@vaxld.ameslab.gov  Fri Apr 22 11:51:37 1994
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Date: Fri, 22 Apr 1994 11:38:01 -0500 (CDT)
From: DING@vaxld.ameslab.gov
Subject: email conference going on
To: council-l@ifcss.org
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Status: RO


Chen Dong,

Please count how may Council members have reported to the
email conference. We want to make sure we have enough quorum
for the conference before we cast any vote.

I call on my colleagues to pay attention to the current
email conference. Please report to it if you haven't.
Please voice your ideas about the topics in our agenda.


Yungui Ding

From DING@vaxld.ameslab.gov  Fri Apr 22 11:51:40 1994
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Date: Fri, 22 Apr 1994 11:35:33 -0500 (CDT)
From: DING@vaxld.ameslab.gov
Subject: Re: Council Phone Bill
To: council-l@ifcss.org
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Songling and Chen Dong,

I appreciate your concern over the telephone bill reimbursement request
I sent to HQ. I view my role in this procedure as record keeping,
as I said in the DC Council meeting. I could only check wether
the requested item is related to IFCSS Council business ad is to
proper budget. I think it is the IFCSS treasurer's duty to check
it against other relevant financial regulations of IFCSS and/laws.

As for Hongguang's phone bill reimbursement, I don't see anything
wrong. How did I review it? I looked at the phone bills to see whether
it is under Hongguang's name and whether the claimed called numbers
are reasonable. Actually Hongguang has done a good job in filing
the reimbursement: he did it with the formal reimbursement form
from the HQ.

I guess the question is on the amount. I would like to voice my thoughts.
Yes, it is a big number. So? Should we criticize him or praise him?
I would like to praise him: he spent so much time on phone for the 
IFCSS business. Even the phone bills would be reimbursed, his time
on it is still a huge value that he contributed to IFCSS.

The question is: do we have limit to the amount that certain Council member
could be reimbursed? No. Shall we have some trust to our colleagus 
workers in their judgement in using their phone?
It is necessary to remind ourselves that we always need to save 
money for IFCSS. But, I don't see any problem in the reimbursement
request.

When it comes to money, it becomes sensitive. Yes, we all should be
cautious in handling it. But, when you work for IFCSS, you get 
bills for it, I don't know what you should do. If you don't ask
reimbursement, it's you high value that we should amdire, but you
can't require all others to do the same as you.

However, I think business is business. In such case, I would get my
reimbursement first. Then if I want show more support to the organization
I work for, I write a check to it as a donation. If you want to show
your high moral value, you can write the check as big as you like,
as frequently as you like.


Yungui Ding

From DING@vaxld.ameslab.gov  Fri Apr 22 12:05:33 1994
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Date: Fri, 22 Apr 1994 12:03:50 -0500 (CDT)
From: DING@vaxld.ameslab.gov
Subject: Re: Council Phone Bill
To: council-l@ifcss.org
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I forgot to answer your request about the phone bills.
No, I won't give you or any other Council members a copy.
1. There are about 30 pages. I don't have time make 16 copies
   of it.
2. I am not sure it is approriate to issue it to any others.
   Phone bills could include private information.

   At least in Iowa, there is such law that the telephone bills of
   senators and representatives should NOT be disclosed.
   I am not saying that this applies to us, but I definitely
   don't want give out the telephone bills of others, unless
   I am authorized by the ones themselves. Sorry, for that.


Yungui Ding

From dong  Fri Apr 22 14:15:52 1994
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From: dong (D.C.)
Message-Id: <9404221915.AA20298@ifcss.org>
To: council-l
Subject: Re: Council Phone Bill
Status: O

Sure, business is business.
First does council has budget ? 
Do we need any control it ?
Does working for IFCSS put no restriction on us at all ?
Do we, as honorable council member, have any self control ?
As most of us have access to mail, we should use more of it.

I am against over spending all the time. Not just because we don't want
waste, but most importantly (at least to me), it shows our careness.
I know there were a lot of things Hongguang had to deal. But
I don't think I can justify that huge bill. Maybe Hongguang has
his reason. So let's hear from him and review it to justify the whole
thing.


Dong Chen

From dong  Fri Apr 22 14:18:06 1994
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Subject: Re: Council Phone Bill
Status: O

>2. I am not sure it is approriate to issue it to any others.
>   Phone bills could include private information.

Then, how do we apply balance and check here ?

From DING@vaxld.ameslab.gov  Fri Apr 22 14:57:53 1994
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Date: Fri, 22 Apr 1994 14:56:10 -0500 (CDT)
From: DING@vaxld.ameslab.gov
Subject: Re: phone bills
To: council-l@ifcss.org
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> First does council has budget ? 
Yes!

>Do we need any control it ?

Yes! But tell me how. I am not making rule now, I am willing to
enforce any.

> Does working for IFCSS put no restriction on us at all ?
Too general a question. 

> Do we, as honorable council member, have any self control ?
Depends on each one's own value/trait/...

> As most of us have access to mail, we should use more of it.
Yes.

> I am against over spending all the time. Not just because we don't want
> waste, but most importantly (at least to me), it shows our careness.
> I know there were a lot of things Hongguang had to deal. But
> I don't think I can justify that huge bill. Maybe Hongguang has
> his reason. So let's hear from him and review it to justify the whole
> thing.


> Dong Chen

Yungui Ding

From DING@vaxld.ameslab.gov  Fri Apr 22 15:06:50 1994
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Date: Fri, 22 Apr 1994 15:04:25 -0500 (CDT)
From: DING@vaxld.ameslab.gov
Subject: Re: check and balance ...
To: council-l@ifcss.org
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>>2. I am not sure it is approriate to issue it to any others.
>>   Phone bills could include private information.

>Then, how do we apply balance and check here ?

Again, I don't know. 

In my part, as I have just said, I don't see any rule to be
against the reimbursement. What you said could all be valid concerns.
What should we do with these telephone bills? 

Besides, although this subject is important, I would like to
remind my colleagues that there is an email conference going on.
And there many important, urgent issues pending for your 
consideration. 


Yungui Ding

From labhgz@unix.cc.emory.edu  Fri Apr 22 16:20:41 1994
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Date: Fri, 22 Apr 1994 17:10:01 -0400 (EDT)
From: Hongguang  Zhou <labhgz@unix.cc.emory.edu>
Subject: Re: check and balance ...
To: council-l@ifcss.org
In-Reply-To: <01HBHA256B7C4DEHWX@alisuvax.bitnet>
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Status: RO

To my colleages in the IFCSS Council:

	 If all of us check all the affairs, financial and others within 
the IFCSS Council but also within the HQ, it would be very good for the 
future of the IFCSS. Don't you think so, my colleagues at the Council? 

	Not only check the cost, but also the benefit and outcome. At another 
hand, not only check our peers, but also check ourselves. Ask yourself how 
much work you have done rather than talking aloundly and doing 
nothing?

	Thanks.

Hongguang

> Then, how do we apply balance and check here ?

From labhgz@unix.cc.emory.edu  Fri Apr 22 16:32:19 1994
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Date: Fri, 22 Apr 1994 17:21:24 -0400 (EDT)
From: Hongguang  Zhou <labhgz@unix.cc.emory.edu>
Subject: Re: Council Phone Bill
To: Songlin Ren <songlin@buphy.bu.edu>
Cc: ifcssvc@ifcss.org, council-l@ifcss.org
In-Reply-To: <199404221558.PAA06854@buphy.bu.edu>
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Songlin:

	Would you please propose the post of the phone bills of the officers at 
the HQ on the net? Their travel expenses and other expendure?

	I don't have any idea at all about the the balance of the HQ 
accounts. No financial reports from the HQ for the 2nd quarter and 3rd 
quarter of the 5th term HQ have been provided to the Financial Committee 
to review, as supposed be under the Financial Regulations. 

	I would be happy to see not only the Council expendenture subject to 
the review but also the HQ running expendenture. And that's we are here 
at the Council. I think you would be happy to see that happening too, 
wouldn't you?

	Thanks and regards,

Hongguang

From labhgz@unix.cc.emory.edu  Fri Apr 22 16:33:15 1994
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Date: Fri, 22 Apr 1994 17:31:19 -0400 (EDT)
From: Hongguang  Zhou <labhgz@unix.cc.emory.edu>
Subject: vote
To: council-l@ifcss.org
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Madison.

hongguang

From ejwang@titan.ucs.umass.edu  Fri Apr 22 18:27:35 1994
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Date: Fri, 22 Apr 1994 19:25:38 -0400 (EDT)
From: ECHO WANG <ejwang@titan.ucs.umass.edu>
Subject: Have we got the quorum?
To: council-l@ifcss.org
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Can anybody tell me if we've got enough quorum for the e-mail meeting?

Wang Jing

From DING@vaxld.ameslab.gov  Fri Apr 22 22:30:13 1994
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Date: Fri, 22 Apr 1994 22:28:28 -0500 (CDT)
From: DING@vaxld.ameslab.gov
Subject: Re: Have we got the quorum?
To: council-l@ifcss.org
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Status: O


Let's count,
    Ding Yungui
    Chen Dong
    Liu Cheng,
    Wang Yu,
    Wang Jin,
    Ren Songlin,
    Lian Er
Did I miss anyone?


Yungui

From labhgz@unix.cc.emory.edu  Fri Apr 22 22:35:24 1994
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Date: Fri, 22 Apr 1994 23:33:31 -0400 (EDT)
From: Hongguang  Zhou <labhgz@unix.cc.emory.edu>
Subject: Re: Have we got the quorum?
To: DING@vaxld.ameslab.gov
Cc: Multiple recipients of list <council-l@ifcss.org>
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Status: O

me.

Hongguang

From songlin@buphy.bu.edu  Fri Apr 22 22:42:56 1994
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Date: Sat, 23 Apr 1994 03:40:51 GMT
From: Songlin Ren <songlin@buphy.bu.edu>
Message-Id: <199404230340.DAA23740@buphy.bu.edu>
To: Multiple recipients of list <council-l@ifcss.org>, council-l@ifcss.org
Subject: Re: Council Phone Bill
Status: O

Dear Mr Hongguang Zhou and all of the Council members:

Yes, Hongguang! I am also very concerned with the HQ financial situation.
I am interested in reviewing the HQ financial report also. The Council
should work with HQ, and ask them send the report to council as soon as
they can. If possible, I will be very happy to join you work for the 
financial affairs of IFCSS. But, for the same reason, we also need to review
our council's expenses, control council budget. We should save any penny if
it can be saved. BTW, we do NOT have any reason to use more money, because
others have spent more IFCSS' money. As a council financial committee and IT
member, you should know more financial management than me. 

I am not council financial committee member. But at this time I'd like 
officially asking both Council and HQ report the financial situation to
the Council. I think I have the right, since I am elected as a council
member by our CCS. 

Ren, Songlin
Council member of IFCSS from NE

From dong  Sat Apr 23 09:44:01 1994
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Date: Sat, 23 Apr 94 09:44:01 CDT
From: dong (D.C.)
Message-Id: <9404231444.AA22017@ifcss.org>
To: labhgz@unix.cc.emory.edu, songlin@buphy.bu.edu
Subject: Re: Council Phone Bill
Cc: council-l, ifcssvc
Status: RO

>	I don't have any idea at all about the the balance of the HQ 
>accounts. No financial reports from the HQ for the 2nd quarter and 3rd 
>quarter of the 5th term HQ have been provided to the Financial Committee 
>to review, as supposed be under the Financial Regulations. 
>
>	I would be happy to see not only the Council expendenture subject to 
>the review but also the HQ running expendenture. And that's we are here 
>at the Council. I think you would be happy to see that happening too, 
>wouldn't you?

I would say let's review them all.
I would like to see a thorough review of IFCSS budget and spending
from both HQ and the Finance Task Force in the next teleconference.

Dong,

From DING@vaxld.ameslab.gov  Sat Apr 23 11:25:41 1994
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Date: Sat, 23 Apr 1994 11:23:58 -0500 (CDT)
From: DING@vaxld.ameslab.gov
Subject: IFCSS 6th Congress -- Council's responsibility
To: council-l@ifcss.org
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Dear Colleagues,

I would like to remind ourselves that the preparation of the IFCSS
Congress is the responsibility of the Council. As time flies, it
has become a very urgent issue. Please pay special attention to the
first two items in the Agenda of this email conference:

     decide Congress site
     organize a task force 

As for the task force, in the past, it is composed of 3 from Council, 1 
from HQ, and 1 from hosting organization. If we follow this practice,
we need at least 3 Council members for the Task Force. Of course, all
other Council members are also obliged to do all kind of volunteer work.

We have to move this thing forward FAST! Please volunteer yourself
or recommend others to the Council. I think Liu Cheng, Chen Dong, Zhang Feng,
Songlin, Hongguang, Wang Jing, Qi Bing, ... are all good candidates.
Please tell us whether you will have time to do it.  

Another important issue is the financial task force's work. 
That's one key work this Council has been pushing hard, and now the task
force is there. Please start to work ASAP. Review the financial situation,
and draft the rules, and get the job done. So I suggest to let Hongguang
to head the task force, and Liu Cheng and Songlin could consider to work
for the Congress preparation.  Or Hongguang work for the taskforce and the
some other head the financial work.

Move on!


Yungui

From DING@vaxld.ameslab.gov  Sun Apr 24 12:38:21 1994
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Date: Sun, 24 Apr 1994 12:36:40 -0500 (CDT)
From: DING@vaxld.ameslab.gov
Subject: council email conf., council net, and ...
To: council-l@ifcss.org, council-wn@ifcss.org
Message-Id: <01HBJXEAB4VI68QXAX@alisuvax.bitnet>
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Status: O


1. head counting:
      Chen Dong
      Ding Yungui
      Liang Er
      Ren Songlin
      Shao Qing
      Liu Cheng
      Qi Bing
      Zhou Hongguang
      Wang Jing
      Wang Yu
      
Apologize if I miss someone.

2. Please always send your message to BOTH council-l and council-wn.
   to insure that your message goes to everyone. Council-l is the
   official site for conference.

3. Since we technical don't have enough quorum for the conference,
   and there are urgent issues that we have to deal with,
   I move that

   a. the ending time of the email conference be extended indefinitely,
      till our business is done;
   b. the discussion (whether formal or informal) on the issues be
      continuously conducted in the net. We will summarize and/or
      pass resolutions as soon as we get enought quorum.

It is a little bit frustrating, isn't it? 

Yungui Ding

From ejwang@titan.ucs.umass.edu  Sun Apr 24 23:06:19 1994
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Date: Mon, 25 Apr 1994 00:04:23 -0400 (EDT)
From: ECHO WANG <ejwang@titan.ucs.umass.edu>
Subject: vote on 6da site
To: council-wn@ifcss.org
Cc: council-l@ifcss.org
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Status: O

4/25/94

Re: 6da site selection

CSU-Haywood		NO
UNC-Chapel Hill		YES
UWN-Madison		NO

Wang Jing (singed)
Council member of NE region

From dong  Mon Apr 25 01:43:52 1994
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Date: Mon, 25 Apr 94 01:43:52 CDT
From: dong (D.C.)
Message-Id: <9404250643.AA28755@ifcss.org>
To: council-l
Subject: Quorum reached
Status: O

After digging out the error message from the listserv, I found we reached
the quorum. Somehow the machine eat Zhang Feng's mail (See appendix).
So for those of you feel have problem to post to council-l, please
send your mail to council-wn@ifcss.org also.
Right now Shao Qing and Zhang Feng might have this problem. 
I am contacting the system manager to have it fixed.

For people auditing the council-l, you can find archive copy of the on going
council email meeting in the ifcss.org ftp site under
	~ftp/ifcss/council/5th_council/email_meeting


===============
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Errors-To: server
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From: listserv@ifcss.org
To: chair@ifcss.org
Subject: Notification
X-Listprocessor-Version: 6.0c -- ListProcessor by Anastasios Kotsikonas
X-Comment:  IFCSS Chinese Community Information Center (CCIC)
Status: RO

Approval request from listserv@ifcss.org for posting the following
message to moderated list COUNCIL-L. If approved, send the following request to
listserv@ifcss.org:

APPROVE COUNCIL-L <password> 2793

If the message is to be discarded, reply with the following request:

DISCARD COUNCIL-L <password> 2793

----------------------------- message follows ------------------------------
>From zhan0002@gold.tc.umn.edu  Sun Apr 24 16:10:59 1994
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Date: Sun, 24 Apr 1994 16:08:47 -0500 (CDT)
From: Feng Zhang <zhan0002@gold.tc.umn.edu>
Subject: 
To: council-l@ifcss.org
Message-Id: <Pine.3.05.9404241647.A10735-6100000@gold.tc.umn.edu>
Mime-Version: 1.0
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6Da site: Madison.

Zhang Feng


From dong  Mon Apr 25 03:07:20 1994
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Date: Mon, 25 Apr 94 03:07:20 CDT
From: dong (D.C.)
Message-Id: <9404250807.AA00904@ifcss.org>
To: council-l
Subject: 6da
Status: RO

Here's the voting record for 6da site.
Chen Dong       	UNC-Chapel Hill
Ding Yungui     	UWN-Madison
Fan Hongran     	UNC-Chapel Hill	(*)
Liang Er        	UNC-Chapel Hill
Liu Chen        	UWN-Madison
Qi Bing         	UWN-Madison
Ren Songlin     	UNC-Chapel Hill
Shao Qing       	UNC-Chapel Hill
Shen Tong       	N/A
Shi Ze			N/A		(*)
Wang Jing       	UNC-Chapel Hill
Wang Yu         	UNC-Chapel Hill
Xu Datong       	N/A
Zhang Feng      	UWN-Madison
Zhang Li        	CSU-Haywood	(*)
Zhou Hongguang  	UWN-Madison

(*)
1. The voting of Fan Hongran and Zhang Li were from anwser message they
left in my answer machine.
2. Shi Ze is our new council member replacing Dong Liqun, still not able
to reach yet.
3. Council member Fan Hongran, Shen Tong, Shi Ze, Xu Datong, Zhang Li are
still not on line yet.

=======================================
The previous congress preparation task force consisted of
one from HQ, one from Council, one from SVC and one from local school.
For this term, nobody in these four group had experience prepare such
a large meeting. So I propose to add one more quota for the last term's
task force so that the coming congress will be planed in a more detail
and more successful.


-------------
Resolution:	Setting up the 6da Task Force
			by Dong Chen
	Be it resolved ,
	The 5th Council of IFCSS authorize the 6 members team of IFCSS
	6th congress preparation task force. The team consists the
	following, 
		one from HQ,
		two from Council,
		one from SVC,
		one from local site,
		one from last term preparation task force.
	Each member shall be appointed by the corresponding group.	


-------------
Resolution:	Report of the IFCSS finance regulation
			by Dong Chen

	The finance inspection storm of IFCSS has calmed down.
	However, no conclusion by the council has been reach yet. 
	Further, in the last council meeting, a special task force of
	Council was set up for improving the current IFCSS finance 
	regulation. (I haven't heard much news from this work yet.)

	Be it resolved,

	1. The council send a formal reminder to the HQ, Council Finance 
	Committee, Financial Task Force, that request them each to give 
	a formal report of the finance condition and new draft finance
	regulation of IFCSS to the Council in the next Council tele-conference. 
	2. The communication between those mentioned above should be kept open
	and post to council email network periodically, so that any further 
	dispute can be better evaluated and solved.
	3. The finance report should include at least,
		a. Current asset of IFCSS,
		b. The income and spending of this term,
		c. Estimate fund needed for on going projects before 6da,
		d. Estimate fund needed for projects that will across to
		   next term,
		e. Estimate spending for the rest of this term and
		   asset will be left for next term,
	Also, a special report should be made about the criteria for the
	reimburesments.


-----------------------

Dong Chen
Council member from Mid-Atlantic

From ejwang@titan.ucs.umass.edu  Mon Apr 25 12:14:56 1994
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 (8.6.4/8.6.4) id NAA18581 for council-l@ifcss.org; Mon,
 25 Apr 1994 13:13:00 -0400
Date: Mon, 25 Apr 1994 13:12:59 -0400 (EDT)
From: ECHO WANG <ejwang@titan.ucs.umass.edu>
Subject: Re: e-mail problem
In-Reply-To: <9404250807.AA00904@ifcss.org> from "D.C." at Apr 25,
 94 03:07:36 am
To: council-l@ifcss.org
Message-Id: <199404251713.NAA18581@titan.ucs.umass.edu>
Mime-Version: 1.0
X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4 PL22]
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Status: O

Chen Dong

	I still have problem with council-wn.  I don't know if I miss any 
other people's mail.  But I never get my own mail back if I send to it.

	Would you see to it that it get fixed?  

Thanks a lot,

Wang Jing

From dong  Mon Apr 25 13:45:07 1994
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Date: Mon, 25 Apr 94 13:45:07 CDT
From: dong (D.C.)
Message-Id: <9404251845.AA18285@ifcss.org>
To: council-l
Subject: Mail from Madison about 6da site
Status: O

>From liu@cae.wisc.edu Mon Apr 25 11:36:24 1994
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From: liu@cae.wisc.edu
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	id AA13618; Mon, 25 Apr 94 11:34:25 CDT
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Date: Mon, 25 Apr 94 11:34:24 CDT
Message-Id: <9404251634.AA13213@sun-7.cae.wisc.edu>
To: dong@ifcss.org
Subject: Re: consult
Cc: ciumad@cmgroup.engr.wisc.edu
Status: R

Dear IFCSS council:

There is an appointment between the official from University Housing Office 
and me in tomorrow afternoon. We will decide whether the reservation can be
formally made. 

I reserved the house for the congress in Feburary as a condition to host
the IFCSS 6th congress. The application was sent to the IFCSS council
for monthes without the any confirmation of the IFCSS council. Since I will 
not see the IFCSS council can not vote on the matter in the weeks to come, 
I can not hold the reservation. I will suggest to withdraw the application 
to host the IFCSS 6th Congress in University of Wisconsin-Madison. 

Chen Dong (council member), please help me to forward this message to 
IFCSS council net to inform every council member. I will forward this message
to Chinese Independent Union council for their reference. Unless there is
any response from either IFCSS council or CIU council by tomorrow morning,
I will ask the IFCSS council not to consider the UW-Madison for the hosting
campus for the IFCSS 6th congress.

Thanks for your consideration and attention.


Zhendong Liu (sign)

From dong  Mon Apr 25 13:54:31 1994
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	id AA18591; Mon, 25 Apr 94 13:54:31 CDT
Date: Mon, 25 Apr 94 13:54:31 CDT
From: dong (D.C.)
Message-Id: <9404251854.AA18591@ifcss.org>
To: ejwang@titan.ucs.umass.edu
Subject: council-l
Cc: council-l
Status: RO


Wang Jing,
	I don't see any problem with your account though.
I have received your mail sent to council-l . Did you receive a copy
yourself ? If not, that's because there is one option not set up in
the listserv for you. But don't worry, we hear you.
(The option is ACK/NOACK. You can get help file of how to set it
by sending mail to listserv@ifcss.org with message "Help" without the
quotes. Sorry, I forgot the details.)

Dong,

From dong  Mon Apr 25 14:01:13 1994
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	id AA18902; Mon, 25 Apr 94 14:01:13 CDT
Date: Mon, 25 Apr 94 14:01:13 CDT
From: dong (D.C.)
Message-Id: <9404251901.AA18902@ifcss.org>
To: council-l
Subject: vote for 6da site
Status: O

Sorry, I miscount Qi Bin's vote for the 6da site.
He still haven't vote yet. I appologize for the confusion to all of you.
Hope Qi Bin can make your decision soon.

Yu Gui, should we ended this vote by tonight ?
Anybody has objection ?
As you guys seen from Zhengdong's mail, they are quite unset now.
We have draged this too long. So if there's no objection, I will
feed the result to Hq and Zhengdong.

Dong Chen,

From dong  Mon Apr 25 15:17:47 1994
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Date: Mon, 25 Apr 94 15:17:47 CDT
From: dong (D.C.)
Message-Id: <9404252017.AA21604@ifcss.org>
To: council-l
Subject: Please check these email address
Cc: council-wn
Status: O

Please check to see if your email address below is correct.
These are people have posting privilege in the council-l.

# COUNCIL-L list
dong@ifcss.org council-l CCERRORS
dong council-l
council  council-l
council@ifcss.org council-l
chair  council-l
chair@ifcss.org council-l
ifcss@wam.umd.edu council-l
dong@fuzzy.umd.edu council-l
DING@VAXLD.AMESLAB.GOV  council-l
dlq@u.washington.edu council-l
hfan@newssun.med.miami.edu council-l
wangy@rtt.colorado.edu  council-l
wangy@rintintin.Colorado.EDU council-l
lianqi00@dons.ac.usfca.edu council-l
liuc@violet.ph.albany.edu  council-l
BGQI@medinfo.rochester.edu council-l
songlin@buphy.bu.edu council-l
qshao@VTVM1.CC.VT.EDU council-l
zhan0002@student.tc.umn.edu council-l
d259zl@utarlg.uta.edu council-l
xiubei@scripps.edu council-l
ejwang@titan.ucs.umass.edu council-l
labhgz@unix.cc.emory.edu council-l
yiping@ccit.arizona.edu council-l
 
	

From dong  Mon Apr 25 21:33:39 1994
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Date: Mon, 25 Apr 94 21:33:39 CDT
From: dong (D.C.)
Message-Id: <9404260233.AA04562@ifcss.org>
To: council-l
Subject: Xu Datong's new phone number
Status: RO

Datong just called me. He has moved and his new number is
(602)624-1391.
He cannot access email now. He want we keep him inform about
our email meeting.
His vote for 6da site is NC.

Dong,

From dong  Wed Apr 27 12:51:59 1994
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Date: Wed, 27 Apr 94 12:51:59 CDT
From: dong (D.C.)
Message-Id: <9404271751.AA17528@ifcss.org>
To: council-l
Subject: forward mail
Status: O

>From zx11@cornell.edu  Fri Apr 22 17:27:33 1994
Message-Tag: 2756
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	id AA27885; Fri, 22 Apr 94 17:27:33 CDT
Received: from [128.253.111.135] ([128.253.111.135]) by postoffice.mail.cornell.edu (8.6.5/8.6.5) with SMTP id SAA07537 for <council-l@ifcss.org>; Fri, 22 Apr 1994 18:25:30 -0400
From: zx11@cornell.edu
Message-Id: <199404222225.SAA07537@postoffice.mail.cornell.edu>
Date: Fri, 22 Apr 1994 18:26:32 -0200
To: council-l@ifcss.org
Subject: Re: Council Phone Bill
Status: R

Hi, Chendong:
   I forwarded you a mail for your reference.
   You are welcome if you 'd like to forward the relevant mail, 
  Regards!                              ZX
--------------------- 

I forgot to answer your request about the phone bills.
No, I won't give you or any other Council members a copy.
1. There are about 30 pages. I don't have time make 16 copies
   of it.
2. I am not sure it is approriate to issue it to any others.
   Phone bills could include private information.

   At least in Iowa, there is such law that the telephone bills of
   senators and representatives should NOT be disclosed.
   I am not saying that this applies to us, but I definitely
   don't want give out the telephone bills of others, unless
   I am authorized by the ones themselves. Sorry, for that.


Yungui Ding
-----------------------------------------------------
>From <Jiang Ling>Jiangling@mailbox.syr.edu


              On the Line of Another Financial Fire


   It's unbelievable Hongguang's phone bill is so huge! The more surprising
thing is that senior council member Ding Yungui asserted he would rather 
praise him. It seems to me there appears another financial debates and
fightings. 

   Several points should be considered:
   1. A person's contribution should be separated from spending. You can 
parise somone for his contribution, but you can't simply praise someone 
for the sake of his huge over-spending, which is very superficial, biased
and misleading. It is well know that there is no simple and straight 
correlation between how much you spend on and how much you contribute to.
Otherwise, how do ordinary people understand the word, "abuse", means.

   2. A budget has been set for council's expenditure, of which every
council members should be aware. If one has some basic sense of responsi-
bility, one should know clearly to what extent one can spend in terms of 
serving the IFCSS. It is nonsense to say there is no limit for council 
member's spending, only when one is naive, or thinking one way around.

   3. No one has claimed the phone bills are not valid SO FAR. However, 
when one swore to serve the IFCSS, a non-profit organization of students
and scholars, he must have borne relevant responsibilities to maintain
the organization healthier and stronger. Over-expending without clear
and rational explanation obviously contradicts this basic principle, which
only indicates one's overwhelming ignorance of what obligation he is 
bearing on.

   4. Mr. Zhou Hongguang is the most respected gentleman while he served
as a chair of FC to audit the financial status of the HQ, which expressed
an unbeatable capacity in terms of diligence, carefulness, responsi-
bility, and vision, towards the growth of IFCSS. Now, however, it seems 
that he is on the line of fire! I wonder how he felt when he counted the
hunderds of dollars of phone bill each time in past several month? Did he 
sense a little bit of impropriety in this regard, or still felt quite 
glorious and conceited while facing some friends' applaud without any
explanation to his dear council colleagues?  Of course only can he clearly
know what this huge phone bill means, in terms of serving the IFCSS, 
no matter how, for or against...




From dong  Wed Apr 27 14:52:54 1994
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Date: Wed, 27 Apr 94 14:52:54 CDT
From: dong (D.C.)
Message-Id: <9404271952.AA22495@ifcss.org>
To: council-l
Subject: Resolution proposed
Status: RO

Dear Chair and Council members,
	Please accept these two motions.

[note] we need vote twice, one for the acceptance of the motions to the
	meeting, then a second vote for Yeah/No/Abstain to the motion.
	I think these two bring ergent issues to the council.
	We don't have much time left before 6da, so we need to
	set up the 6da task force as soon as possible.
	We only have one tele-conference left. To better prepare the
	last teleconference, the second resolution is necessary.
	Also, please bring up issues you think we need todiscuss and finish
	in the next teleconference.

-------------
Resolution:     Setting up the 6da Task Force
                        by Dong Chen
        Be it resolved ,
        The 5th Council of IFCSS authorize the 6 members team of IFCSS
        6th congress preparation task force. The team consists the
        following, 
                one from HQ,
                two from Council,
                one from SVC,
                one from local site,
                one from last term preparation task force.
        Each member shall be appointed by the corresponding group.

-------------
Resolution:     Report of the IFCSS finance regulation	[revised]
                        by Dong Chen

        The finance inspection storm of IFCSS has calmed down.
        However, no conclusion by the council has been reach yet. 
        Further, in the last council meeting, a special task force of
        Council was set up for improving the current IFCSS finance 
        regulation. (I haven't heard much news from this work yet.)

        Be it resolved,

        1. The council send a formal reminder to the HQ, Council Finance 
        Committee, Financial Task Force, that request them each to give 
        a formal report of the finance condition and new draft finance
        regulation of IFCSS to the Council in the next Council tele-conference.         2. The communication between those mentioned above should be kept open
        and post to council email network periodically, so that any further 
        dispute can be better evaluated and solved.
        3. The finance report should include at least,
           a. Current asset of IFCSS,
           b. The income and spending of this term,
	      spending include:
		- The travel spendings of HQ staff
		- Phone bill reimbursements for each individual staff
		- Other reimbursement
		- All HQ staff benifits
		- Expenditure of Council and SVC
		- Expenditure of each Working Committees
           c. Estimate fund needed for on going projects before 6da,
           d. Estimate fund needed for projects that will across to
              next term,
           e. Estimate spending for the rest of this term and
              asset will be left for next term,
        Also, a special report should be made about the criteria for the
        reimburesments.

Dong Chen
Council member

From dong  Wed Apr 27 19:30:44 1994
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From: dong (D.C.)
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To: council-l
Subject: Letter to IFCSS
Status: O

>From yuhe@wave.gcn.uoknor.edu Wed Apr 27 17:54:58 1994
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Date: Wed, 27 Apr 1994 17:49:07 -0500
From: yuhe@wave.gcn.uoknor.edu (Yuhe Liu)
Message-Id: <9404272249.AA15470@wave.gcn.uoknor.edu>
To: council@ifcss.org, ifcss@wam.umd.edu, svc93@ifcss.org
Subject: Requesting Information
Cc: ifcssvc@ifcss.org, yuhe@wave.gcn.uoknor.edu
Status: R

Dear IFCSS President, Council, and Supervision Committee:

We, the undersigned Chinese students and scholars, IFCSS donors,
contributors, supportors, and activists, are writing you to request the
IFCSS operation related financial information. We believe that public
scrutiny by the constituents is indispensible for the healthy operation
and development of IFCSS. We sincerely hope that this request will
facilitate the on-going processing of the professionalization of IFCSS's
financial management.

Specifically we ask for the following information from the beginning
of the 5th term to the day the information revealed.

1. HQ

   A. The travel spendings of HQ staff.

   B. Phone bill reimbursements for each individual staff.

   C. All HQ staff benifits other than salary, for examples, medical
      insurance, housing subsidy, etc..

   D. Other perks if there is any.

2. Council

   A. Council members' phone bill reimbursements;

   B. Council members' travel spending;

   C. Other Council's expenditure and perks if there is any.

3. SVC

   The same as the Council.
 
4. Other operational expenditure

5. The amount of donated money for last year's midwest flood
   relieve, how much of it had been transferred to the related
   agencies, and the remaining amount that is still in the
   IFCSS acount.

Please send the requested information to the undersigned persons. If the
information is not available through computer email, please contact with
Mr. Yuhe Liu for a mailing list. All the cost should be paid by us.

Thank you for your attention. We are looking forward to hearing from you
as early as possible.


Sincerely,

Signed:

Name               Email address                     Telephone number

Chen, Dong         dong@ifcss.org
Chen, Shizhong     chen@molly.sdsc.edu
Ding, Yungui       DING@vaxld.ameslab.gov
Lai, Anzhi         LAI@CEBAF.GOV
Li, Jinghong       3dsys!jli@uunet.UU.NET
Liu, Cheng         liuc@wadsworth.ph.albany.edu
Liu, Chengyan      Rliuc@simon.wustl.edu
Liu, Zhendong      liu@cae.wisc.edu
Liu, Yuhe          yuhe@tornado.gcn.uoknor.edu       (405) 325-3503 (Day)
Lu, Chengdong      CLU@BIOMED.MED.YALE.EDU
Luo, Ning          NLUO@msvax.mssm.edu
Ren, Songlin       songlin@buphy.bu.edu
Wang, Jing (ECHO)  ejwang@titan.ucs.umass.edu
Zhang, Qingsong    qsz2u@faraday.clas.virginia.edu

From ejwang@titan.ucs.umass.edu  Wed Apr 27 19:39:28 1994
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 27 Apr 1994 17:38:26 -0400
Date: Wed, 27 Apr 1994 17:38:26 -0400 (EDT)
From: ECHO WANG <ejwang@titan.ucs.umass.edu>
Subject: second Chen Dong's resolution
To: council-l@ifcss.org
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Status: RO

I second Chen Dong's resolution of opening fincial operation.

Wang Jing (signed)
Council member, NE

From dong  Wed Apr 27 21:54:23 1994
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From: dong (D.C.)
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To: council-l@ifcss.org
Subject: Re:  second Chen Dong's resolution
Status: O

>I second Chen Dong's resolution of opening fincial operation.
You don't second my resolution for 6da task force ? (just kidding :-)

Dong,

From DING@vaxld.ameslab.gov  Wed Apr 27 22:50:24 1994
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Date: Wed, 27 Apr 1994 22:48:45 -0500 (CDT)
From: DING@vaxld.ameslab.gov
Subject: Re: Resolution proposed
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Status: O


Chen Dong,

Your second resolution is good. I am not sure whether the first
is really necessary. The Council in the past has worked for
the preparation of the Copngress (actually it is the Council's
responsibility to do so). And we can follow the procedure.
I don't see the need to make things more complicated.

The problem is that, from the current situation, we have seen
that it is not easy for the email conference to arrive at a 
decision. For your energency resolutions, we need to adopt it
first and then make a decision on them both by vote.
I don't know how effecient we can do it.

I hope you can reconsider your resolutions. Since the teleconference
is coming, this email conference can't be going on for long.
We really want to act quickly. It may be better that we can
let the volunteers from the Council start to work right away,
and leave the vote to the teleconference where it will be much
more efficient.

Yungui Ding

From ejwang@titan.ucs.umass.edu  Wed Apr 27 23:50:40 1994
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Date: Thu, 28 Apr 1994 00:28:16 -0400 (EDT)
From: ECHO WANG <ejwang@titan.ucs.umass.edu>
Subject: Re: second Chen Dong's resolution
In-Reply-To: <9404280254.AA06726@ifcss.org> from "D.C." at Apr 27,
 94 09:54:40 pm
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Status: O

> You don't second my resolution for 6da task force ? (just kidding :-)

	Well, I'd like to.  But I didn't get to read it yet.  Get your 
Ge1 Mer (Songlin's words) Ren Songlin!  He must have more time than we 
students.

From dong  Thu Apr 28 13:26:22 1994
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Date: Thu, 28 Apr 94 13:26:22 CDT
From: dong (D.C.)
Message-Id: <9404281826.AA03672@ifcss.org>
To: council-l
Subject: Wkae up, damnit.
Cc: ifcssvc
Status: O

Sorry to use that word. But where are you guys ?
Does anybody know we have a email meeting ?

Now let's come back to the email meeting.
We had several agenda. 
We finished the first one ,  select 6da site.
But there are many remain.
- 6da preparation
- (informal)report for the financial task force
- prepare for the next tele-conference.

The next tele-conference is only two weeks away. We need collect inputs
for what we are going to discuss, what things we need to finish for
this term (this will be the last conference we are going to have).
For previous conferences, our problem was we didn't have much thoughts
about what are we going to discuss. One reason I ask for this email
meeting was to force us to think about it.

By the bylaw, it is the Council's responsibility to organize congressional
meeting. That is precisely why I ask to set up a task force formally
to handle it. Sure, we can find people and have HQ to do the working.
But we need do this formally, and giving proper authorization.
Without following the rule and authorization, I only see potential
dispute and chaotic.
Do you guys have any idea how much time do we have until the 6da?
Do you have any idea how many things we need to do ?
Invitation to guesses, setting up congress agenda, calling 100+ schools to
make sure they come to 6da, contacting airline for group discount,
many small thing takes time.
Give you an idea, last term, the preparation started in January.
If we cann't set up the task force now, we should at least start work on it.
If we let HQ or who ever to handle it, at least we should have a consensus.

I know many of you are frustrated. But I have more reason to be frustrated
than anybody else and I AM NOW. Damn it, I'll say it again. Does anyone
else also have the feeling the whole council is just like a dead pig ?

Everybody ask to your heart, what have we done this term ?
How are you going to face all the delegates that elected you in 6da ?
I don't think I can proudly say I have done my share while the
whole thing is a mess. Maybe some of you can.
Think about every teleconference, they were just wasting time and money!
I guess we still have one more last chance to waste more money and time.
Why was it like chaotic for every meeting we have ?
Because we didn't pay attention, we didn't do our home work. Probably
we didn't even know what we were talking about at all.
And of cause, we don't know rules and we didn't even try to learn them
and enforce them. Why should we do that after all. We are THE boss.
Our honorable council, the "board of director" that representing
Chinese students and scholars in States, the boss of IFCSS,
if IFCSS has any glory history, we at most are the degenerated second
generation, self centered, self willed, irresponsible, lawless and careless.
But that doesn't matter, we are the boss. We didn't try to do anything,
therefor, we are no fault. If there are anything wrong, we can easily
point finger to somebody else, because we didn't do anything. Well, for any
credit, of cause, it's ours. See, we are the boss.
But I am just afraid there aren't credit for us to take. But who cares,
we will proudly say, we have been boss.
At last, we can always say, we are volunteers. So why should we do all the
extra work for teleconference, email meeting ? We didn't get a dime for
it. (Well, the telephone bill just show us how hard we have tried to work!)
While those @$$#*!&s in HQ get paid, certainly should do things to our best
satisfaction. So let's come back to 6th term again, I just want to be boss.

Dong Chen
Boss of IFCSS

PS, I am going to appeal to SVC against the Council for the violation of 
not implementing the resolution passed on 5da. The resolution says every
council member should contact at least half of the member schools each
quarter and report in the teleconference.

From DING@vaxld.ameslab.gov  Thu Apr 28 13:31:57 1994
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Date: Thu, 28 Apr 1994 13:30:19 -0500 (CDT)
From: DING@vaxld.ameslab.gov
Subject: From Yungui Ding (I): Email conference going on.
To: council-l@ifcss.org, council-wn@ifcss.org
Message-Id: <01HBPKRSA23M68RAKR@alisuvax.bitnet>
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Status: O

Dear colleagues,

There are several things that I call your attention to in the
following three mails.

1. The current email conference
2. Nomination for the 6th Congress Preparation Taskforce
3. Council Financial Taskforce takes action!

Please read them and help the Council to move on.

Yungui Ding
Council Co-Chair

---------------------------------------------------------------------------

1. The current email conference

===Time===

   We called it for the last week (April 16-23), but we actually fully
started this week. So let's keep the orginal time length of one week with
a time frame shift of one week. That is: April 24-30.

The email conference will end Sunday, April 30, 1994, 6pm (EST).

===Quorum===

We have had enough quorum:
     Chen Dong     Ding Yungui      Liang Er       Liu Cheng
     Qi Bing       Ren Songlin      Shao Qing      Wang Jing
     Wang Yu       Zhang Feng    Zhou Hongguang   
And Fan Hongran and Zhang Li have also voted for the 6da site, 
they should also be counted. 

===Site for 6th Congress===
   Chen Dong will count the voting result.

===Emergency Motion===

     (1) by Chen Dong: about 6th Congress Preparation Taskforce
     (2) by Chen Dong: about financial work. Seconded by Wang Jing.

The second motion is now on the floor for us to vote for *ACCEPTION*.


From DING@vaxld.ameslab.gov  Thu Apr 28 13:32:41 1994
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Date: Thu, 28 Apr 1994 13:30:57 -0500 (CDT)
From: DING@vaxld.ameslab.gov
Subject: From Yungui Ding (II): Nomination for the 6th Congress Taskforce
To: council-l@ifcss.org, council-wn@ifcss.org
Message-Id: <01HBPKSLB7HK68RAKR@alisuvax.bitnet>
X-Vms-To: IN%"council-l@ifcss.org",IN%"council-wn@ifcss.org"
X-Vms-Cc: FROM YUNGUI DING (II): NOMINATION FOR THE 6TH CONGRESS TASKFORCE
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Status: RO

2. Nomination for the 6th Congress Preparation Taskforce

I hope we will work out something in the current email conference.
However, considering the current pace, we may have to be prepared for
the situation otherwise. 

The preparation of the 6th IFCSS Congress is such an urgent task that
the Council has to take responsibility for. There is no time that
we can possibly let it pass by while waiting for nothing to happen.

I hereby nominate Council members

     Mr. Chen Dong
     Mr. Liu Cheng
     Ms. Wang Jing

for the 6th Congress Preparation Taskforce. This taskforce will also
include personnel from the IFCSS HQ and the Congress' local host school,
and IFCSS SVC and IFCSS veteran activist who are familiar with the
procedure of the Congress preparation work.

The Council's candidates (my this nomination) and the personnel of the
taskforce itself are subject to the final approval of the Council in the
following Teleconference. 

Right now, I call for the general consent from the Council so as to let
the above three Council members to start the preliminary work right away,
which includes, but not limited to,
     to coordinate the related work;
     to cooperate with the HQ,;
     to make the preliminary decision about the site (if the current;
        email conference will not be able to decide);
     to locate candidates for the taskforce from other mentioned branches;
     ...
(There are tremendous work need to be done in a timely manner.)
While you are doing so, please keep the Council (through council-l
and council-wn nets) informed of the progress, and prepare all the
questions and resolutions for the next teleconference to answer and
pass.

I call on all my colleague to give a high attention to this task,
and volunteer your time and ideas as much as you can. 

Chen Dong, Liu Cheng, and Wang Jing, if no objection is hear from the
Council, please you folks be prepared to work hard and take the duty.
(Of course, first, please accept the duty.)


Sincerely,

Yungui Ding
Council Co-Chair

From ejwang@titan.ucs.umass.edu  Thu Apr 28 13:47:25 1994
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Date: Thu, 28 Apr 1994 13:27:18 -0400 (EDT)
From: ECHO WANG <ejwang@titan.ucs.umass.edu>
Subject: Short report for China Trip
To: council-l@ifcss.org, ifcssvc@ifcss.org
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Hi, friends,

	Many wanted to talk to me about my trip to China, but I never said  
much.  I was home only four days, I dare not say that I've got the big 
picture.  I thought I'm the "optimistic" kind of creature.  But besides 
all the progress I saw in China, I've always had this heavy, sad feeling 
--for us Chinese, especiall those folks at home, for the way we've been 

treated, the way we treat each other.  Some friends asked me if I am too 
sensitive.  I wished they were right.  But after reading this article from 
CND, I know, sadly, I was right.

	Know my feelings, ~@#&%*! (you know what I mean, Chen Dong)

Wang Jing

> ----------------------------------------------------------------------------
> 3. A Home-Visiting Student Died in Shanghai Hospital ................... 115
> ----------------------------------------------------------------------------
> _From: <peterx@zabriskie.EECS.Berkeley.EDU> Date: April 14, 1994
> Abridged by: CND-US
> 
> ZHAO Hua, a fellow Chinese student studying at University of Wisconsin at
> Madison, flew home with his wife excited to visit his in-laws in Beijing
> and his parents in Shanghai on Dec. 26, 1993. But he never made the trip
> back to continue his Ph.D study. He passed away suddenly on Jan. 20 in
> Shanghai due to the flagrant negligence of some medical doctors in Huashan
> Hospital. The following is a summary of events that led up to Hua's death.
> 
> During his first week of stay in Beijing, Hua was prescribed some medicine
> for a dental ailment. He noticed that after a few days the medicine caused
> his gums to bleed but was not alarmed since he was in good spirits and felt
> fine. After traveling to Shanghai he noticed that he had blood in his urine
> and possible internal bleeding. He was sent to Huashan hospital on Jan. 13
> to have the symptoms examined and was diagnosed as being allergic to the
> medicine he was prescribed. He was advised to come back to the hospital for
> a blood test on Jan. 18. Again, the prognosis was that he was having an
> allergic reaction to the prescription medicine. He was assured not to worry.
> 
> On Jan. 19, his condition deteriorated significantly. When taken to the
> hospital, he was found to have an extremely low blood platelet count. At
> this critical moment, he was denied to stay in the hospital's emergency
> care room for the night even though there were still two beds open in the
> room. Under the sympathy of a nurse, his mother fetched a bed from home and
> set it up in a corner of the emergency room. Next morning around 8:30AM,
> Hua started to have severe headaches.  Until 11:00AM, the hospital finally
> allocated a bed for Hua, but no one was sure which bed it was and Hua ended
> on the ground for some time until the bed situation was resolved. From
> 8:30AM to 12:30PM, his mother went for doctors eight times, but they
> responded only three times.  In one instance, a doctor came and looked at
> Hua briefly. Then he asked if Hua could see clearly and left. In another
> occasion, a doctor told Hua to relax and take it easy. One doctor even
> criticized Hua's mother being too paranoid and said that panic would affect
> the Hua's spirit outside of the patient's room.
> 
> At 10:45AM, Hua couldn't speak any more. It was around 12:30PM that the
> doctors began to start their job. But before administrating the medical
> procedures, the doctors insisted on full payment, no matter how hard Hua's
> mother tried to convince them that money was on the way. Valuable time was
> lost.
> 
> At a critical time, Hua needed an infusion of blood platelets. The doctors
> said that they were out in storage in hospital. Hua's family was asked to
> find them on its own. When Hua's mother finally arranged to get the
> platelets from another hospital, the doctors didn't even make a phone call
> to complete the requesting procedure. Actually Hua's mother was told later
> by staffs in the blood storage center in Huashan that they were ready to
> make blood platelets at that time.  In all the chaos, when finally Hua's
> parents-in-law brought four boxes of blood platelets and flew in from
> Beijing, Hua had already passed away at 4:50PM. The hospital claimed the
> official cause of death was M2a acute leukemia. However, the family found
> on Jan. 19, a doctor made changes on Hua's Jan. 18 medical records.
> 
> In the aftermath, Huashan held two meetings concerning this incident. In
> the first meeting, they admitted in making some small mistakes in treating
> the patient. But in the second meeting, they disavowed any wrongdoing and
> responsibility.
> 
> Until now, Hua's family still cannot go back to its normal life. Hua's
> wife, also a student at University of Wisconsin, has to delay her study and
> stay at home taking care of family matters.  Hua's mother, a strong woman
> who hasn't recovered from the great pains of losing her son, was fighting
> an up-hill battle to see the justice served. But Shanghai Medical School,
> the management party of Huashan Hospital, is delaying an overdue
> investigation. Hua's former working unit refused to represent Hua because
> he was an overseas student. The help-me phone calls the mother made to a
> local radio station were disconnected every time without a reply.
> 
> This incident really shocked us who know Hua well from college. He was
> known to be in very good health and was the sports minister in his
> department student organization. He is survived by his wife, his
> parents and two 80-year-old grandmothers. His college classmates are
> all very upset by this unfortunate incident and intend to help his
> family to fight for his justice.
> 
> We have drafted a letter to be sent to the Chinese media, proper ministries
> and People's Representatives to ask for a thorough and comprehensive
> investigation immediately and draw a clear and fair conclusion for Hua's
> family. WE ASK WHOEVER IS CONCERNED TO CO-SIGN THIS LETTER WITH US. YOU
> CAN SEND YOUR NAME TO     peterx@zabriskie.eecs.berkeley.edu
> 
> For more information, refer to
> "ftp://swordfish.berkeley.edu/pub/fudan85.html" in your mosaic tool.
> 
> We have set up a memorial fund to raise money for Hua's family and to
> prepare for a legal action if necessary. Any caring individual can
> send check to
> 
> Qing Ke (Coordinator of Zhao Hua's memorial fund)
> Dept. of Electrical Engineering
> Hopeman Hall
> University of Rochester
> Rochester, NY 14627
> email qike@ee.rochester.edu
> 
> --a group of friends of Zhao,Hua <fudan85@swordfish.eecs.berkeley.edu>
> (Signed by: Guanlong Chen, Fei Deng, Fang Dong, Yitong Gu, Qing Ke, Zhen Hu,
> Jianfeng Ma, Jun Mao, Youbin Mao, Yuan Ren, Bing D. Su, Ye Sun, Zhen-Yu Sun,
> Jane Wang, Hong Xiao, Lixin Yang, Jihui Yang, Kun Yang, Weidong Yang, Hong
> Yu, Jun Zang, Donghui Zhang, Yuanhan Zhang, Jiangwen Zhu. 4/12/94)
>                                 ___ ___ ___
> 
> Apendix: A Short Resume of Hua Zhao
> 
> Hua was born in Shanghai on July 19, 1967. After he graduated from
> Fudan Affiliated Middle School in 1985, he went on to study at the
> physics department in Fudan University. He graduated in 1989 and went
> to East China Institute of Theoretical Physics as a research
> assistant. (The Institute is affiliated to East China University of
> Chemical Engineering.) Then, one year later in 1990, he came to
> America and went to Montana State University in Bozeman, Montana as a
> graduate student in Physics. In 1992, he started his Ph.D study and
> research in the Biophysics Department at University of Wisconsin at
> Madison.
> 
> 

From DING@vaxld.ameslab.gov  Thu Apr 28 14:02:03 1994
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Date: Thu, 28 Apr 1994 14:00:21 -0500 (CDT)
From: DING@vaxld.ameslab.gov
Subject: From Yungui Ding (III): Financial Taskforce, make it move, please!
To: council-l@ifcss.org, council-wn@ifcss.org
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Status: RO

3. Council Financial Taskforce takes action!

The financial work! We have made it a big deal in our term to push
forward the financial management further professionalization.
Although the financial inspection was interrupted midway, a lot
of questions have been opened in front of us for the Council to answer,
a lot of work for the Council to do.

Although I am not sure we will have enough time to accept and then pass
Chen Dong's resolution. I suggest all of us still pay attention to it.

As it is stated, a financial taskforce has been formed in the DC meeting,
which consists of the Council's IT (Inspection Team) members, plus
IT special guest Mr. Bai Yan, Council Chair Dong Liqun, and Council 
member Mr. Ren Songlin.

It is really time for the financial taskforce to start to work.
We have discovered problems in our financial system, and we have talked
about solutions to it. Now it is time to push all our past effort forward
to make it HAPPEN: to set up new regulations and new procedures.

Otherwise, all we have done will be NOTHING more than trouble-finding
(if not trouble-making :-). I believe, the Council has had the courage
to open the problem, and the Council also has the courage and willingness
and skills to solve them, to build up new things.

I call upon my colleagues in the Financial Taskforce to gear it
and get something done before the 6th Congress. Especially Mr. Ren Songlin
and Mr. Zhou Hongguang, please exercise your leadship, your experience
and your enthusiasm and contribute more to the cause of IFCSS.

In a sense, finishing the financial work we have started from the 
very beginning is as important as, if not more than, the preparation
work for the 6th Congress. We can only walk from here to there.
Without a solid here (5th term), I can't imagine how we can jump
to there (6th term). We are at the last stage of our term. Please
work hard to get to the graceful finish line.

My only suggestion is: cooperate with the HQ fully, and keep the
Council informed approriately.

Cheers,


Yungui Ding
Council Co-Chair


From dong  Thu Apr 28 14:34:35 1994
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From: dong (D.C.)
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To: council-l
Subject: Re:  Short report for China Trip
Status: RO

I think council should sign the letter and probably issue a statement
about Zhao Hua incident.

Dong,

From labhgz@unix.cc.emory.edu  Thu Apr 28 14:39:36 1994
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Date: Thu, 28 Apr 1994 15:37:02 -0400 (EDT)
From: Hongguang  Zhou <labhgz@unix.cc.emory.edu>
Subject: Re: From Yungui Ding (II): Nomination for the 6th Congress Taskforce
To: DING@vaxld.ameslab.gov
Cc: council-l@ifcss.org, council-wn@ifcss.org
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I'm ok with Yungui's nomination. Move on,

Hongguang

From bgqi@medinfo.rochester.edu  Thu Apr 28 20:13:19 1994
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Subject: A Chinese student's death 
To: council-l@ifcss.org
From: Bing Qi <bgqi@medinfo.rochester.edu>
Date: Thu, 28 Apr 94 21:01:44 -0500
Message-Id: <940428.210144.16845@medinfo.rochester.edu>
Status: O

Dear Council colleagues:

I just read the news about a Chinese student studying in Wisconsin-Madison who 
died because of the mistreatment from a Shanghai hospital during his trip back 
to China. I was greatly shocked. Some of the victum's friends and relatives are 
seeking for justice. I think IFCSS, the representitive of overseas Chinese 
students and scholars, should take actions to support them. I hope my dear 
council colleagues can push IFCSS-HQ to respond or write to the following email 
address to support their efforts: 'peterx@zabriskie.eecs.berkeley.edu'.

Thank you.

																																												 Sincerely yours,

																																																Qi Bing

																																														IFCSS Council member
																																														of the East Region
==============================================================================

Dear friends:

I am writing to you to sign the letter to be sent to Chinese officers anout Zhao 
Hua's case. I felt deeply sorry when I heard about Zhao Hua's tragic story from 
CND and hope justice can be finally established in China.

The whole thing shocked me as I recalled my own experience in Tsinghua 
University Hospital several years ago when I was still a student there in the 
school. Because of the ignorance and mistreatment of the hospital, it took me 
the following several years or may be the rest of my life (I'll never know) to 
recover from a disease which should be healed with in months. I could have been 
a victum like Zhao Hua in the emergency room without the help from a 
warm-hearted doctor who helped me to transfer the a better hospital (Bei1 Yi1 
San1 Yuan4), which proved to be no good either. During the several months of 
torture in the hospital, what surprised me most was that the whole medical 
system was rotten and the doctors who made the mistakes would never take the 
legal responsibility. A patient would never sue or even protest the wrongdoings. 
What they could do was and maybe still is to beg the doctors for better 
treatment. When I was in the hospital, I heard about a lot of mistreatments 
which were coverd up soon. All of us know how precious life is. But none of us 
know how many lives like Zhao Hua's are being neglected, damaged and even 
destroyed by the damn medical system! 

What happened to Zhao Hua may happen to anyone, to me, to you, to our mathers 
and fathers in China. Before the next trageties, let's take action!

Thanks you for your efforts!


																																												Sincerely yours,


																																																Qi, Bing 
From ejwang@titan.ucs.umass.edu  Thu Apr 28 20:22:40 1994
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Date: Thu, 28 Apr 1994 21:00:38 -0400 (EDT)
From: ECHO WANG <ejwang@titan.ucs.umass.edu>
Subject: Re: Short report for China Trip
In-Reply-To: <9404281934.AA06398@ifcss.org> from "D.C." at Apr 28,
 94 02:35:05 pm
To: council-l@ifcss.org
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> I think council should sign the letter and probably issue a statement
> about Zhao Hua incident.
> 
> Dong,

	Is that a resolution?  I would like to second (kidding)
	But I really hope we can do something.

Wang Jing

From ejwang@titan.ucs.umass.edu  Thu Apr 28 20:42:42 1994
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Date: Thu, 28 Apr 1994 20:40:25 -0400 (EDT)
From: ECHO WANG <ejwang@titan.ucs.umass.edu>
Subject: Letter for Zhao Hua's incident
To: peterx@zabriskie.eecs.berkeley.edu
Cc: ifcssvc@ifcss.org, council-l@ifcss.org
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Hi, friends,

	Please send your letter to the public.  I believe they would like 
to read it if they offer their signatures.  You may get some good 
comments, too.

	You have my full support!

Wang Jing
UMass/Amherst

BTW, has Hua's family taken any leagal actions?  If not, are they going to?

From DING@vaxld.ameslab.gov  Thu Apr 28 20:51:33 1994
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Date: Thu, 28 Apr 1994 20:49:51 -0500 (CDT)
From: DING@vaxld.ameslab.gov
Subject: Re: Letter for Zhao Hua's incident
To: ejwang@titan.ucs.umass.edu
Cc: ifcssvc@ifcss.org, council-l@ifcss.org
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Wang Jing,

The open letter is basically the same as what was carried by CND.
The letter was deleted during the editing to avoid redundance.

Just to let you know.


Yungui

From ejwang@titan.ucs.umass.edu  Fri Apr 29 13:01:56 1994
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Date: Fri, 29 Apr 1994 13:59:39 -0400 (EDT)
From: ECHO WANG <ejwang@titan.ucs.umass.edu>
Subject: Petition: Death of a student
To: st@pobox.ucs.umass.edu (TONG SHEN), council-l@ifcss.org,
        cpgis-l@ubvm.cc.buffalo.edu
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Dear friends,

	Inclosed is the petition letter from Peter Xiao, coordinater of 
Zhao Hua (UWI) case.  We got to know Zhao's tragedy, mostly because he 
was one of us--overseas students.  But such "accidents" are far from 
being unique in China.  Just think that's where our parents, our brothers 
and sisters live, that's where our home is!  It happened to Zhao Hua, and 
hell knows how many other lay men.  It could happen to somebody you know, 
you love.
	People from different places are organizing, trying to help 
Zhao's family to fight for justice.  As you all well know, it is 
extremely hard in China.  So whatever you can do, please show your support!

	The following is the petition letter calling for signatures.  You 
can send your signature directly to Peter Xiao at: 

		peterx@zabriskie.eecs.berkely.edu.

Zhao Hua's family needs you!

Wang Jing
____________________________________________________________________________
Forwarded message:
> From peterx@zabriskie.EECS.Berkeley.EDU Fri Apr 29 02:07:08 1994
> From: peterx@zabriskie.EECS.Berkeley.EDU
> Date: Thu, 28 Apr 94 23:06:03 PDT
> Message-Id: <9404290606.AA26845@elias.eecs.berkeley.edu>
> To: ejwang@titan.ucs.umass.edu
> Cc: ifcssvc@ifcss.org, council-l@ifcss.org
> In-Reply-To: ECHO WANG's message of Thu, 28 Apr 1994 20:40:25 -0400 (EDT) <199404290040.UAA04663@titan.ucs.umass.edu>
> 

Petition letter as follows:

> 
> To whom it may concern,
> 
> We are writing to you concerning the death of Hua Zhao during his home
> visiting trip in January 1994.
> 
> Hua Zhao was a Chinese student studying at the University of Wisconsin
> at Madison. He went back to China visiting his parents at the end of
> December, 1993. He passed away on January 20, 1994 in Huashan Hospital
> in Shanghai.
> 
> This news shocked many of us who knew Hua well before and could hardly
> believe a young and fulfilling life could end so suddenly.  More to
> our surprise, sorrow and anger, we learned later from Hua's family
> that some doctors in Huashan Hospital were totally irresponsible at
> their job and they were the direct cause of this tragedy. They made
> one mistake after another in the rescue process. Hua was denied to
> stay in the emergency care room for observation the night before his
> death when he was in critical condition already.  The next morning,
> valuable time was lost when some doctors insisted on full payment
> before they could start their medical procedures, even though Hua's
> mother repeatedly promised them that money was on its way. At another
> crucial moment, when Hua needed an infusion of blood platelets, the
> doctors said that the platelets were out in storage and the family was
> asked to find them by its own. When Hua's mother eventually found the
> platelets in another hospital, the doctors didn't even make a phone
> call to complete the requesting procedure. Actually Hua's mother was
> told later by staffs in the blood storage center in Huashan that they
> were ready to make blood platelets at that time.  When finally Hua's
> parents-in-law brought four boxes of blood platelets and flew in from
> Beijing, Hua had already passed away ...
> 
> A doctor was even seen to be changing Hua's medical records on Jan. 19.
> 
> After this tragedy, Huashan first admitted making a few small
> mistakes. But later it completely denied any wrongdoing and
> irresponsibility in the whole procedure.
> 
> Until now, Hua's family still cannot go back to its normal life. Hua's
> 80-year-old grandmother, who was so glad to see her grandson coming
> back to visit from far away, could not take in this tragedy and got
> sick in bed. hua's wife, also a student of University of Wisconsin,
> went back with Hua. She lost her husband and now has to delay her
> study and stay at home for a semester to take care of family matters.
> Hua's mother, a strong woman, who still hasn't recovered from the
> great pains of losing his son, has been fighting an up-hill battle to
> see the justice served. But she has encountered enormous difficulties.
> Shanghai Medical School, the management party of Huashan Hospital is
> delaying a overdue investigation. Hua's former working unit refused to
> represent Hua because he was an overseas student. The help-me phone
> calls the mother made to a local radio station were disconnected every
> time without a reply.
> 
> We think what happened to Hua and his family is completely
> contradictory to the government policy of encouraging overseas
> students coming back to visit, stay and work. It is also inconsistent
> with the policy of respecting knowledge and intellectuals. In order to
> prevent incidents like this from occurring again and to save all the
> patients who can be saved, we firmly urge you start a thorough and
> comprehensive investigation immediately and draw a clear and fair
> conclusion for Hua's family.  Your prompt action will show the
> sincerity to welcome overseas students back to China.
> 
> Hua's death is a great loss to his family, his friends and his
> country. His tragedy is not only of his own, but is of all.
> 
> He is always going to be remembered by us.
> 
> 
> Signed by 
> 
> Guanlong Chen, Fei Deng, Fang Dong, Yitong Gu, Qing Ke, Zhen Hu,
> Jianfeng Ma, Jun Mao, Youbin Mao, Yuan Ren, Bing D. Su, Ye Sun,
> Zhen-Yu Sun, Jane Wang, Hong Xiao, Lixin Yang, Jihui Yang, Kun Yang,
> Weidong Yang, Hong Yu, Jun Zang, Donghui Zhang, Yuanhan Zhang,
> Jiangwen Zhu
> 
> 
> April 12, 1994

From ejwang@titan.ucs.umass.edu  Fri Apr 29 13:21:52 1994
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Date: Fri, 29 Apr 1994 14:19:49 -0400 (EDT)
From: ECHO WANG <ejwang@titan.ucs.umass.edu>
Subject: Re: Zhao Hua's matter
In-Reply-To: <9404291807.AA28822@elias.eecs.berkeley.edu> from
 "peterx@zabriskie.EECS.Berkeley.EDU" at Apr 29, 94 11:07:05 am
To: peterx@zabriskie.EECS.Berkeley.EDU
Cc: ifcssvc@ifcss.org, council-l@ifcss.org
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Status: RO

Hi, Peter,

	I can't agree less with you.  We should respect Zhao's family's 
desicion. And if they need any kinds of help we should try to get them.  
And we should make as loud a noise as possible.  This kind of "accidents" 
happen too often in China.  It's not only due to one Zhao Hua, nor one 
hospital, nor one doctor, it's a general attitude in the society.  From 
the government down.  We can't stop them easily, but we've got to get 
some attention to the situation.  Wake people up with our noise!

	Any thing I or the IFCSS can help with, please let me know.

Thanks,

Wang Jing

From ifcss@wam.umd.edu  Fri Apr 29 16:59:51 1994
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Date: Fri, 29 Apr 1994 17:57:42 -0400
From: IFCSS HQ <ifcss@wam.umd.edu>
Message-Id: <199404292157.AA06187@rac4.wam.umd.edu>
To: chair@ifcss.org, council-l@ifcss.org
Subject: memo
Status: O

To: Council
From: IFCSS HQ
To: Council

Dear Council members:

Glad to know that you have chosen University of North Carolina
-Chapel Hill for the 6th IFCSS Congress. HQ want to thank all
three university for wanting to host the 6th IFCSS Congress.

The date for the 6th IFCSS Congress is July 21 - July 25, 1994.
Please set up the 6th IFCSS Congress task force ASAP.

Thank you,

Sincerely,

P.S. HQ will send the financial report to you
through e-mail. Please save it for your own
reference.
