From lads-l@spike.rice.edu  Sun Oct 10 16:33:23 1993
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From: "Yude Zhao" <yudezhao@math.princeton.edu>
To: Multiple recipients of list <lads-l@spike.rice.edu>
Subject: Re:  Anybody over 90 days approved?
X-Listprocessor-Version: 6.0a -- ListProcessor by Anastasios Kotsikonas
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Status: RO

So far it seems that there is no one who stayed in China for over 90 days in the defined 
period and got approved.
What is the current situation about fighting against 90-day rule?


----- Begin Included Message -----

>From lads-l@spike.rice.edu Sat Oct  9 11:57:02 1993
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Subject: Anybody over 90 days approved?
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Hi Friends, 

For some reason I stayed in China for more than 90 days during the defined
interval, and I filed my CSPA application in late July with a petition to 
waive the 90-day and evidence that my 92 day stay was involuntary. 
But I was denied by Eastern Center Acting director in a letter 
(dated SEP 22,1993) which  quotes the CSPA interim regulation:
"Since this restriction is statutorily imposed, the Service has no 
discretionary authority to waive compliance with the 90-day aggregate on
physical presence in the PRC, regardless of the reasons you may have been
forced to remain there."

Now, my question is, is the INS consistent on this? in other words, is
there anybody who has a 90-day problem and got approved?

I'd appreciate if you can provide any information, concerning this.


----- End Included Message -----



From lads-l@spike.rice.edu  Sat Oct  9 16:16:14 1993
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From: hua7291@med1s0.engr.ccny.cuny.edu (Mi Mi)
To: Multiple recipients of list <lads-l@spike.rice.edu>
Subject: Is this the approval notice?
X-Listprocessor-Version: 6.0a -- ListProcessor by Anastasios Kotsikonas
X-Comment:  Late-Arrival-DependentS-List 
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When I processed my temporary I-551, INS gave me a white form for inquiries.
It says you should not bother INS soonner than 60 days, or wait for more than 
90 days for your green card. From that, I sensed we should be able to contact 
INS card factory after 2 months and before three months has passed, not six 
months.

For ordinary GC, it takes 6 weeks instead of six months. So maybe we do not
have to wait that long.

Mi Mi


From lads-l@spike.rice.edu  Sat Oct  9 15:26:34 1993
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Subject: Re: Is this the approval notice?
X-Listprocessor-Version: 6.0a -- ListProcessor by Anastasios Kotsikonas
X-Comment:  Late-Arrival-DependentS-List 
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I think you don't have to worry about it.  If you are not going to travel
outside of the US within the next six months, the stamp on your passport won't
be necessary.  You will receive your GC in six months.  As for your lad, you
can just send them a copy of your approval notice in the name of your lad as
additional evidence for his/her application.  I went to Philadelphia yesterday
to process mine.  The officer there told me they won't accept any more
information for processing my lad.  She told me "your lad's case is pending in
this center.  Just wait for any further instruction."  As a matter of fact, my
lad filed her application on Aug.12, and she has not received any receipt yet
except one cashier slip of her application fee.
I guess there should be no problem, although I don't know how many are in the
same situation.
yl

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>From: Ping Ding <ping@summit.atmos.colostate.edu>
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Subject: Is this the approval notice?
X-Listprocessor-Version: 6.0a -- ListProcessor by Anastasios Kotsikonas
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Hi, there, my wife is a LAD and I got my approval notice
in the later September from Northern center which asked me to do the  
final processing.
We went to the Denver INS last monday with our friends who have the  
exact same situation with us. Strange enough, a lady there refused to  
stamp my passport and to process anything about my wife's  
application.
She told us (including our friends) what we hold is not a approval  
notice (even though it is absolutely a approval notice) and what we  
need to do is just to make a "special finger print and photo", then  
we should wait another I-797 from the INS center and bring it to her
in order to stamp my passport and get my wife's I-485 processed.
You know she is wrong but you can't argue with her.
Now the problem is I am not sure whether I can get another notice  
from the center or not, especially after I read the urgent notice  
about Northern center from IFCSS.
Any comments are appreciated!



From lads-l@spike.rice.edu  Sat Oct  9 12:17:01 1993
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Subject: Is this the approval notice?
X-Listprocessor-Version: 6.0a -- ListProcessor by Anastasios Kotsikonas
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Hi, there, my wife is a LAD and I got my approval notice
in the later September from Northern center which asked me to do the  
final processing.
We went to the Denver INS last monday with our friends who have the  
exact same situation with us. Strange enough, a lady there refused to  
stamp my passport and to process anything about my wife's  
application.
She told us (including our friends) what we hold is not a approval  
notice (even though it is absolutely a approval notice) and what we  
need to do is just to make a "special finger print and photo", then  
we should wait another I-797 from the INS center and bring it to her
in order to stamp my passport and get my wife's I-485 processed.
You know she is wrong but you can't argue with her.
Now the problem is I am not sure whether I can get another notice  
from the center or not, especially after I read the urgent notice  
about Northern center from IFCSS.
Any comments are appreciated!


From lads-l@spike.rice.edu  Sat Oct  9 10:55:38 1993
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Subject: Anybody over 90 days approved?
X-Listprocessor-Version: 6.0a -- ListProcessor by Anastasios Kotsikonas
X-Comment:  Late-Arrival-DependentS-List 
Status: RO


Hi Friends, 

For some reason I stayed in China for more than 90 days during the defined
interval, and I filed my CSPA application in late July with a petition to 
waive the 90-day and evidence that my 92 day stay was involuntary. 
But I was denied by Eastern Center Acting director in a letter 
(dated SEP 22,1993) which  quotes the CSPA interim regulation:
"Since this restriction is statutorily imposed, the Service has no 
discretionary authority to waive compliance with the 90-day aggregate on
physical presence in the PRC, regardless of the reasons you may have been
forced to remain there."

Now, my question is, is the INS consistent on this? in other words, is
there anybody who has a 90-day problem and got approved?

I'd appreciate if you can provide any information, concerning this.










From lads-l@spike.rice.edu  Sat Oct  9 10:19:52 1993
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Message-Id: <9310091516.AA21987@cs1.bradley.edu>
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From: weili@cs1.bradley.edu (Wei Li)
To: Multiple recipients of list <lads-l@spike.rice.edu>
Subject: Chicago INS information needed
X-Listprocessor-Version: 6.0a -- ListProcessor by Anastasios Kotsikonas
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Dear netters:
	I got my approval notice and I want to have my passport
stamped (temporary green card).   But few days ago, IFCSS sent the
North INS emergency notice saying that those who have already had
their finger printed and signatured don't need to go to local 
INS again.
	Now, my questions are:
	(1) Is there anyone who had his passport stamped in
Chicago INS, even though he has already had his finger printed
and signatured before?
	(2) Is there any lucky LAD who had his passport stamped in 
Chicago INS?
	Thank you for your attention!


From lads-l@spike.rice.edu  Fri Oct  8 20:44:42 1993
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From: jun@geol.niu.edu (Jun Qi)
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>From MAILER-DAEMON@med1s0.engr.ccny.cuny.edu Fri Oct  8 20:38:29 1993
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   ----- Transcript of session follows -----
<<< RCPT To:<hua7291@med1s0.engr.ccny.cuny.edu>
<<< DATA
>>> HELO med1s0.engr.ccny.cuny.edu
<<< 553 med1s0.engr.ccny.cuny.edu I refuse to talk to myself
554 hua7291@med2s0... Service unavailable: Bad file number

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>From: jun@geol.niu.edu (Jun Qi)
Message-Id: <9310090136.AA13967@earth.geol.niu.edu>
To: hua7291@med1s0.engr.ccny.cuny.edu
Subject: Re:  SOS; CSPA; Northern Center . . .

Dear Mi Mi Sr.:

Thank you very much for your reply and sample documents. They are helpful. . .

I did try your temp address but got bounced. This time I hope it works. . .

Thang (oops) Thank you again for your help!!
Have a nice weekend Sir!!

Later!!

Jun Qi


From lads-l@spike.rice.edu  Fri Oct  8 17:30:12 1993
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>From MAILER-DAEMON@med1s0.engr.ccny.cuny.edu Fri Oct  8 17:13:03 1993
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   ----- Transcript of session follows -----
<<< RCPT To:<hua7291@med1s0.engr.ccny.cuny.edu>
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>>> HELO med1s0.engr.ccny.cuny.edu
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>From: jun@geol.niu.edu (Jun Qi)
Message-Id: <9310082211.AA13670@earth.geol.niu.edu>
To: hua7291@med1s0.engr.ccny.cuny.edu
Subject: SOS; CSPA; Northern Center . . .


Dear Mi Mi Sr.:

I filed I-485 application with Northern Center on June 30 and haven't received 
approval letter yet.

On Sept 25 I received a letter dated Sept 17 from the Center asking me to
send in a STATEMENT regarding the DATE of initial and final arrival in the
States and BIRTH CERTIFICATE. I sent in the statement via Federal Express
on Sept 27 and also encloseed a letter explaining that I had secondary 
evidence of birth at the time of filing. I haven't heard anything from em
so far.

So I called em. Actually I've been calling em almost everyday. A lady told me
yesterday that I might belong to a group of people who miss some kind of 
files. She said no dicision has been made towards this group of people.
And she didn't know when and what. . .

I told em I came here on Aug 11, 1989 and never made any departure ever since.
Isent (typo) I send in the original I-94 on June 30 and now they returned it
and asked for statement and birth certificate. They don't care about INS
documnt but statement. . . As I don't have any relative living in China now,
and the birth certifa certificate thing made me very fra frustrated. . .

So what kind of group I belong to? And whta what they are gonna do to these
people? Would you talk to IFCSS to see what they can do to save this gru
group of people (I had contacted IFCSS about CSPA before but seems to me
they never listened to me). I know they will listen and talk to Mi Mi Sr.
And I know you will care about small potatos like me. . . As U 
As I have LAD I just can't wait to see the answers. . .

Thank you very much for you7r your considr consideration.

Sincerely,

Jun Qi

P.S. Sorry for the typos as I am sending the mail from my PC and I cannot
     correct those errors on this machine. I am soo (oops again!!)
     I'm sorry. I'm confused. . .


From lads-l@spike.rice.edu  Fri Oct  8 13:56:23 1993
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From: hua7291@med1s0.engr.ccny.cuny.edu (Mi Mi)
To: Multiple recipients of list <lads-l@spike.rice.edu>
Subject: West Service Center is still working on the CSPA application!
X-Listprocessor-Version: 6.0a -- ListProcessor by Anastasios Kotsikonas
X-Comment:  Late-Arrival-DependentS-List 
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Dear Netters: Just for your information, West Service Center is still 
working on the CSPA application. Be a little bit patient guys. Your PR
is guaranteed by the law. 

Many have asked how long a lad has to wait to get PR approved. Well, just
like we do not have any specific answer for how long a principal has to wait
to get PR approved, no body knows for sure right now. Since lads are NOT
covered by CSPA anyway, and are handled by all local INS at the present 
time, the procedure undergoing at each local INS offices is quite confussing.
Mi Mi Sr. has solid information on a definite person getting his lad wife 
approved and passport stamped with a real A# and I-551 form, and priority
date as his own, that is, July 1. While this process is in accordance with
INA, however, many have difficulties with other local INS offices.

Mi Mi Sr.

Message follows=======================================================



To: hua7291@med1s0.engr.ccny.cuny.EDU
>From: Shrourong Shu <shu@sanson.GEOG.UCSB.EDU>

Hi Mi MI Sr. :

After a long painful waiting period, I was notified by the answer
machine in Western Center of that my application has been approved 
on 10/5. It seems to me that INS doesn't suspend the processing of 
CSPA applications, but obviously their working pace has been significantly
slowed down. If you think this msg. can be helpful for those their 
application haven't been approved to ease their anxiety please post 
it. Thank you.


From lads-l@spike.rice.edu  Fri Oct  8 11:52:22 1993
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From: HONGZHI LIU <V099SJKB@ubvms.cc.buffalo.edu>
To: Multiple recipients of list <lads-l@spike.rice.edu>
Subject: Current LADs Situation at Buffalo, NY
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	Hi,  netter,
	FYI. Today, I came to INS at Buffalo, NY for my final processing.
 It took 45 min to wait and 5 min to make finger print and stamp on my
 passport. Lads was asked for the copy of approval letter of the principal
 and receipt for I-485. No immeadiat interview time was scheduled. The 
 interview time will be informed through mail as said by the official.
	Good luck!
	HLIU

From lads-l@spike.rice.edu  Fri Oct  8 09:29:22 1993
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From: hua7291@med1s0.engr.ccny.cuny.edu (Mi Mi)
To: Multiple recipients of list <lads-l@spike.rice.edu>
Subject: An interesting book 
X-Listprocessor-Version: 6.0a -- ListProcessor by Anastasios Kotsikonas
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Mi Mi Sr. has found an interesting book in his library. 

As for CSPA, many think it is for the human rights or whatever China is 
accused for, so it is for humanitarian reasons. But, since the Russia is 
democratic and no political crisis until recently (even though Bill Clinton
supports Russia Government anyway), what is S2201 for? human rights?
humanitarian reasons? Not quite likely. Just think about it. It was not 
for Russian refugees, political nor economical,  it was not for common 
citizens, it was for -----. Compared with S1216 ------. Interesting? 
What kind of conclusion we might have upon reading this S2201?

Mi Mi Sr. from New York City.

 Author:         United States. Congress. House. Committee on the Judiciary.
 
 Title:          Commonwealth and Baltic Scientists Immigration and Exchange
                   Act of 1992 : report (to accompany S. 2201 ... referred
                   jointly to the Committee on the Judiciary and the Committee
                   on Foreign Affairs) (including cost estimate of the
                   Congressional Budget Office).
 
 Publisher:      <Washington, D.C.? : U.S. G.P.O., 1992-
 
 Subjects:       Emigration and immigration law--United States.
                 Baltic States--Emigration and immigration.
                 Former Soviet republics--Emigration and immigration.
 
 


From lads-l@spike.rice.edu  Thu Oct  7 19:58:45 1993
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From: hua7291@med1s0.engr.ccny.cuny.edu (Mi Mi)
To: Multiple recipients of list <lads-l@spike.rice.edu>
Subject: Mi Mi' temporary Address.
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Dear Netters:

Due to system shutdown, Mi Mi has moved to a temporary account.

Please address your concerns to this account.

Mi Mi Sr.

 

From lads-l@spike.rice.edu  Thu Oct  7 16:19:12 1993
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From: hua7291@med2s0.engr.ccny.cuny.edu (Mi Mi)
To: Multiple recipients of list <lads-l@spike.rice.edu>
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   Date: Thu, 7 Oct 93 15:40:51 CDT
   Reply-To: ql7508@silver.sdsmt.edu
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   From: qi liu <ql7508@silver.sdsmt.edu>
   X-Listprocessor-Version: 6.0a -- ListProcessor by Anastasios Kotsikonas
   X-Comment:  Late-Arrival-DependentS-List 

   Hi MI MI Sr.

   A friend of mine asked me to post a question in the lads net. "Is
   the PR pending a lawful nonimmigrant status for a lad"? For
No. it is status pending. 
   example, a wife of F-2 filed her I-485 in August, her husband got
   his PR approved in September. Does the wife still have a lawful
   (legal) nonimmigrant status before she can get her PR?  Does the
She does not have a nonimmigrant status now since she filed PR.
   wife have to go to the third country to be interviewed?
No. If she was not in DED status prior to 7/1/93, in other words, her
hunsband kept his F-1 status in all the means up to 7/1/93, when he filed
CSPA PR.
   She is waiting for your answer.

Mi Mi



From lads-l@spike.rice.edu  Thu Oct  7 15:36:24 1993
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Hi MI MI Sr.

A friend of mine asked me to post a question in the lads net. "Is
the PR pending a lawful nonimmigrant status for a lad"? For
example, a wife of F-2 filed her I-485 in August, her husband got
his PR approved in September. Does the wife still have a lawful
(legal) nonimmigrant status before she can get her PR?  Does the
wife have to go to the third country to be interviewed?

She is waiting for your answer.


From lads-l@spike.rice.edu  Thu Oct  7 14:21:14 1993
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From: Jinsheng Liu <liu@dragon.ncsl.nist.gov>
To: Multiple recipients of list <lads-l@spike.rice.edu>
Subject: An LAD Interview
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The following is for your information only.

My wife had an interview at Baltimore INS yesterday. She filed her LAD
application early in August, so she got the interview notice. The INS
officer, a very nice guy, asked no question but requested my I-485
approval notice. He didn't say how long exactly the application could
be approved. But he said it MAY take six months.

From lads-l@spike.rice.edu  Thu Oct  7 14:04:05 1993
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From: hua7291@med2s0.engr.ccny.cuny.edu (Mi Mi)
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Hi, netters, there is a message from a western netter.

Please be patient. INS is still processing your application.

Good Luck to you all.

Mi Mi Sr.

=============forwarded message follows====================================

In-Reply-To: Your message of Thu, 7 Oct 93 09:16:19 CDT


  for your information only, I called western center yesterday (Oct. 6),


  the answer machine told me that I get approved and the notice was send

  out Oct. 5. I think western center is still processing the CSPA.


From lads-l@spike.rice.edu  Thu Oct  7 11:22:03 1993
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From: hua7291@med2s0.engr.ccny.cuny.edu (Mi Mi)
To: Multiple recipients of list <lads-l@spike.rice.edu>
Subject:  ***@SPOCK.SDSU.EDU: Re:some bad news from INS
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   Date: Thu, 7 Oct 93 11:01:53 CDT
   From: *****@proton.astro.uiuc.edu 


/   The same situation happends in the Northern INS center also. 

It seems to me that the INS officers are having a break now! Just think that
they had approved 16,000 in one week, and 26,000 in the rest of September!
The maximum annual approval number is only 750,000 world wide! They are 
very tired now.

Do not worry. Shi Heping told me before INS would work on after October 1.
The situation for them is not so urgent now. They got a whole year to do
things. Of course some principals will wait a little bit longer, and the 
lads will wait a little bit longer too. 

Anyone can call IFCSS HQ to find updated information and send it to the
net. 

Mi Mi Sr.


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From lads-l@spike.rice.edu  Thu Oct  7 10:33:35 1993
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From: hua7291@med2s0.engr.ccny.cuny.edu (Mi Mi)
To: Multiple recipients of list <lads-l@spike.rice.edu>
Subject: ***@SPOCK.SDSU.EDU: Re:some bad news from INS
X-Listprocessor-Version: 6.0a -- ListProcessor by Anastasios Kotsikonas
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Just contact IFCSS HQ, at 

IFCSS   733 15th Street, N.W., Suite 440, Washington, D.C.20005
        Tel. (202)347-0017  Fax:   (202)347-0018

Mi Mi Sr.

=====message follows======================================


Date:    Thu, 7 Oct 1993 8:23:44 PDT
>From: ***@SPOCK.SDSU.EDU
Subject: Re:some bad news from INS
To: hua7291@med2s0.engr.ccny.cuny.edu
X-Vmsmail-To: SMTP%"hua7291@med2s0.engr.ccny.cuny.edu"


I also called INS western center. The officer told me the next year's 
left-over visa number will not be available until Aug.1994. This message
is conflict whith IFCSS HD's which states INS can continue process our
applications after Sep. 30. ANd obviouly, western center did not process
applications based on priority date.

Can somebody investgate and give more info. Thanks a lot!


From lads-l@spike.rice.edu  Thu Oct  7 10:23:14 1993
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From: hua7291@med2s0.engr.ccny.cuny.edu (Mi Mi)
To: Multiple recipients of list <lads-l@spike.rice.edu>
Subject: Interview in Mexico for the out-of-status LADs
X-Listprocessor-Version: 6.0a -- ListProcessor by Anastasios Kotsikonas
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   Date: Thu, 7 Oct 93 10:12:29 CDT
   From: zhu@spec.mda.uth.tmc.edu (Yunqiang Zhu)


   > From lads-l@spike.rice.edu Thu Oct  7 09:36:34 1993
   > Date: Thu, 7 Oct 93 09:36:12 CDT
   > Reply-To: hua7291@med2s0.engr.ccny.cuny.edu
   > Originator: lads-l@spike.rice.edu
   > Sender: lads-l@spike.rice.edu
   > From: hua7291@med2s0.engr.ccny.cuny.edu (Mi Mi)
   > To: Multiple recipients of list <lads-l@spike.rice.edu>
   > Subject: Interview in Mexico for the out-of-status LADs


   > It is quite clear. It is the law. According to INA, an out-of-status Alien
   > can not adjust immigration status inside USA, even he/she is eligible for
   > the immigration benefits. So any one who is out-of-status and wants to
   > adjust immigration status must go to a U.S. Consulate overseas for interview.
   > For CSPA DED lads, this can be arranged in Mexico or Canada. It is not news,
   > but the decision finalized.   
   > ^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^
   > Mi Mi Sr.
   > 
   > Lads-Net Committee

   Who told you that out-of-status LADs can go to Mexico or Canada has
   been finalized?  Is this reliable information? The World Journal has
   a bad reputation on reliability. If the World Journal is very reliable,
   Deng Xiaoping was dead 3 or 4 times.

   Can you confirm this information? If it is true, then it is a really
   good news from out-of-status LADs.


   Y. Zhu

Just pick up phone and call IFCSS HQ. They should know it.
What I meant it was not a surpprise to ME AT ALL.

Mi Mi


From lads-l@spike.rice.edu  Thu Oct  7 10:17:44 1993
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From: zhu@spec.mda.uth.tmc.edu (Yunqiang Zhu)
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Subject: Re: Interview in Mexico for the out-of-status LADs
X-Listprocessor-Version: 6.0a -- ListProcessor by Anastasios Kotsikonas
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> From lads-l@spike.rice.edu Thu Oct  7 09:36:34 1993
> Date: Thu, 7 Oct 93 09:36:12 CDT
> Reply-To: hua7291@med2s0.engr.ccny.cuny.edu
> Originator: lads-l@spike.rice.edu
> Sender: lads-l@spike.rice.edu
> From: hua7291@med2s0.engr.ccny.cuny.edu (Mi Mi)
> To: Multiple recipients of list <lads-l@spike.rice.edu>
> Subject: Interview in Mexico for the out-of-status LADs


> It is quite clear. It is the law. According to INA, an out-of-status Alien
> can not adjust immigration status inside USA, even he/she is eligible for
> the immigration benefits. So any one who is out-of-status and wants to
> adjust immigration status must go to a U.S. Consulate overseas for interview.
> For CSPA DED lads, this can be arranged in Mexico or Canada. It is not news,
> but the decision finalized.   
> ^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^
> Mi Mi Sr.
> 
> Lads-Net Committee

Who told you that out-of-status LADs can go to Mexico or Canada has
been finalized?  Is this reliable information? The World Journal has
a bad reputation on reliability. If the World Journal is very reliable,
Deng Xiaoping was dead 3 or 4 times.

Can you confirm this information? If it is true, then it is a really
good news from out-of-status LADs.


Y. Zhu

From lads-l@spike.rice.edu  Thu Oct  7 09:36:12 1993
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From: hua7291@med2s0.engr.ccny.cuny.edu (Mi Mi)
To: Multiple recipients of list <lads-l@spike.rice.edu>
Subject: Interview in Mexico for the out-of-status LADs
X-Listprocessor-Version: 6.0a -- ListProcessor by Anastasios Kotsikonas
X-Comment:  Late-Arrival-DependentS-List 
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>From: eddavid@media.mit.edu

/Dear Netters:

/Has anybody read the article about the LADs on October 5 issue of the
/World Journal?

/According to the article, the State Department said that the out-of-status
/LADs may go to the U.S. Consulate at Ciudad Juarez, Mexico for the
/final interview to adjust status to permanent resident.  Also, the INS is
/studying the issue of voluntary departure for out-of-status LADs.

/Is the interview place in Mexico for sure?  Why neither IFCSS nor Dr.
/Haiching Zhao mentions this matter?  Does any netter have further
/information about it?

/Thanks for your attention.

/Jane

It is quite clear. It is the law. According to INA, an out-of-status Alien
can not adjust immigration status inside USA, even he/she is eligible for
the immigration benefits. So any one who is out-of-status and wants to
adjust immigration status must go to a U.S. Consulate overseas for interview.
For CSPA DED lads, this can be arranged in Mexico or Canada. It is not news,
but the decision finalized.  

Mi Mi Sr.

Lads-Net Committee






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From lads-l@spike.rice.edu  Thu Oct  7 09:15:13 1993
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Date: Thu, 7 Oct 93 09:15:13 CDT
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From: hua7291@med2s0.engr.ccny.cuny.edu (Mi Mi)
To: Multiple recipients of list <lads-l@spike.rice.edu>
Subject: 
X-Listprocessor-Version: 6.0a -- ListProcessor by Anastasios Kotsikonas
X-Comment:  Late-Arrival-DependentS-List 
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The following is the message from a netter resides in the western region. 
Mi Mi Sr. has forwarded his message to IFCSS HQ. Hopefully this problem will
be resolved quickly.

Mi Mi Sr.

Lads-Net Committee


----------------forwarded message below------------------------------------

 
Date:     Wed, 6 Oct 93 17:06:15 PDT
>From: ***@pollux.GEOG.UCSB.EDU
Subject:  some bad news from INS
To: hua7291@med2s0.engr.ccny.cuny.EDU


Hi Mi MI Sr.:

There are still a quite few CSPA principals who have not received their 
approval notices so far although most CSPA have. Today is Oct. 6.

At UCSB campus, there are about 16 CSPA applicants, 4 of them haven't 
got approved.

At UCI campus, also 4 CSPA applicants have not received the approval notice.

A friend of mine who is currently working for a company in Los Angeles. 
only 2 of 8 CSPA applicants there haven't been approved. Two days ago 
one of them called the INS Western Center. It took about 40 mins. to
get through. She (CSPA applicant) wanted to find out why her application 
has not been approved and what's going on there in the Western Center. A 
INS officer gave her the following simple, but very discouraging answer: 
"We have suspended the processing of PR application under CSPA. The 
processing will not be resumed until September of next year (1994)...." 
which means she has to wait until next Sept.

Personaly I believe this msg. it true. I haven't got my approval notice 
yet so far. As far as I know, 4 CSPA applicants at our campus submitted 
their application on 6/30 or 7/1/93. none of them mailed their application 
later than 7/1.

CND's latest report on CSPA mentioned that all 42,000 leftover had been 
used up by 9/30/93, so most CSPA applicants will receive their approval 
notices in next few days if they haven't received yet. This news release 
is totally different from what the INS officer said at INS Western Center.

Statistically there are about 20-25% CSPA applicants haven't been approved. 
They are worry about what will happen to them. There is no channel which 
they can use to contact INS western center to figure out what's going on 
there. They feel they should do something about their pending cases, but
they don't know what should be done.

Do you have any idea and comments on the issue reported in this mail. Do 
you have any solutions about this problem. I am looking forward to hearing 
from you since you always can provide lots of options or alternatives. Thank 
you for your attention.


From lads-l@spike.rice.edu  Thu Oct  7 08:38:25 1993
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Date: Thu, 7 Oct 93 08:38:25 CDT
Message-Id: <9310071335.AA01479@lamont.ldgo.columbia.edu>
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From: cheng@lamont.ldgo.columbia.edu
To: Multiple recipients of list <lads-l@spike.rice.edu>
Subject: Re: Different A# in Approval Notice
X-Listprocessor-Version: 6.0a -- ListProcessor by Anastasios Kotsikonas
X-Comment:  Late-Arrival-DependentS-List 
Status: RO

> From lads-l@spike.rice.edu Thu Oct  7 09:09:38 1993
> Date: Thu, 7 Oct 93 08:11:01 CDT
> Reply-To: hzg9064@uxa.cso.uiuc.edu
> Originator: lads-l@spike.rice.edu
> Sender: lads-l@spike.rice.edu
> From: Huirong Zhu  <hzg9064@uxa.cso.uiuc.edu>
> To: Multiple recipients of list <lads-l@spike.rice.edu>
> Subject: Different A# in Approval Notice
> X-Listprocessor-Version: 6.0a -- ListProcessor by Anastasios Kotsikonas
> X-Comment:  Late-Arrival-DependentS-List 
> Content-Length: 761
> 
> 
> Hi, there.
> 	I have one question on the approval notice of CSPA.  I noticed that
> my A# on it is different from that on the receipt of the application file.
> Is it a mistake? At least I know one of my friends is in the same situation
> as mine.  Since I have a lad who filed I-485 and was interviewed at local
> INS based on my application receipt (so registered my formal A#) and got
> a letter saying that the final process will wait for my approval notice, what
> will happen now if I mail them a approval notice with a different A# (it is
> supposed to be the same, I think)?  Should I contact the Northen Center
> where my application was procesed before I send the required copy out to
> local INS or just go to local INS to ask?
> 	Thanx for your attention.  Good luck.
> 
> 
> 

Any New Jersey LAD got an interview for I-485 or got a work permit?

Frank.


From lads-l@spike.rice.edu  Thu Oct  7 08:11:01 1993
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Date: Thu, 7 Oct 93 08:11:01 CDT
Message-Id: <199310071305.AA20990@uxa.cso.uiuc.edu>
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Originator: lads-l@spike.rice.edu
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From: Huirong Zhu  <hzg9064@uxa.cso.uiuc.edu>
To: Multiple recipients of list <lads-l@spike.rice.edu>
Subject: Different A# in Approval Notice
X-Listprocessor-Version: 6.0a -- ListProcessor by Anastasios Kotsikonas
X-Comment:  Late-Arrival-DependentS-List 
Status: RO


Hi, there.
	I have one question on the approval notice of CSPA.  I noticed that
my A# on it is different from that on the receipt of the application file.
Is it a mistake? At least I know one of my friends is in the same situation
as mine.  Since I have a lad who filed I-485 and was interviewed at local
INS based on my application receipt (so registered my formal A#) and got
a letter saying that the final process will wait for my approval notice, what
will happen now if I mail them a approval notice with a different A# (it is
supposed to be the same, I think)?  Should I contact the Northen Center
where my application was procesed before I send the required copy out to
local INS or just go to local INS to ask?
	Thanx for your attention.  Good luck.



From lads-l@spike.rice.edu  Thu Oct  7 08:05:59 1993
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From: Ed David <eddavid@media.mit.edu>
To: Multiple recipients of list <lads-l@spike.rice.edu>
Subject: Interpview in Mexico for the out-sof-statsus LADs
X-Listprocessor-Version: 6.0a -- ListProcessor by Anastasios Kotsikonas
X-Comment:  Late-Arrival-DependentS-List 
Status: RO


Dear Netters:

Has anybody read the article about the LADs on October 5 issue of the
World Journal?

According to the article, the State Department said that the out-of-status
LADs may go to the U.S. Consulate at Ciudad Juarez, Mexico for the
final interview to adjust status to permanent resident.  Also, the INS is
studying the issue of voluntary departure for out-of-status LADs.

Is the interview place in Mexico for sure?  Why neither IFCSS nor Dr.
Haiching Zhao mentions this matter?  Does any netter have further
information about it?

Thanks for your attention.

Jane

[A[A[A[A[A[A[A[A[A[A[A[A[B[Bstudying the voluntary departure issue for ALDLADs.[B[B[B[B[B

From lads-l@spike.rice.edu  Wed Oct  6 19:38:58 1993
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Date: Wed, 6 Oct 93 19:38:58 CDT
Message-Id: <9310070036.AA19745@mac.hwr.arizona.edu>
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From: jin@mac.hwr.arizona.edu
To: Multiple recipients of list <lads-l@spike.rice.edu>
Subject: CSPA Approval from Western Service Center?
X-Listprocessor-Version: 6.0a -- ListProcessor by Anastasios Kotsikonas
X-Comment:  Late-Arrival-DependentS-List 
Status: RO



I appreciate it if anybody out there, especially those applicants belong
to the Western Service Center, could tell about their CSPA application
status. I sent my application at the begining of July and have not heard
anything yet. What is the percentege of approvals from the WSC?

Thanks.

M. Jin

From lads-l@spike.rice.edu  Wed Oct  6 16:06:53 1993
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Message-Id: <9310062103.AA08700@med2s0.engr.ccny.cuny.edu>
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From: hua7291@med2s0.engr.ccny.cuny.edu (Mi Mi)
To: Multiple recipients of list <lads-l@spike.rice.edu>
Subject: [ifcss@wam.umd.edu: Urgent Notice for Northern Center Applicants]
X-Listprocessor-Version: 6.0a -- ListProcessor by Anastasios Kotsikonas
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Date:         Wed, 6 Oct 1993 16:08:04 -0400
Reply-To: IFCSS HQ <ifcss@wam.umd.edu>
Sender: China-Net <CHINA-NT%UGA.bitnet@CUNYVM.CUNY.EDU>
>From: IFCSS HQ <ifcss@wam.umd.edu>
Subject:      Urgent Notice for Northern Center Applicants
To: Multiple recipients of list CHINA-NT <CHINA-NT%UGA.bitnet@CUNYVM.CUNY.EDU>

**************************************************************
IFCSS Headquarters News Release No. 5066       October 6, 1993
**************************************************************
Independent Federation of Chinese Students and Scholars (IFCSS)
   733 15th Street, N.W., Suite 440, Washington, D.C.20005
         Tel. (202)347-0017  Fax: (202)347-0018
                Email: ifcss@wam.umd.edu

          Urgent Notice for Northern Center Applicants
          ============================================

     The IFCSS HQ has just received a correction notice from the
Director of the Northern Service Center. Those who have applied
under CSPA in the northern center should read this memo carefully.
     The following is the complete original message that we just
received through FAX from the northern center.

(Beginning of the original message)
Date:     10/6/93
To:       IFCSS
Sub:      Wording for Notice to Chinese Community
Comments: Here is the wording you requested. Thank you very much
for your assistance in correction of this error. I hope this
provides better service to our customers. Thanks again.

Many people received approval notices for an I-485, Application for
Adjustment of Status to Permanent Resident filed under the Chinese
Student Protection Act, from the Northern Service Center in
Lincoln, NE, which directs them to go to a local Immigration Office
for "final processing." If a person has already been processed,
i.e. went to a local Immigration office and had one fingerprint and
signature placed on an I-89, he or she may disregard that notice
unless further notified in the future.

This relates to cases filed at Lincoln, NE only!
(End of the original message).

*********************************************************************
*                 IFCSS Headquarters Office                         *
*-------------------------------------------------------------------*
* President:      Lin Changsheng        Vice President:  Shi Heping *
*-------------------------------------------------------------------*
* PBS-L is IFCSS's news distribution list for individuals. To sign  *
* on or off from the list, please send email to listserv@ifcss.org  *
* leave the subject line open and put in the mail body:             *
*    (For signing on)      sub PBS-L last name first name           *
*    (For signing off)     unsub PBS-L last name first name         *
* For more information about IFCSS, write to ifcss-info@ifcss.org   *
*********************************************************************


From lads-l@spike.rice.edu  Tue Oct  5 16:52:11 1993
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Date: Tue, 5 Oct 93 16:52:11 CDT
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From: hua7291@med2s0.engr.ccny.cuny.edu (Mi Mi)
To: Multiple recipients of list <lads-l@spike.rice.edu>
Subject: Immigration Publications: Do it yorself! 
X-Listprocessor-Version: 6.0a -- ListProcessor by Anastasios Kotsikonas
X-Comment:  Late-Arrival-DependentS-List 
Status: RO


Dear Lads-Net Netters:
 
As more and more CSPA principals are getting their Green Card Approvals, our   
network's main focus shifts naturally back to our first priority issue, the    
issue we LADs-Net was born to deal with. As we all know, up to now, there is no
specific category in the American Immigration Law which addresses LADs, the    
LADs problem is not a legal term at all. All the LADs problem, however, is     
to be dealt through normal process. As many netters are asking Mi Mi Sr. for   
help, Mi Mi checked his university's library to find out the following tittles.
which might be of interest to many of our netters. Please go to your school    
and local libraries to check these books, and you will find more authoritative 
answers to your problems. 
 
Good Luck, may God bless our dear Netters!
 
Mi Mi Sr.
 
------------------------------------------------------------------------------ 
Title:          Chinese Student Protection Act of 1992 : report (to accompany  
                  S. 1216) (including cost estimate of the Congressional       
                  Budget Office).                                              
Author:         United States. Congress. House. Committee on the Judiciary.    
Publisher:      <Washington, D.C.? : U.S. G.P.O., 1992>                        
Subjects:       Chinese students--Protection--United States.                   
                Refugees, Political--Legal status, laws, etc.--United States.  
                Emigration and immigration law--United States.                 
------------------------------------------------------------------------------ 
Title:          The Immigration Act of 1990 handbook : the complete practice   
                  guide to the 1990 Act                                        
Author:         Sklar, Helen.                                                  
Edition:        1993-94 ed. / by Phillip Hornik.                               
Publisher:      Deerfield, IL : Clark Boardman Callaghan, c1993.               
Subjects:       United States. Immigration Act of 1990--Handbooks, manuals,    
                  etc.                                                         
                Emigration and immigration law--United States--Handbooks,      
                  manuals, etc.                                                
------------------------------------------------------------------------------ 
Title:          1993 Immigration procedures handbook                           
Publisher:      New York : Clark Boardman Callaghan, c1992.                    
Subjects:       Emigration and immigration law--United States.                 
                Emigration and immigration law--United States--Forms.          
------------------------------------------------------------------------------ 
Title:          Immigration made simple : an easy-to-read guide to the U.S.    
                  immigration process                                          
Author:         Kimmel, Barbara Brooks.                                        
Edition:        Rev. 1992 ed., 2nd ed., completely rev.                        
Publisher:      Westport, Conn., USA : New Decade, c1992.                      
Subjects:       Emigration and immigration law--United States--Popular works.  
------------------------------------------------------------------------------ 
Title:          Immigration, naturalization, and citizenship.                  
Author:         United States. Superintendent of Documents.                    
Publisher:      <Washington, D.C.?> : U.S. G.P.O., Supt. of Docs., <1992>      
Subjects:       Government publications--United States--Bibliography--         
                  Catalogs.                                                    
                Citizenship--United States--Bibliography--Catalogs.            
                Naturalization--United States--Bibliography--Catalogs.        
                United States--Emigration and immigration--Bibliography--   

From lads-l@spike.rice.edu  Tue Oct  5 16:44:27 1993
Received: from  (localhost.rice.edu) by spike.rice.edu (AA09320); Tue, 5 Oct 93 16:44:27 CDT
Date: Tue, 5 Oct 93 16:44:27 CDT
Message-Id: <9310052141.AA05499@med2s0.engr.ccny.cuny.edu>
Errors-To: lads-request@spike.rice.edu
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From: hua7291@med2s0.engr.ccny.cuny.edu (Mi Mi)
To: Multiple recipients of list <lads-l@spike.rice.edu>
Subject: CSPA Residence Reclassification - tuition refund
X-Listprocessor-Version: 6.0a -- ListProcessor by Anastasios Kotsikonas
X-Comment:  Late-Arrival-DependentS-List 
Status: RO


---- For your information, forwarded by Mi Mi Sr. ----------------------------


>From: Singh <asingh@MINES.UTAH.EDU>

        Here is the procedure I followed at the University of Utah:

1.      Notify your department and the International Center (International
        Student Office) about your status change.

2.      Go to the International Admissions Office and ask for Applications
        Forms for Residence Reclassification.  They will give you the
        detailed instructions.

3.      Fill the forms and return to the International Admissions Office.
        The late deadline is the tuition due date.  You can also file the
        application after the deadline. Once approved, they will refund
        you the non-residece tuition you paid.

4.      Documents needed: yours and your family members' employment letters
        in the state you claim residence, tax return forms, drive license,
        car registration, house ownership, etc.  In one sentence, submit
        anything that can show your intention to live in the state
        permanently.

5.      The process takes about 10 days.

        Good luck!

Jianliang Li (JLi)


From lads-l@spike.rice.edu  Tue Oct  5 15:57:13 1993
Received: from  (localhost.rice.edu) by spike.rice.edu (AA08968); Tue, 5 Oct 93 15:57:13 CDT
Date: Tue, 5 Oct 93 15:57:13 CDT
Message-Id: <9310052056.AA26978@bach.convex.com>
Errors-To: lads-request@spike.rice.edu
Reply-To: guo@bach.convex.com
Originator: lads-l@spike.rice.edu
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From: guo@bach.convex.com (Yi Guo)
To: Multiple recipients of list <lads-l@spike.rice.edu>
Subject: Travel out of the states with this temp. stamp?
X-Listprocessor-Version: 6.0a -- ListProcessor by Anastasios Kotsikonas
X-Comment:  Late-Arrival-DependentS-List 
Status: RO

Now that the INS has put all these stamps in our passports, this question
may seem appropriate here:

   If I want to visit China this winter (suppose I don't have the green
card mailed to me yet), is this stamp a sufficient evidence to both the
US INS officials and Chinese border police that I don't need a VISA to
leave China and return US?  Or are there any other documents required?

   Also, anyone in the Houston area have the address & phone number for
the Chinese consulate?  And any advice how to have passport extended from
that consulate?  Thanks!


From lads-l@spike.rice.edu  Tue Oct  5 15:12:54 1993
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Date: Tue, 5 Oct 93 15:12:53 CDT
Message-Id: <9310052009.AA26044@magnusug.magnus.acs.ohio-state.edu>
Errors-To: lads-request@spike.rice.edu
Reply-To: zliu@magnus.acs.ohio-state.edu
Originator: lads-l@spike.rice.edu
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Precedence: bulk
From: Zhong Liu <zliu@magnus.acs.ohio-state.edu>
To: Multiple recipients of list <lads-l@spike.rice.edu>
Subject: TA/RA income taxes
X-Listprocessor-Version: 6.0a -- ListProcessor by Anastasios Kotsikonas
X-Comment:  Late-Arrival-DependentS-List 
Status: RO

I'm not sure this is the right place to post this question for
my friend.

My friend recent got a PR approval letter from the INS. He wonders
whether or not he will still enjoy the PRC-US tax treaty.
He got different answers. Some say as long as you're a PRC
citizen, you'll be able to enjoy the treaty. Others say
once you're a PR, you'll no longer enjoy the treaty. Who is
right? Many thanks.

Z. Liu

From lads-l@spike.rice.edu  Tue Oct  5 14:53:03 1993
Received: from  (localhost.rice.edu) by spike.rice.edu (AA08802); Tue, 5 Oct 93 14:53:03 CDT
Date: Tue, 5 Oct 93 14:53:03 CDT
Message-Id: <44383.jinmeng@rs6000.cmp.ilstu.edu>
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From: "Jin Meng" <jinmeng@rs6000.cmp.ilstu.edu>
To: Multiple recipients of list <lads-l@spike.rice.edu>
Subject: Question about INS in Chicago
X-Listprocessor-Version: 6.0a -- ListProcessor by Anastasios Kotsikonas
X-Comment:  Late-Arrival-DependentS-List 
Status: RO

Hi,

I just got the approval notice from northern center last Saturday.  It said
that I should go to Chicago INS no sooner than 14 days.  I am wonder if I
have to wait two weeks to go to Chicago for final processing, I know somebody
from other area doesn't have to.  Dose anybody have any experience or
suggestion?

Thanks a lot.

Jin


From lads-l@spike.rice.edu  Tue Oct  5 10:33:06 1993
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Date: Tue, 5 Oct 93 10:33:06 CDT
Message-Id: <9310051530.AA18235@lamont.ldgo.columbia.edu>
Errors-To: lads-request@spike.rice.edu
Reply-To: cheng@lamont.ldgo.columbia.edu
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From: cheng@lamont.ldgo.columbia.edu
To: Multiple recipients of list <lads-l@spike.rice.edu>
Subject: Re: Open or Close the Net
X-Listprocessor-Version: 6.0a -- ListProcessor by Anastasios Kotsikonas
X-Comment:  Late-Arrival-DependentS-List 
Status: RO

> From lads-l@spike.rice.edu Tue Oct  5 11:19:42 1993
> Date: Tue, 5 Oct 93 10:17:57 CDT
> Reply-To: hua7291@med2s0.engr.ccny.cuny.edu
> Originator: lads-l@spike.rice.edu
> Sender: lads-l@spike.rice.edu
> From: hua7291@med2s0.engr.ccny.cuny.edu (Mi Mi)
> To: Multiple recipients of list <lads-l@spike.rice.edu>
> Subject: Open or Close the Net
> X-Listprocessor-Version: 6.0a -- ListProcessor by Anastasios Kotsikonas
> X-Comment:  Late-Arrival-DependentS-List 
> Content-Length: 1991
> 
> 
> Dear Netters:
> 
> After one week transition period, I see everything is getting normal again,
> there are not many repetative postings, only Mi Mi yells sometimes. Probably
> We can keep the net open like this without any moderation. 
> 
> Let us wait and see the survey results. If the majority answer is in favor
> of openning the net, here we go with it.
> 
> Interestingly enough, the lc-l net had been opened at the same time as we
> did, but there had been a junk mail surge on that net. Mi Mi's VM account
> had been crashed by that chaotic surge in two days with 139 junks from lc-l
> only. It took 20 minutes to clear everything from Mi Mi's VM machine and
> get things going again. Fortunately, Mi Mi Sr.'s DEC account has plenty
> of space to hold all the junk mails, but it proved to be a headache anyway.
> 
> This incident, in contrast to our smooth transition, demonstrates our
> netters are more maturer and co-operative. Thank you very much, our
> dear netters!
> 
> Mi Mi 
> 
> Lads-net Committee
> 
> 
> %%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%   
> % Mr. Mi Mi, Sr., A Mice Chasing Dog                          %
> % To sign on/off Lads-Net News, pleas send an email to        %
> %    listserv@spike.rice.edu, with mailbody as:               %
> %    sub lads-l Firstname Lastname, or signoff lads-l         %
> % To post, send your message to lads@lucerne.rice.edu         %
> % To retrieve past packages, anonymous ftp at spike.rice.edu  %
> %    at file /lads/9308lads.log and 9309lads.log              %
> % To sign our petition letter, please send your signatures to %
> %    lads-sig@spike.rice.edu. When you send your copy to the  %
> %    U.S. officials, tell us so at petition@spike.rice.edu    %
> % To voice your opinion in our survey, send your message to   %
> %    survey@spike.rice.edu                                    %
> %%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%
>  
>                                                                                                                   
> 
Agree to let the net open. 

frank.

From lads-l@spike.rice.edu  Tue Oct  5 10:17:57 1993
Received: from  (localhost.rice.edu) by spike.rice.edu (AA08213); Tue, 5 Oct 93 10:17:57 CDT
Date: Tue, 5 Oct 93 10:17:57 CDT
Message-Id: <9310051514.AA04136@med2s0.engr.ccny.cuny.edu>
Errors-To: lads-request@spike.rice.edu
Reply-To: hua7291@med2s0.engr.ccny.cuny.edu
Originator: lads-l@spike.rice.edu
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Precedence: bulk
From: hua7291@med2s0.engr.ccny.cuny.edu (Mi Mi)
To: Multiple recipients of list <lads-l@spike.rice.edu>
Subject: Open or Close the Net
X-Listprocessor-Version: 6.0a -- ListProcessor by Anastasios Kotsikonas
X-Comment:  Late-Arrival-DependentS-List 
Status: RO


Dear Netters:

After one week transition period, I see everything is getting normal again,
there are not many repetative postings, only Mi Mi yells sometimes. Probably
We can keep the net open like this without any moderation. 

Let us wait and see the survey results. If the majority answer is in favor
of openning the net, here we go with it.

Interestingly enough, the lc-l net had been opened at the same time as we
did, but there had been a junk mail surge on that net. Mi Mi's VM account
had been crashed by that chaotic surge in two days with 139 junks from lc-l
only. It took 20 minutes to clear everything from Mi Mi's VM machine and
get things going again. Fortunately, Mi Mi Sr.'s DEC account has plenty
of space to hold all the junk mails, but it proved to be a headache anyway.

This incident, in contrast to our smooth transition, demonstrates our
netters are more maturer and co-operative. Thank you very much, our
dear netters!

Mi Mi 

Lads-net Committee


%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%   
% Mr. Mi Mi, Sr., A Mice Chasing Dog                          %
% To sign on/off Lads-Net News, pleas send an email to        %
%    listserv@spike.rice.edu, with mailbody as:               %
%    sub lads-l Firstname Lastname, or signoff lads-l         %
% To post, send your message to lads@lucerne.rice.edu         %
% To retrieve past packages, anonymous ftp at spike.rice.edu  %
%    at file /lads/9308lads.log and 9309lads.log              %
% To sign our petition letter, please send your signatures to %
%    lads-sig@spike.rice.edu. When you send your copy to the  %
%    U.S. officials, tell us so at petition@spike.rice.edu    %
% To voice your opinion in our survey, send your message to   %
%    survey@spike.rice.edu                                    %
%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%
 
                                                                                                                  

From lads-l@spike.rice.edu  Tue Oct  5 09:21:12 1993
Received: from  (localhost.rice.edu) by spike.rice.edu (AA08117); Tue, 5 Oct 93 09:21:12 CDT
Date: Tue, 5 Oct 93 09:21:12 CDT
Message-Id: <9310051418.AA03714@med2s0.engr.ccny.cuny.edu>
Errors-To: lads-request@spike.rice.edu
Reply-To: hua7291@med2s0.engr.ccny.cuny.edu
Originator: lads-l@spike.rice.edu
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Precedence: bulk
From: hua7291@med2s0.engr.ccny.cuny.edu (Mi Mi)
To: Multiple recipients of list <lads-l@spike.rice.edu>
Subject: Date: Tue, 5 Oct 93 09:52:48 -0400
X-Listprocessor-Version: 6.0a -- ListProcessor by Anastasios Kotsikonas
X-Comment:  Late-Arrival-DependentS-List 
Status: RO

Dear Netters: last weekend, a netter forward a letter from Bill Clinton,
in replying to his lads-net petition letter. Unfortunately, it is a form
letter, worse, it is the identically the same as Mi Mi had gotten from Bill
Clinton, in replying to Mi Mi's comment letter to the interim rule before
August 2, when we lads-net launched the first petition wave to the US 
officials to change the interim rule. 
Here Mi Mi has concluded that, the White House has not read the letters
carefully, so our concerns are not heard in these two cases. However, Mi Mi's
three petition letters, with 1564 strong support of our dear netters, have
not been answered by the White House yet. Mi Mi Sr.'s hope is, the White
House is paying attention to them, since the number is relatively bigger
than one, and something is happening to it. While most of our principals 
are getting their temporary I-551s, we shall concentrate on our lads issue
once more. Mi Mi Sr. believe, the number speaks. Let us keep on the pressure
by getting more and more signatures. 
United, we stand!
Mi Mi
Lads-net Committee
-------"Bill Clinton"'s form letter follows ----------------------------------
Dear Friend:
  Thank you for your letter.
  While we must maintain our commitment to generous and humane
immigration and refugee policies, we cannot admit all who want to enter the
United States. Under the economic and job market pressures we face today,
we cannot afford to lose control of our borders or take on new financial
burdens, nor can we allow our people to be endangered by those who would
enter our country to terrorize Ameriicans. Therefore, we must ensure
adequate enforcement of U.S immigration laws, including provisions designed
to discourage unauthorized entry. I have already tatken concrete steps to
stem the flow of illegal immigration.
   At the same time, we must promote economic opportunity, peace, and
security in countries struggling to achieve economic development and
democracy.  By doing so, we can create incentives for people to remain in
their country of origin.
   The problems of immigration and asylum invite no easy solutions. I
am confident that the policy I have announced will protect our nation's and
our states' economic interests while respecting our commitment to humane
immigration policies. I appreciate your interest in this issue. 
  Sincerely, 
  Bill Clinton
"Bill Clinton"'s form letter 


From lads-l@spike.rice.edu  Mon Oct  4 16:02:03 1993
Received: from  (localhost.rice.edu) by spike.rice.edu (AA05645); Mon, 4 Oct 93 16:02:03 CDT
Date: Mon, 4 Oct 93 16:02:03 CDT
Message-Id: <9310042058.AA05884@cgsmath2.claremont.edu>
Errors-To: lads-request@spike.rice.edu
Reply-To: gcao@cgsmath2.claremont.edu
Originator: lads-l@spike.rice.edu
Sender: lads-l@spike.rice.edu
Precedence: bulk
From: Gene Cao <gcao@cgsmath2.claremont.edu>
To: Multiple recipients of list <lads-l@spike.rice.edu>
Subject: The final procedure after receiving the PR approval
X-Listprocessor-Version: 6.0a -- ListProcessor by Anastasios Kotsikonas
X-Comment:  Late-Arrival-DependentS-List 
Status: RO

Hi, there,

I need instructions regarding my final procedure after receiving the  

PR approval and my lad's PR application.

Since I filed my PR application via CSPA on July 1 in Ohio,
I am asked to go to the INS Cincinatti Office to finish to the final
process. I have moved to California, however, for a last-minute job 


while my lad still studies in Ohio. 



Could I go to an INS office in CA instead of flying back to Ohio?  

What should my lad do with my approval notice after sending her PR   


      application to the INS Cincinatti Office?

Any information on the questions is very much appreciated.
Thank you all for your attention.

Gene


From lads-l@spike.rice.edu  Mon Oct  4 12:11:36 1993
Received: from  (localhost.rice.edu) by spike.rice.edu (AA05096); Mon, 4 Oct 93 12:11:36 CDT
Date: Mon, 4 Oct 93 12:11:36 CDT
Message-Id: <9310041708.AA00472@med2s0.engr.ccny.cuny.edu>
Errors-To: lads-request@spike.rice.edu
Reply-To: hua7291@med2s0.engr.ccny.cuny.edu
Originator: lads-l@spike.rice.edu
Sender: lads-l@spike.rice.edu
Precedence: bulk
From: hua7291@med2s0.engr.ccny.cuny.edu (Mi Mi)
To: Multiple recipients of list <lads-l@spike.rice.edu>
Subject: [Donglin.Mi@Dartmouth.EDU: Re: Mi Mi fired the third round petition letter!]
X-Listprocessor-Version: 6.0a -- ListProcessor by Anastasios Kotsikonas
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Date: 04 Oct 93 13:06:13 EDT
>From: Donglin.Mi@Dartmouth.EDU (Donglin Mi)
Subject: Re: Mi Mi fired the third round petition letter!
To: hua7291@med2s0.engr.ccny.cuny.edu

--- You wrote:

Hi, Zuojun Cao:

Recruiting LC was the first thought of our committee. But, the LC-L survey 
shows the support to our lads-net's petition letter is only 31%, much less
than the percentage who support lobbying an unconditional PR for every 
LC, and those who support lobbying an unconditional work permit for every
LC. Even with presummed 100% support from lads-net, we only got 600 or 
less signatures out of the pool of over 1000 subscribers (many co-signers
are really dependents rather than subscribers). Remember this number also
includes some LC, since we have posted to CND-US, Social.culture.china,
talk.politics.china (?), ccnl, China-Nt, lc-l (by lc-l working committee) 
many times, at least 10 days to all the public posting addresses and some
I have the posting previliges. Huge amount of privat e-mail messages were
addressed to individuals to get their support. If Clinton had to do this 
and achieve what we had, he had better to set up his own Law Office.

This petition drive has reached its limit already. For those who support
us, we express here our sincerely thanks. For those onlookers, well, 
please remember IT IS YOUR PROBLEM, if you do not do it, or even do not
support those who are doing it for you, than everything has a limit. There
have been too many free lunches. 

Mi Mi 

--- end of quoted material ---

Hi, Mi Mi:

I think that it is time that we are lobbying our CSPA principals arround our
local area to support our petition. There are at least about 30,000 people
among all of CSPA principals in the universities or colleges. If we  get one
third of them, we can have 10,000 signatures. I think that it is a low-cost,
high-efficient campaign.
 
Donglin Mi



From lads-l@spike.rice.edu  Mon Oct  4 11:47:40 1993
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From: hua7291@med2s0.engr.ccny.cuny.edu (Mi Mi)
To: Multiple recipients of list <lads-l@spike.rice.edu>
Subject: Mi Mi fired the third round petition letter!
X-Listprocessor-Version: 6.0a -- ListProcessor by Anastasios Kotsikonas
X-Comment:  Late-Arrival-DependentS-List 
Status: RO


Hi, Zuojun Cao:

Recruiting LC was the first thought of our committee. But, the LC-L survey 
shows the support to our lads-net's petition letter is only 31%, much less
than the percentage who support lobbying an unconditional PR for every 
LC, and those who support lobbying an unconditional work permit for every
LC. Even with presummed 100% support from lads-net, we only got 600 or 
less signatures out of the pool of over 1000 subscribers (many co-signers
are really dependents rather than subscribers). Remember this number also
includes some LC, since we have posted to CND-US, Social.culture.china,
talk.politics.china (?), ccnl, China-Nt, lc-l (by lc-l working committee) 
many times, at least 10 days to all the public posting addresses and some
I have the posting previliges. Huge amount of privat e-mail messages were
addressed to individuals to get their support. If Clinton had to do this 
and achieve what we had, he had better to set up his own Law Office.

This petition drive has reached its limit already. For those who support
us, we express here our sincerely thanks. For those onlookers, well, 
please remember IT IS YOUR PROBLEM, if you do not do it, or even do not
support those who are doing it for you, than everything has a limit. There
have been too many free lunches. 

/Hi:  Mi Mi!
/
/Thanks a lot for your work in the past several weeks.
/
/I just have a suggestion about your fire to push CSPA lads to world quota.
/Maybe we can post your appeal to the late comer network. I am pretty sure that
/most late comers are more concerned about this issue than the early comers
/are.
/
/Allen Cao


Mi Mi 



%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%   
% Mr. Mi Mi, Sr., A Mice Chasing Dog                          %
% To sign on/off Lads-Net News, pleas send an email to        %
%    listserv@spike.rice.edu, with mailbody as:               %
%    sub lads-l Firstname Lastname, or signoff lads-l         %
% To post, send your message to lads@lucerne.rice.edu         %
% To retrieve past packages, anonymous ftp at spike.rice.edu  %
%    at file /lads/9308lads.log and 9309lads.log              %
% To sign our petition letter, please send your signatures to %
%    lads-sig@spike.rice.edu. When you send your copy to the  %
%    U.S. officials, tell us so at petition@spike.rice.edu    %
% To voice your opinion in our survey, send your message to   %
%    survey@spike.rice.edu                                    %
%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%
 
                                                                                                                  

From lads-l@spike.rice.edu  Sun Oct  3 22:49:39 1993
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From: hua7291@med2s0.engr.ccny.cuny.edu (Mi Mi)
To: Multiple recipients of list <lads-l@spike.rice.edu>
Subject: 
X-Listprocessor-Version: 6.0a -- ListProcessor by Anastasios Kotsikonas
X-Comment:  Late-Arrival-DependentS-List 
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Dear Lads-Net netters, please fill out the following survey sheet, and
send it back to survey@spike.rice.edu, thank you for your help.

Mi Mi

Lads-Net Committee


1) What is your status?
        a) CSPA beneficiary without lad(s).
        b) CSPA beneficiary with lad(s).
        c) CSPA DED lad.
        d) CSPA non-DED lad.
        e) LC student.    
        f) None of the above(explain:__________________)
2) What is your purpose to join lads-net?
        a) For information only.
        b) To do something which can make a difference
        c) Just for monitoring lads-net activity.
3) What is the function of lads-net?
        a) There is no need of lads-net at all.
        b) It should only be an information sharing service.
        c) It should make effort to push forward lad issues.
4) How do you rank lads-net's information? Please give scales 
   from 0 to 10, as 10 is the best.
        a) promptness: 
        b) accuracy:
        c) fairness:
5) How do you rank lads-net's another activities? Please give 
   scales from 0 to 10, as 10 is the best.
        a) work with LCnet.
        b) work with IFCSS.
        c) work with Dr. Zhao's NCCA.
        d) work with U.S. government.
        e) petition letter drive.    
6) Do you think DED problem should be solved?
        a) No.
        b) Not concerned.
        c) Yes.
        d) Yes, but it should be solved after most of CSPA principals
                has been approved.
        e) Yes, but undocumented DED should be excluded.
7) What do you think we should do next?
        a) Nothing. No chance at all for us to achive our goal.
        b) push Dr. Zhao Haiqing to make effort.
        c) Focus on the petiton letter. Wait to see what happens.
        d) We should do more ourselves, i.e lobby.
8) If you think we should do more, you would contribute
        a) little manpower or donation.
        b) donation.
        c) manpower
        d) manpower and donation.

From lads-l@spike.rice.edu  Sun Oct  3 22:24:22 1993
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From: Heshun Chen <hnchen@umaxc.weeg.uiowa.edu>
To: Multiple recipients of list <lads-l@spike.rice.edu>
Subject: parents' visiting
X-Listprocessor-Version: 6.0a -- ListProcessor by Anastasios Kotsikonas
X-Comment:  Late-Arrival-DependentS-List 
Status: RO

Hi, Netter,
I'm an approved CSPA principal, and I want my parents to come to visit me
in the near future (as having nonimmigrant visas, I guess).  Would that be
something impossible now? What should I do?      Any suggestions would be
appreciated very much.   
Thanks a lot. 



From lads-l@spike.rice.edu  Sun Oct  3 20:22:35 1993
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From: hua7291@med2s0.engr.ccny.cuny.edu (Mi Mi)
To: Multiple recipients of list <lads-l@spike.rice.edu>
Subject: Mi Mi fired the third round of petition letters!
X-Listprocessor-Version: 6.0a -- ListProcessor by Anastasios Kotsikonas
X-Comment:  Late-Arrival-DependentS-List 
Status: RO




Dear Netters,

Mi Mi Sr. has fired third round petition letter with 530 
signatures collected from the INTERNET between September 1 and 
September 25. The incoming signatures are trickled down to one 
signature per a week. It is estimated that, if no more signatures 
come, this is the last round of petition letter Mi Mi Sr. would 
send out. Mi Mi Sr. is glad that he is relieved from this self-
assumed duty. During our six-week old petition drive, we received   
total of 1564 signatures from August 23 to September 25. For this 
round of petition letters, four letters are delivered via US 
Postal Office to 

	Madam Rita A.Boie
	Senior Immigration Examier
	Adjudication Branch
	Immigration & Naturalization Services
	425 I Street NW, room 5307
	Washington, DC 20536
	FAX: (202)514-0198

	White House:
	The Honorable William Clinton
	The White House
	1600 Pennsyvania Avenue, N.W.
	Washington DC 20500
	FAX: (202) 456-2461

	Mr. Eric Schwartz
	Director of Refugees & Humanitarian Affairs
	National Security Council
	The White House, 1600 Pennsylvania Ave.
	Washington D.C. 20506

	Gerry Tinker
	Director of Stuffs
	Senate Sub-Committee on Immigration and Refugees
	Dirkson Senate Office Building
	Washington D. C. 20510
	202-224-5182 (Fax)

and two faxes are delivered via MCI to 

	Attorney General
	The Honorable Madam Janet Reno
	U.S. Attorney General
	Fax: (202) 514-4371

	Ms. Philis Coven
	Assistant to Attorney General
	Fax:(202)-514-0238

According to the report on World Journal, the CSPA Regulation 
will be finalized by the end of this year. While the final Rule 
will not change the fact that most CSPA principals, either 
documented or undocumented who entered the United States prior to 
April 11, 1990, have gotten or will have their little piece of 
green light in the U. S., however, the rule will certainly 
reshape the fate of many Chinese nationals who came after that 
particular date. If, we failed to push the LADs community into 
that unlimited world-wide pool, then the anticipated long waiting 
lines in China's EB-3 and FB-2 categories will surely prevent 
many late comers' American dream from coming true. Think of this. 

If you want to support our petition drive, you are welcomed to 
send your signatures, or your collection of signatures, in the form

Mr/Ms/Miss.Name,Number and
Street,City,State,ZipCode,phone#(***)-***-****
  Co-signed Spouse, Mr/Ms/Miss.Name,
  Co-signed Child,  Mr/Ms/Miss.Name,
  Co-signed Child,  Mr/Ms/Miss.Name, ....

to lads-sig@spike.rice.edu

Or to the above addresses, via ordinary Postal mail or Fax.

Remember, the lads and LC problem are ours, no one should care
more than ouselves. Please act quickly before it is too late!

Mi Mi Sr.

LADS-Net Committee

Enclosed is the letter we Lads-Net have sent to the US officials.

Mr. Eric Schwartz
Director of Refugees & Humanitarian Affairs
National Security Council
The White House, 1600 Pennsylvania Ave.
Washington D.C. 20506

RE: Chinese Student Protection Act (CSPA)

Dear Mr. Eric Schwartz,

	We, a group of concerned individuals who have signed our 
names and addresses below, would like to call your kindly 
attention to the following problems involved in subjecting Late-
Arriving Dependents (LAD) of CSPA principals to the China quota.

	(1) According to the survey made by the Headquarters of the 
Independent Federation of Chinese Students and Scholars (IFCSS 
HQ), there are approximately 10000 eligible LADs in the U.S., who 
may file their applications under EB-3 or FB-2 during this August 
and September. Since the annual China quota in EB-3 or FB-2 is 
about 2500, these LADs only will cause a backlog in China's quota 
for at least four years. This means that no other Chinese 
nationals can file applications for adjustment of status under 
EB-3 or FB-2 categories in the next four years. What is worse, 
according to the INS Cable on August 13, those undocumented 
Chinese nationals who came before April 11, 1990 and have since 
obtained an advance parole to re-enter the U.S. are now allowed 
to apply under CSPA. While this new decision reflects the 
humanitarian and protective spirit embedded in the Executive 
Order 12711, these additional applicants with their LADs actually 
face even greater difficulties, because most of their LADs are 
queued after the existing pool of LADs whose principals entered 
the United States legally. These people, then, will be subject to 
an even longer period of family separation. In addition, the 
unpredictable number of LADs of undocumented Chinese nationals 
will jam the normal China EB-3 and FB-2 categories for even more 
years. The traditional values of family ties, family unity and 
humanity, cherished so dearly by the American people, are also 
deeply rooted in the Chinese culture and in every Chinese family. 
The anticipated long separation due to visa quota allocation will 
surely bring agony and misery to those families, in contradiction 
to the humanitarian spirit embedded in the INA, Executive order 
12711 and CSPA.

	(2) For dependents still remaining in China, the situation 
is even more bleak. These individuals, most of whom are minor 
children, as our survey of our LADs community shows, would be 
required to wait in China until visa numbers are available. They 
could potentially be separated from their parents for many years. 
The separation will not only deprive these minor children of 
their much needed parental care, but also strain the precious 
family ties in those families. In addition, many of the 
dependents, both in the U.S. and in China, who are now considered 
children, might reach the age of 21 prior to visa availability. 
This would disqualify them for visa issuance.

	To solve these problems, we would like to suggest the 
following:

	(1) Re-allocate the LADs into the world quota. Since the 
CSPA principals have been allocated into the world-wide quota 
leftovers for fiscal year 1993, it is reasonable to assume that 
there might be similar world-wide quota leftovers for the next 
few years. Instead of wasting these leftover world-wide quotas 
while letting the LADs block China's regular EB-3 and EB-2 
channels, re-allocating LADs to the world quota would solve the 
backlog problem, thus benefiting many Chinese families at the 
expense of no-one.

	(2) Establish a blanket family unity program to include all 
late-arriving dependents. This program should mirror the benefits 
of Executive Order 12711 in (a) giving favorable considerations 
to the dependents in China who request non-immigrant visas to 
visit their family in the U.S., so that their visa application 
will not be simply rejected due to the "immigration intent"; (b) 
presuming the non-immigrant status of LADs for adjustment 
purposes, so as to eliminate the DED problem faced by an 
estimated 50% of the LAD population; (c) providing liberal 
advance paroles; (d) providing employment authorization for the 
dependents while their applications are being processed; and (e) 
allowing children who are under twenty-one on the date of the 
CSPA principal's approval to be eligible for adjustment, even if 
they are over twenty-one at the date of application for such 
adjustment. This family unity program should solve problems in 
the case by case voluntary departure program and shorten family 
separation resulting from non-immigrant visa denial.

	Thank you for your attention. We are most anxiously looking 
forward to hearing from you.

	Signed by initiating LADs Network members, and co-signed by 
all the concerned and sympathetic Chinese nationals.

	Their names and address are in the following attached pages.

Sincerely Yours,






From lads-l@spike.rice.edu  Sun Oct  3 15:06:25 1993
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To: Multiple recipients of list <lads-l@spike.rice.edu>
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X-Listprocessor-Version: 6.0a -- ListProcessor by Anastasios Kotsikonas
X-Comment:  Late-Arrival-DependentS-List 
Status: RO

Hi, there,

I sent out my application on june 30, and my notice date I got
is on july 9. But I haven't got approved yet in western center.
I mean I got neither approval in the automated answer machine
nor notice of approval. Anybody knows what's going on there and
what't going to happen. I also have a LAD.

Your attention is greatly appreciated.

   

From lads-l@spike.rice.edu  Sun Oct  3 14:07:20 1993
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From: yong@netlabs.com (Yong Teng)
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X-Comment:  Late-Arrival-DependentS-List 
Status: RO

Hi, 

    The following information is only for your refrences.


    I sent my CSPA application in June 30 and got receipt I-797

    in mid of July.

    My LAD sent her I-485 in August 3 in local INS office and got 

    a interview in Sept. 21.

    We went to local INS in Sept. 21 and were being interviewed by

    a office. It was very simple. He told us that everying is ok,

    but they need to wait my CSPA approval, if I get approval, my

    LAD's application  will get approval, if I would be rejected, my LAD's

    application would also be rejected. Local INS office has no

    idea what happen in each INS center.


    Finally, I get my approval notice last Friday (October 1), We

    went to Local INS directly. The same local INS office toke one

    copy of my approval notice and told us that he would sent a notice

    to us next monday, and my LAD need to go back local INS again

    with passport and ID . We asked him that it was local approval 

    letter. He just told us that " Stay at home to wait my letter".


    So, I think that every CSPA with LAD better to go to local INS

    office as quickly as possible to let local INS can go further

    to process LADs cases.




From lads-l@spike.rice.edu  Sun Oct  3 13:36:43 1993
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From: hua7291@med2s0.engr.ccny.cuny.edu (Mi Mi)
To: Multiple recipients of list <lads-l@spike.rice.edu>
Subject:  LAD
X-Listprocessor-Version: 6.0a -- ListProcessor by Anastasios Kotsikonas
X-Comment:  Late-Arrival-DependentS-List 
Status: RO

   Date: Sun, 3 Oct 93 10:28:57 -0700
   From: Lingyan Kong <leanne@skinner.cs.uoregon.edu>

   I am a PR and my daughter is still in China. If I want get her a
   nonimmigration visa, I should get her a B-2 or F-2 ? Thanks for
   any help.

B-2 is the only possible way for us now.

Mi Mi
%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%   
% Mr. Mi Mi, Sr., A Mice Chasing Dog                          %
% To sign on/off Lads-Net News, pleas send an email to        %
%    listserv@spike.rice.edu, with mailbody as:               %
%    sub lads-l Firstname Lastname, or signoff lads-l         %
% To post, send your message to lads@lucerne.rice.edu         %
% To retrieve past packages, anonymous ftp at spike.rice.edu  %
%    at file /lads/9308lads.log and 9309lads.log              %
% To sign our petition letter, please send your signatures to %
%    lads-sig@spike.rice.edu. When you send your copy to the  %
%    U.S. officials, tell us so at petition@spike.rice.edu    %
% To voice your opinion in our survey, send your message to   %
%    survey@spike.rice.edu                                    %
%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%
 
                                                                                                                  

From lads-l@spike.rice.edu  Sun Oct  3 12:31:58 1993
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From: Lingyan Kong <leanne@skinner.cs.uoregon.edu>
To: Multiple recipients of list <lads-l@spike.rice.edu>
Subject: Re:  LAD
X-Listprocessor-Version: 6.0a -- ListProcessor by Anastasios Kotsikonas
X-Comment:  Late-Arrival-DependentS-List 
Status: RO

I am a PR and my daughter is still in China. If I want get her a
nonimmigration visa, I should get her a B-2 or F-2 ? Thanks for
any help.

From lads-l@spike.rice.edu  Sat Oct  2 21:10:41 1993
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From: bai@ee.tamu.edu (Jinxia Bai)
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X-Listprocessor-Version: 6.0a -- ListProcessor by Anastasios Kotsikonas
X-Comment:  Late-Arrival-DependentS-List 
Status: RO

My Net-Friends:

Any of you has an idea about where I should file the I824?  The reason
I asked this question is that I filed my I824 to the Southern regionnal
service center and get it returned.  Did they make a mistake? Or I should
file the I824 in the local INS office. I was told to file the application 
(I824) in the local INS where the principle application was approved. 
This does not make any sense, since we all know that CSPA application was
approved in regional service center instead of local INS.

Please give your advice if you know how I should act. Appreciate.

From lads-l@spike.rice.edu  Sat Oct  2 16:58:55 1993
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To: Multiple recipients of list <lads-l@spike.rice.edu>
Subject: Some thoughts regarding LADnet
X-Listprocessor-Version: 6.0a -- ListProcessor by Anastasios Kotsikonas
X-Comment:  Late-Arrival-DependentS-List 
Status: RO

Hi, LADnetters,
After being buried in thesis works for a very long time, I finally pull my head 
out, knowing that majority CSPA fellows have received GCs or will receive them 
in coming days. I am very grateful to those volunteers who have spent enormous
energies and efforts helping us, especially Mi Mi, Ju Wu and lots others.
Jimmy wrote a very good letter saying that LADnet has served its purpose of
info exchange of LAD applications, but it has a great deal of meaning to 
continue existing for a subgroup of CSS in the "new world". Jimmy gave some
very thoughtful points in his letter.
I think Ladnet should continue its existence not only because it will serve
as bonds among us, a group of highly educated and smart people who want to
migrate into main stream of American society, but also because there are
still a lot of long-term and short-term issues to be settled.
Short-term issues are those newly emerging issues due to change of status,
such as issues regarding tax, travel, new dependents, etc. Long-term issues
will be LAD/World Quota lobby, helping late coming sisters and brothers, etc.
I wish everyone in LADnet can contribute his/her ideas how to maintain LADnet
and direct it to evolve like what we want. I am very for opening LADnet
with some ethic rules of posting letters. LADnet should differentiate itself
from soc.culture.china, CNDnews or other newsgroups and maillists. It is
for a group of people who share common interests.

Have a nice day!

Jonathan J. Sheng
Theoretical Chemistry,NYU

From lads-l@spike.rice.edu  Sat Oct  2 16:07:10 1993
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From: hua7291@med2s0.engr.ccny.cuny.edu (Mi Mi)
To: Multiple recipients of list <lads-l@spike.rice.edu>
Subject: LAD
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Hi yuchi chen:

I-824 is the form you have to file out for your oversea dependents.
EB-3 is Employment Based Third Preference immigration category, and
FB-2 is Family Based Second Preference immigration category. For your 
daughter, the best way to get her a B-2 visa, that is non-immigration
visa, you do not have to wait for the visa availability. The EB-3
and FB-2 are immigration visas, you have to wait for the visa availability,
and that might take years. Getting B-2/F-2/J-2 is very difficult for 
your daughter now, since you are a PR and your daughter's applying
any of the B-2/F-2/J-2 visas shows a very clearly "immigation intent"
thus precludes her from visa issuance.

Well, you got to try. Good Luck!

   From: "yuchi chen" <****@****.Princeton.EDU>
/   Date: Thu, 30 Sep 93 15:21:28 EDT

/   Can you tell me what are the difference of I-824, EB-3 and FB-2 ?
/   My daughter is in China now.  If I just want her to come, and not 
/   interested in what status she will be, what would be my best bet?

/   You said "If you managed to obtain nonimmigration visas for them,
/   just let them come here."  How can I let my daughter "come here"?
/   Are EB-3 and FB-2 nonimmigration visas?

/   Hope it won't take you too much time to answer my question.

/   Thank you so much.  I am looking forward for your answers.

/   Ychen





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% Mr. Mi Mi, Sr., A Mice Chasing Dog                          %
% To sign on/off Lads-Net News, pleas send an email to        %
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% To sign our petition letter, please send your signatures to %
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%    survey@spike.rice.edu                                    %
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From lads-l@spike.rice.edu  Sat Oct  2 15:31:05 1993
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>From:	WVNET::CZHAO         2-OCT-1993 16:22:50.66
To:	IN%"lads@lucene.rice.edu"
CC:	CZHAO
Subj:	

Dear Netters:
I wish to get answer or some suggestion from you. I am a CSPA principal with
lads and received my approve notice last month. My wife and daughter
who are lads filed their I-485 in Aug.. My question is whether or not I 
can go to England for six months without affecting my wife and daughter's
application for their PR?
Thank you in advance.
Cheng.

From lads-l@spike.rice.edu  Sat Oct  2 13:31:34 1993
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From: hua7291@med2s0.engr.ccny.cuny.edu (Mi Mi)
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Subject: [xiachen@uhunix.uhcc.Hawaii.Edu: ]
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Date: Thu, 30 Sep 93 20:32:13 HST
>From: Xia Chen <xiachen@uhunix.uhcc.Hawaii.Edu>
To: hua7291@med2s0.engr.ccny.cuny.edu

Dear Netters, Please extend your kindness to help the following guy. He
wants to know some detailed information which had been appeared on the net
some time back concerning a CSPA got I-20 Form from his school to get his
wife/kid a F-2 visa. His school needs this information to issue him a new
I-20. Although Mi Mi believes this is highly impossible to achieve this, 
since Mi Mi Sr tried himself after July, he thinks it is worth trying
because who knows how long a lad in China will have to wait for a quota?
Mi Mi Sr. got his Mi Mi Jr. a F-2 prior to July 1, it was very smooth,
of course. But no one can turn the clock back.

Sorry for the delay. Mi Mi Sr.'s telephone line broke for three days, so
he had no access to the internet. He got his own approval, with instruction
to show up for I-89. He went to the NYC INS, got the I-89 done and I-551
stamped. 

Well, with fewer and fewer CSPA principals are still waiting for the 
approvals, let us concentrate on the lads issue again.

Mi Mi Sr.


Forwarded Message-------------------

Dear netters:

I need your help in getting information about mainland schools that have
recently  (since July 1) issued I-20 form to CSPA students who filed theirPR petitions in July and whose spouses are still in China.  

If any of you have knowledge on this matter, please forward your
information to my e-mail address.  I would appreciate your help very much.

Chen Xia





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%    lads-sig@spike.rice.edu. When you send your copy to the  %
%    U.S. officials, tell us so at petition@spike.rice.edu    %
% To voice your opinion in our survey, send your message to   %
%    survey@spike.rice.edu                                    %
%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%
 
                                                                                                                  

From lads-l@spike.rice.edu  Sat Oct  2 12:06:44 1993
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From: yhl%cmliris@harvard.harvard.edu (Yonghong Li)
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Subject: IFCSS News Release
X-Listprocessor-Version: 6.0a -- ListProcessor by Anastasios Kotsikonas
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**************************************************************
IFCSS Headquarters News Release No. 5065    October 1, 1993
**************************************************************
Independent Federation of Chinese Students and Scholars (IFCSS)
   733 15th Street, N.W., Suite 440, Washington, D.C.20005
         Tel. (202)347-0017  Fax: (202)347-0018
                Email: ifcss@wam.umd.edu

                      IFCSS REPORT ON CSPA
                      ====================

Dear CSPA applicants,

The IFCSS HQ has just obtained the news from the US State
Department and INS that all the visa numbers were used up by
September 30. There are approximated 42,000 cases which were
approved under CSPA (The detailed number was not available until
next week). So most of the CSPA applicants should have already
received their approval notice or will receive it in the next few
days. For those CSPA applicants who have not filed or filed late,
the INS will continue to prove their applications using visa
numbers that become immediately available on October 1.

This weekend is the holiday weekend for our Chinese community. It
is the time to celebrate and for families and friends to get
together. The IFCSS wish you the happiest holiday time, and the
best for your new future.

However, while we celebrate, we should still remember those victims
of the 1989 tragedy, and to support this organization that works
diligently for the interests of all the Chinese students and
scholars in the U.S., and to help those late comers who do not
benefit from the CSPA. The IFCSS is in dire financial difficulty,
and many of our programs are unable to carry out due to such
shortage.

Thus the IFCSS HQ courteously asks you personally to donate $20 to
our organization. We are aware of the financial difficulties that
many of you have encountered in this country. But we can only rely
upon you for the livelihood of this organization. Your contribution
will be extremely important: half of your contribution will go to
the June 4th victims; and the other half will help cover the cost
of IFCSS operations.

As the CSPA has adequately exhibited, the existence of the IFCSS is
important to all of us in the CSS community. If you want to help
the June 4th victims, help the IFCSS to overcome its financial
difficulty, and help with our programs that will continue to serve
you and late-coming Chinese students, please write a check payable
to IFCSS, and send it to

     IFCSS
     733 15th Street, N.W.
     Suite 440
     Washington, D.C. 20005

Thank you very much for your help.


Sincerely,


Lin Changsheng
President


Shi Heping
Vice President

*********************************************************************
*                 IFCSS Headquarters Office                         *
*-------------------------------------------------------------------*
* President:      Lin Changsheng        Vice President:  Shi Heping *
*-------------------------------------------------------------------*
* PBS-L is IFCSS's news distribution list for individuals. To sign  *
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* For more information about IFCSS, write to ifcss-info@ifcss.org   *
*********************************************************************

--------------------------------------------------------------
Dear Netters,
	This news is a good sign to our World Quota Issue! Soon many of LAds
will get approved! But There is still a big problems here: Many of us have to wait many years to get their green card. If a temporary green card is OK for you, What about the LADs still in CHINA? (By the way, everyone in my family has a temporary
green card now).
	So, I suggest that everyone in this network stay until we solve the World Quota issue! Do not be selfish! Try your best to help the CSS community 
besides yourself.
	By the way, Do not be frustrated now. The authorities need time to 
response to our petition! CSPA took 4 years! For us, we have been fighting only
3 months!

Y. H. Li


From lads-l@spike.rice.edu  Fri Oct  1 21:20:59 1993
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Hi, netters:

First of all, I'd like to express my thanks to the editors and the 
netters who responded my posted questions by phone and E-mail.

On 9/30, I went to INS in Milwaukee. A lady officer received my approval
notice and did a new fingerprinting for me even though I did the old one 
already there a couple weeks ago. Then I asked if she could make a 
temporary PR on my passport, she said she can if I want. I asked if she 
could do it for my LADs, she said they need to be approved first. I asked 
how long will be the waiting period? She said within 6 months INS will send 
notices to us. I asked if this is for my card? She said that's for my LADs, 
not for me.   

Good lucky to all!      

From lads-l@spike.rice.edu  Fri Oct  1 14:44:20 1993
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> From lads-l@spike.rice.edu Fri Oct  1 13:16:39 1993
> Date: Fri, 1 Oct 93 13:17:29 CDT
> Reply-To: UN020002@wvnvaxa.wvnet.edu
> Originator: lads-l@spike.rice.edu
> Sender: lads-l@spike.rice.edu
> From: KURT RJ HAMMERBECK <UN020002@wvnvaxa.wvnet.edu>
> To: Multiple recipients of list <lads-l@spike.rice.edu>
> Subject: 
> X-Listprocessor-Version: 6.0a -- ListProcessor by Anastasios Kotsikonas
> X-Comment:  Late-Arrival-DependentS-List 
> Content-Length: 624
> 
> Hi, there!
> I has been a PR since last month.  I am doing my RA for my PhD now. 
> I have a question concerning the FICA.  In my pay-roll, there is a term 
> called FICA which I have never paid.  I was told that the FICA is the 
> security tax and related to the benefit in future after I retired and 
> medical insurance.  Some one said that the earlier I start pay it,
> the better my benefit in future, beacuse the benefit will depend on the
> years and the amount which I totally paid.  Could anybody confirm the
> information and give more detail explanation about the issue?  Shoud 
> I pay it or not?  What benefit can I get from it?
> 

FICA is social security.  If you are foreign student, you shouldn't pay.  But ifyou are USPR, you have to pay.  Otherwise it is illegal.  You should contact    your payroll office ASAP.  The benedits are just like you said.

netter

From lads-l@spike.rice.edu  Fri Oct  1 13:41:05 1993
Received: from  (localhost.rice.edu) by spike.rice.edu (AA14173); Fri, 1 Oct 93 13:41:05 CDT
Date: Fri, 1 Oct 93 13:41:04 CDT
Message-Id: <9310011838.AA01028@kelb.cs.buffalo.edu>
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> From: KURT RJ HAMMERBECK <UN020002@wvnvaxa.wvnet.edu>
> To: Multiple recipients of list <lads-l@spike.rice.edu>
> 
> Hi, there!
> I has been a PR since last month.  I am doing my RA for my PhD now. 
> I have a question concerning the FICA.  In my pay-roll, there is a term 
> called FICA which I have never paid.  I was told that the FICA is the 
> security tax and related to the benefit in future after I retired and 
> medical insurance.  Some one said that the earlier I start pay it,
> the better my benefit in future, beacuse the benefit will depend on the
> years and the amount which I totally paid.  Could anybody confirm the
> information and give more detail explanation about the issue?  Shoud 
> I pay it or not?  What benefit can I get from it?
> 
FICA is a tax packet for empleyee, usuall include social security and 
medicare tax, around 9% of your paycheck, you need pay it as long as 
15 year of full time work to get full benefit.(full time work means
you at least earn certain amount of money, not necessary 40h/week)

As graduate student, you don't pay FICA during semesters, but RA of PR
or citizen have to pay FICA or something at summer time, depent on your
University. You can not ask university to pay FICA if they are not 
required, because employey have to pay another 7.65% to your social
security account.

As a lot of us get PR, it is the time to learn more about the TAX law.

this is only my opinion, no legal response here.

Lu.

From lads-l@spike.rice.edu  Fri Oct  1 13:14:56 1993
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X-Comment:  Late-Arrival-DependentS-List 
Status: RO

Hi, there!
I has been a PR since last month.  I am doing my RA for my PhD now. 
I have a question concerning the FICA.  In my pay-roll, there is a term 
called FICA which I have never paid.  I was told that the FICA is the 
security tax and related to the benefit in future after I retired and 
medical insurance.  Some one said that the earlier I start pay it,
the better my benefit in future, beacuse the benefit will depend on the
years and the amount which I totally paid.  Could anybody confirm the
information and give more detail explanation about the issue?  Shoud 
I pay it or not?  What benefit can I get from it?

From lads-l@spike.rice.edu  Fri Oct  1 09:08:35 1993
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Subject: slow coming info.
X-Listprocessor-Version: 6.0a -- ListProcessor by Anastasios Kotsikonas
X-Comment:  Late-Arrival-DependentS-List 
Status: RO

At last I got the approve information from the auto-phone of north center
last evening and it said the approval note of mine was sent out on sept.
20 (?!). They didn't put this info into the auto-phone until yesterday. I
guess someone else probably has the same situation. After I posted "what
effect on lads?" yesterday, I got a few responses from netters. Here I
just want express my appriciation to their suggestions and comments. 



From lads-l@spike.rice.edu  Mon Oct 11 14:05:27 1993
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To: Those whose CSPA cases are still pending after sending more files

Dear friends:

Yesterday I sent a fax to Mr. Shi Heping, IFCSS V.P., and briefed the
situation I am facing, i.e., my case is still pending after sending more
files...

Today a fellow from the IFCSS HQ called me and told me that I am not alone
and there lots of people out there with the same situation. He told me that
IFCSS also realizes that it seems that INS centers are not reviewing those
cases yet but he said IFCSS will wait for a couple more days before contacting
INS regarding this matter.

After I sent a mail to LADNET during the weekend I rev received several mails
from some netters with the same problem. Hower However, I lost their addresses
and have to post this message here to reach them. If you are in the same
situation, please fax Mr. Shi Heping. And tell him you need help. I e-mailed
and called IFCSS before, but fax is the only thing that works.

For those who already got your GC, congratulations to you!
For those who are still trying, happy faxing and kept trying! Good luck!

Sincerely.

Jun Qi

From lads-l@spike.rice.edu  Mon Oct 11 14:30:23 1993
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Subject: Re:To: Those whose CSPA cases are still pending after sending more files
X-Listprocessor-Version: 6.0a -- ListProcessor by Anastasios Kotsikonas
X-Comment:  Late-Arrival-DependentS-List 
Status: RO

I got a letter from Northern Center in the early of September
which asked me to give more evidence about my continuous residence
in U.S. after April 11, 1990. What I did was to sent all effective
(not every kind of) evidence to the INS center as soon as I could.
Fortunately, I got my approval notice in the later September (I sent
those evidence in the middle of September). So, my conclusion is that  
they keep reviewing new evidence, and you will get your
approval notice sooner or later provided you are eligible. Good
luck, everybody!

From lads-l@spike.rice.edu  Mon Oct 11 14:37:59 1993
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From: yhu@sfmg01.srl.ford.com (Yang Hu)
To: Multiple recipients of list <lads-l@spike.rice.edu>
Subject: Question on Filing LAD now(in U.S)
X-Listprocessor-Version: 6.0a -- ListProcessor by Anastasios Kotsikonas
X-Comment:  Late-Arrival-DependentS-List 
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Dear netters:
I have a friend who works for a big company.  The company's lawer filed his 
Green Card application based on 1st category Employment-based earlier this 
year.  Because this stupid lawer still don't understand much things about 
GC application, his case has been rejected.  Now my friend think maybe he 
should apply under CSPA since he don't have the control if the lawer continues
to make mistakes.  His major concern is that if he apply now under CSPA, when
his wife can apply as a LAD? And approximately how long it will take for his 
wife to get approved?
Thank you!

From lads-l@spike.rice.edu  Mon Oct 11 15:33:55 1993
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Subject: Re: Question on Filing LAD now(in U.S)
X-Listprocessor-Version: 6.0a -- ListProcessor by Anastasios Kotsikonas
X-Comment:  Late-Arrival-DependentS-List 
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How long his wife will wait can be estimated by the following fact:
1. There are about 50,000 CSPAers, 1/4 of them have lads, so the total lads
who have filed will be 50,000 * 1/4 = 12,000.
2. Each year, there are 2,500 visa for China 3th preference, including those
who seek GC through H-1.
3. Most of the lads have filed at this point and most of them have the 7/1
priority date

So his wife will wait at the end of the line. How long it will take can be
calulated by yourself.

FYI only
Good luck for the long waiting.

From lads-l@spike.rice.edu  Mon Oct 11 15:48:37 1993
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From: guo@bach.convex.com (Yi Guo)
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Subject: question on EB-3 quota
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  A netter just posted some figures answering 'how long LADs will wait ...'.

  Since I am not very familiar with the immigration laws, I hope some netters
may satisfy my curiosity or clarify my understanding on EB-3 quota:
 
  It's mentioned that EB-3 quota for China is 2,500 annually.  And the pool of
candidates for the quota includes LADs and applicants from H-1.  I heard 
sayings that actually LADs and H-1 applicants don't share the same quota.
Under EB-3 there are divisions that one is for EB-3 principal and one for the 
EB-3 family member follow-to-join.  Is this the case?  If so, how the 2,500
is partitioned? 

  Thanks!
                                             

From lads-l@spike.rice.edu  Tue Oct 12 12:15:14 1993
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From: DEFANG.PATHLOGY@mhs1.sth.ufl.edu (DEFANG)
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Subject: Money order
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Hi Netters:
Does any body know how I can find out whether a money order has
been cleared out or not, that I sent to INS attached with I-485. 
The yellow copy of the money order has the address of the money
order company, but doesn't have a phone number.

Any respose would be appreciated.


From lads-l@spike.rice.edu  Tue Oct 12 14:27:37 1993
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From: hua7291@med1s0.engr.ccny.cuny.edu (Mi Mi)
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Subject: Money order
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   Date: Tue, 12 Oct 93 12:19:35 CDT
   Reply-To: DEFANG.PATHLOGY@mhs1.sth.ufl.edu
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   X-Comment:  Late-Arrival-DependentS-List 

   Hi Netters:
   Does any body know how I can find out whether a money order has
   been cleared out or not, that I sent to INS attached with I-485. 
   The yellow copy of the money order has the address of the money
   order company, but doesn't have a phone number.

   Any respose would be appreciated.


You can check with the dealer from whom you brought the money order,
they should have the telephone, and be able to check if your  money order
is cleared or not.

Mi Mi


From lads-l@spike.rice.edu  Tue Oct 12 20:39:08 1993
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Subject: lads question
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Hi, friends: Does anybody know that the September window for LADs still open?
 Can the LADs I-485 application still be filed now?
     Any response would be appreciated.         10/12/93

From lads-l@spike.rice.edu  Tue Oct 12 21:50:46 1993
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Subject: Re:  Money order
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Status: RO

Money order is equivalent to cash.  Once you give it to
somebody else, it's theirs.  So, there is no question
of a money order been cleared or not.  Bank that issued
the money order must pay the money order.

From lads-l@spike.rice.edu  Wed Oct 13 07:55:25 1993
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From: jun@geol.niu.edu (Jun Qi)
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Dear friends:

CNN is having a sensational programs about Chinese illegal immigrants
this week and I think we should do something to protect and justify the
common interests of Chinese community. From my point of view, smuggling 
immigrants is a very nasty business and I hate to see it happened. 
However, the stereotypes and hatred expressed and imposed by CNN and its
reporters really astonished me. 

The California Governor blamed those illegal Mexicans for the recession in
that state. Now CNN is blaming those Chinese for all the problems in this
country. At the end of the Tuesday's show, an angry CNN reporter claims that
they will continue to show the American people how those Chinese people
"corrupt the whole nation!" (Wednesday 7pm eastern time?).

I am wondering what is the difference in number between those Mexican
and Chinese illegal immigrants. I am also wondering if CNN got the nerve
to say the same thing about those Mexican people. Although the American
society is generous and liberal in general, some stereotypes and bias are
deep-rooted among the media. We've achieved a lot in the past. And we still
have a long way to go in defending ourselves.

Thank you for your attention. I hope we can unite and make our voices
louder and stronger!



From lads-l@spike.rice.edu  Wed Oct 13 11:41:54 1993
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Subject: inquiry about CSPA dependents in China
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>From:	MX%"MAILER-DAEMON@med1s0.engr.ccny.cuny.edu" 11-OCT-1993 11:11:50.51
To:	XIACHEN
CC:	
Subj:	Returned mail: Service unavailable

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   ----- Transcript of session follows -----
<<< RCPT TO:<hua7291@med2s0.engr.ccny.cuny.edu>
<<< DATA
>>> HELO med1s0.engr.ccny.cuny.edu
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554 <hua7291@med2s0.engr.ccny.cuny.edu>... Service unavailable: Bad file number

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>From: xiachen@vaxa.weeg.uiowa.edu
To: hua7291@med2s0.engr.ccny.cuny.edu
Message-Id: <00973DAF.7E247A40.20865@vaxa.weeg.uiowa.edu>
Subject: A question about CSPA dependents in China

Dear Mi. Mi.:    In CCNL dated 9/26, you suggested that CSPAers who have 
dependents in China (or 3rd country) to apply for nonimmigration visa. I
woundered how this could be possible? For example, I am in J-1 and got 
PR approved, and my wife was denied for J-2 several times during 2/92-
6/93 because of the immigration intent.  
	You also recommeded to file EB-3 or EB-2 at the same time.  My 
question is how can you decide which one to go for since I can only file
I-824 and INS will do all the rest?
	Thank you very much if you can reply.

From lads-l@spike.rice.edu  Thu Oct 14 10:04:42 1993
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Message-Id: <9310141508.AA02274@summit.ATMOS.ColoState.Edu>
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From: Ping Ding <ping@summit.atmos.colostate.edu>
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Subject: CSPA-tuition
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Some people have posted a lot of information about the waiver of the
non-residence tuition fee under CSPA. I remember that one of them  
(from California University ?) said the wavier can be based on some  
legal analysis and the effective date can be back to 1992, or  
something like this. Could somebody kindly make this clear? Your help
will be appreciated very much!

Ping Ding

From lads-l@spike.rice.edu  Fri Oct 15 13:48:16 1993
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From: Jian Baojian <JBAOJIAN@beach.utmb.edu>
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Subject: valid time for medical exam.
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Dear friends:
Could some people tell me how long would it be valid for the Medical
Examination of PR?
Thanks.

From lads-l@spike.rice.edu  Fri Oct 15 15:39:30 1993
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From: zhu@spec.mda.uth.tmc.edu (Yunqiang Zhu)
To: Multiple recipients of list <lads-l@spike.rice.edu>
Subject: **HELP***
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Hi There;

I filed I-284 in NIS Souther Center for my wife, after I got
my approval notice in the middle of Sept. A week later, the
Souther Center return I-824 to me and ask me to file it to
local NIS office. And I went to Houston INS office and file
I-824 again. Yesterday my I-824 was returned again. It says
that I have to choose a US consulate. In my conver letter, I
said I hope my wife can get her visa issued in Mexico or Canada.
However, I did not specify which one bacause I do not know.

Is there anyboby know that which US consulate I should choose?
I saw someone said that world jounal had a article about this.
Could someone give me an idea? Any help will be fully appreciated.

Thanks

Y. Zhu

From lads-l@spike.rice.edu  Sat Oct 16 11:23:06 1993
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Subject: LADS
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The IFCSS does not seem to concern about LADS issue.  We should organize ourselv
 to push IFCSS.  There is  something that IFCSS can do.  The lobby of IFCSS will
be very helpful if we can push them to work on this.  If we can not use the worl
d-wide remaining quota, as we did before, at least we can ask all the LADS to be
granted temperary green cards.  That is, we ask each of us to be granted even if
there is no enough quota now, then we can wait in line for formal green card.
Even if it takes several years under this condition, it would not matter.

From lads-l@spike.rice.edu  Sat Oct 16 16:39:20 1993
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Subject: china's EB-3 visa
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Hi there!

Based on IFCSS infor., the china's EB-3 visa number is available in this month 
to people having priority date July 1, 1993.  Does anybody know if local
INS SHOULD process all LAD's applications with priority date 7-1-1993.  In
another word, if "china's EB-3 visa is available in this month to people having
priority date 7-1-1993" means everybody with 7-1-1993 priority date SHOULD get 
a visa or an interview from local INS in this month.
If someone knows the answer, please post it in the LAD net.  Thank you.

From lads-l@spike.rice.edu  Sat Oct 16 19:17:26 1993
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From: wlu@aris.ss.uci.edu (Wei Lu)
To: Multiple recipients of list <lads-l@spike.rice.edu>
Subject: Dependents in China or 3rd country.
X-Listprocessor-Version: 6.0a -- ListProcessor by Anastasios Kotsikonas
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Dear Netter:
Since the IFCSS does not seem to concern about LADS issue, we should organize ourselv

From lads-l@spike.rice.edu  Sun Oct 17 02:32:01 1993
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From: minghui zhang <zha6@midway.uchicago.edu>
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Subject: Re: LADS
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Status: RO

> The IFCSS does not seem to concern about LADS issue.  We should organize ourselv
>  to push IFCSS.  There is  something that IFCSS can do.  The lobby of IFCSS will
> be very helpful if we can push them to work on this.  If we can not use the worl
> d-wide remaining quota, as we did before, at least we can ask all the LADS to be
> granted temperary green cards.  That is, we ask each of us to be granted even if
> there is no enough quota now, then we can wait in line for formal green card.
> Even if it takes several years under this condition, it would not matter.
> 


If your bottom line is to have a temperary green card for each LAD and
wait in line for a formal one, I've got to say we have got both of
them.  Look, most LADs have filed I-485 in Aug. and Sept. and applied
work permit.  The consequence is those LADs are LEGALLY staying in the
states, waiting in line for green cards and are allowed to work
LEGALLY.  Don't you think that is a temperary green card?  Well, maybe
better, they might not need to pay social security taxes.  

I really think the world wide quota issure should be left to the LCs.
I kind of remember some LC said things like 'united we can achieve
anything".  For their own good, we have to give them some reason to do
so. -:>

Just relax and get ready to sign anything from LCs regarding this
quota issure. -:> -:>

MZ

From lads-l@spike.rice.edu  Sun Oct 17 02:42:38 1993
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From: minghui zhang <zha6@midway.uchicago.edu>
To: Multiple recipients of list <lads-l@spike.rice.edu>
Subject: Re: china's EB-3 visa
X-Listprocessor-Version: 6.0a -- ListProcessor by Anastasios Kotsikonas
X-Comment:  Late-Arrival-DependentS-List 
Status: RO

> Hi there!
> 
> Based on IFCSS infor., the china's EB-3 visa number is available in this month 
> to people having priority date July 1, 1993.  Does anybody know if local
> INS SHOULD process all LAD's applications with priority date 7-1-1993.  In
> another word, if "china's EB-3 visa is available in this month to people having
> priority date 7-1-1993" means everybody with 7-1-1993 priority date SHOULD get 
> a visa or an interview from local INS in this month.
> If someone knows the answer, please post it in the LAD net.  Thank you.
> 


We went to INS-Chicago this past Wednesday for my wife's LAD
interview.  A officer there told us the cut date of July 1 really cut
July 1 off.  Only those with a priority date earlier than july 1 --
not include July 1 -- can get a visa, or an interview or a chance to file
I-485 for that matter.

MZ 

From lads-l@spike.rice.edu  Sun Oct 17 10:08:07 1993
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Subject: New policy from PRC consulate?
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Status: RO

Recently, I heard that there is a new policy about childern
born in U.S. back to china. It says that the child must get a visa  
from 

chinese consulate if their parents have got PR. In the other words,
the travel permit will no longer be issued to those kind of childern.
Anybody can confirm this message? And are there any kindness people
who can tell the procedure to get a chinese visa for a child?
Your responce is appreciated!

From lads-l@spike.rice.edu  Sun Oct 17 14:35:26 1993
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Subject: Priority Date
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Hi, there.  I have some questions about the priority date.  Since the 
priority date of some lads are later than 7/1/93, can they be granted 
an interview oppotunity?  Do local INS offices process their applications
if their priority date is not current?  Is it possible that the priority
date advances in the next few months?  Thanks a lot.


From lads-l@spike.rice.edu  Sun Oct 17 14:39:28 1993
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Message-Id: <199310171936.AA17806@plains.NoDak.edu>
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From: Hualiang Ji <ji@plains.nodak.edu>
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Subject: Lads in Minnesota
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Have any lad logged his/her application in Bloominton, MN gotten anything yet?
I filed there on August 18 and havn't heared anything from them, not even about 
the work permit.
Hualiang

From lads-l@spike.rice.edu  Sun Oct 17 19:22:46 1993
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Subject:      lads
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Hi, netter:
I still remember one guy post a question in lad net in the end of Sept.
to ask how to handle the case if A# in the approval notice is not the
same as the one in the receipt notice.  I have been keeping read the
e-mail every day and have not got the answer yet, because it happened to
me aslo and my lad used the A# in the receipt notice to apply for PR in
the early of August.  Does anybody know about it?  I'd appreciate!

B. Shi

From lads-l@spike.rice.edu  Sun Oct 17 19:40:30 1993
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Subject: new lads
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I am a CSPA principle and get PR approved last month of priority date
June 2, 1993. My wife will come to America next week with F-2 visa status.
Right now, I understand that my wife will have to apply to FB-2 or filing
I-824 ("following to join") for adjusting her status. what is the difference
between them? Which one is faster? Will she have to be interviewed overseas
later if proved? Does anyone know any detailed procedures for " following to
join"? How can she apply work permit? Please reply me. I really need your help.

Thanks!

From lads-l@spike.rice.edu  Sun Oct 17 20:56:44 1993
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From: cheng@biomech.mech.utah.edu (Geping Cheng)
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Subject: wrong A#
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>Hi, netter:
>I still remember one guy post a question in lad net in the end of Sept.
>to ask how to handle the case if A# in the approval notice is not the
>same as the one in the receipt notice.  I have been keeping read the
>e-mail every day and have not got the answer yet, because it happened to
>me aslo and my lad used the A# in the receipt notice to apply for PR in
>the early of August.  Does anybody know about it?  I'd appreciate!
>
>B. Shi
>
>
>
I have the same sitiuation as yours.  I just pointed out it to the local INS office.  The officer in window just made a note of this.  How it can be solved
is unknown.

Cheng

From lads-l@spike.rice.edu  Sun Oct 17 21:50:43 1993
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From: hua7291@med2s0.engr.ccny.cuny.edu (Mi Mi)
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Subject: new lads
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   Date: Sun, 17 Oct 93 19:43:19 CDT
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   X-Comment:  Late-Arrival-DependentS-List 

   I am a CSPA principle and get PR approved last month of priority date
   June 2, 1993. My wife will come to America next week with F-2 visa status.
   Right now, I understand that my wife will have to apply to FB-2 or filing
   I-824 ("following to join") for adjusting her status. what is the difference
   between them? Which one is faster? Will she have to be interviewed overseas
   later if proved? Does anyone know any detailed procedures for " following to
   join"? How can she apply work permit? Please reply me. I really need your help.

   Thanks!

Since your wife comes with a valid visa (technically it is not, since your
PR is granted, but for CSPA reason, it is considered valid though), she does 
not have to go to the third country. As soon as she arrives, you can apply
for her in the FB-2 pool, and get the date of her filing PR as her priority
date. When the the time window open s for you (7/2), you can also apply EB-3
for her. When she files, she can apply for EAD as well. 

Mi Mi

From lads-l@spike.rice.edu  Mon Oct 18 09:40:28 1993
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From: hua7291@med2s0.engr.ccny.cuny.edu (Mi Mi)
To: Multiple recipients of list <lads-l@spike.rice.edu>
Subject: LADS
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/   From: minghui zhang <zha6@midway.uchicago.edu>
/   > The IFCSS does not seem to concern about LADS issue.  We should organize 
/   >ourselves to push IFCSS.  There is  something that IFCSS can do.  The 
/   >lobby of IFCSS will be very helpful if we can push them to work on this. 
/   >If we can not use the world-wide remaining quota, as we did before, at 
/   >least we can ask all the LADS to be granted temperary green cards.  That 
/   >is, we ask each of us to be granted even if there is no enough quota now, 
/   >then we can wait in line for formal green card. Even if it takes several 
/   >years under this condition, it would not matter.
/   > 
/
/   If your bottom line is to have a temperary green card for each LAD and
/   wait in line for a formal one, I've got to say we have got both of
/   them.  Look, most LADs have filed I-485 in Aug. and Sept. and applied
/   work permit.  The consequence is those LADs are LEGALLY staying in the
/   states, waiting in line for green cards and are allowed to work
/   LEGALLY.  Don't you think that is a temperary green card?  Well, maybe
/   better, they might not need to pay social security taxes.  
/
/   I really think the world wide quota issure should be left to the LCs.
/   I kind of remember some LC said things like 'united we can achieve
/   anything".  For their own good, we have to give them some reason to do
/   so. -:>
/
/   Just relax and get ready to sign anything from LCs regarding this
/   quota issure. -:> -:>
/
/   MZ

Well, the lads-net is getting cooled down somewhat. As a matter of fact, 
most lads without DED problem are waiting to be interviewed, while those
with DED problem are still waiting something from INS. Basically speaking,
the problem remains for ALL the lads is when and how. Although all of the 
local INS offices are acting differently towards lads problem, but according
i]to the Immigration Law, they will be co-operative. Can and can not is 
really out of question. Our bottom line has been met already, thanks IFCSS
past efforts and the unity of CSS community. 

As the world-wide quota problem, we Lads-net Committee are still working on
it. Everyone, at least those those who subscribe Lads-net for their lads,
understands the world-wide quota issue benefits LC more then lads, since 
the problem for lads is when and how, and for some LC, it is can and can not.
But we must remember the lads are OURS, and the LC are OUR brothers and
sisters. Although Mi Mi Sr. has been very disappointed by the response from
the majority of the Lc-l community, he still believes, in time, those lc-l
brothers and sisters will come to realize that they had been wrong for their
own good, even when it is too late to do anything about it. They will
have less hard feeling to us, because we have been trying to help them as 
well. 

Just remember as a CSS community in whole, EC and LC are brothers and sistes.
When you go through a door, you will hold the door for a while for the 
person who is just behind you, even he is a stranger to you. Just hold that
INS door for a second, the people behind you are YOUR brothers and sisters.

Mi Mi Sr. even tends to hold the door for all the Chinese people, entered
documentedly or undocumentedly, since there are too few Chinese in the US.
Of course Mi Mi will not fight for that course since he feels closer to
those LC CSS brothers and sistes. Besides, the undocumented Chinese have
other channels to adjust, amnesty, for example, not neccesary EB-3. 

The CSS community has been splited too much. Let us try our best to unit
us again!

Mi Mi Sr.

 


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% Mr. Mi Mi, Sr., A Mice Chasing Dog                          %
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%    survey@spike.rice.edu                                    %
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From lads-l@spike.rice.edu  Mon Oct 18 14:41:28 1993
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  - - The original note follows - -

Return-Path: <@PSUVM.PSU.EDU:Donglin.Mi@DARTMOUTH.EDU>
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Date: 17 Oct 93 16:49:55 EDT
>From: Donglin.Mi@Dartmouth.EDU (Donglin Mi)
Subject: Re: LADS
To: YXL6@PSUVM.PSU.EDU

--- You wrote:
The IFCSS does not seem to concern about LADS issue.  We should organize
ourselv
 to push IFCSS.  There is  something that IFCSS can do.  The lobby of IFCSS
will
be very helpful if we can push them to work on this.  If we can not use the
worl
d-wide remaining quota, as we did before, at least we can ask all the LADS to
be
granted temperary green cards.  That is, we ask each of us to be granted even
if
there is no enough quota now, then we can wait in line for formal green card.
Even if it takes several years under this condition, it would not matter.
--- end of quoted material ---

I was talking to Shi Heping about the Lads issue when he visited our campus
during the Mid-autumn Festival. He said that the IFCSS headquarter was not
able to do anything about the Lads because the IFCSS Council had ordered the
headquarter to stop doing anything about the Lads. He said that they had to
obey the decision of the Council according to the constitution. There are
nine of sixteen members of the Council are LCs. Before we ask the IFCSS to do
something about the Lads, we have to ask the majority of the Council to
support our suggestion.

BTW, would MI MI try to communicate with the members of the IFCSS Council?

From lads-l@spike.rice.edu  Mon Oct 18 15:32:42 1993
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Subject: need help
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   I am a CSPA principle and filed my application on June 30 to Eastern Center.
I haven't got approval letter.
   I received a letter from the Center on Sep.30 dated Sep.23 in which m

they wanted me to get another two sets of fingerprints. I went to local INS and got them done and local INS sent them for me. So far I didn't get any 
information. I am warried about how long it would be for the processing and I amso concerning my priority date. The first blue color letter dated July 27 with 
A# was received on July 30. Does this mean my priority date is July 27 ?
  Dear Mi Mi, I need your help to solve my problem. I appreciate your response.
  Thanks.

From lads-l@spike.rice.edu  Mon Oct 18 16:40:56 1993
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From: hua7291@med2s0.engr.ccny.cuny.edu (Mi Mi)
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Subject: LADS
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   Date: Mon, 18 Oct 93 14:44:58 CDT
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     - - The original note follows - -

   Return-Path: <@PSUVM.PSU.EDU:Donglin.Mi@DARTMOUTH.EDU>
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   Date: 17 Oct 93 16:49:55 EDT
   From: Donglin.Mi@Dartmouth.EDU (Donglin Mi)
   Subject: Re: LADS
   To: YXL6@PSUVM.PSU.EDU

   --- You wrote:
   The IFCSS does not seem to concern about LADS issue.  We should organize
   ourselv
    to push IFCSS.  There is  something that IFCSS can do.  The lobby of IFCSS
   will
   be very helpful if we can push them to work on this.  If we can not use the
   worl
   d-wide remaining quota, as we did before, at least we can ask all the LADS to
   be
   granted temperary green cards.  That is, we ask each of us to be granted even
   if
   there is no enough quota now, then we can wait in line for formal green card.
   Even if it takes several years under this condition, it would not matter.
   --- end of quoted material ---

   I was talking to Shi Heping about the Lads issue when he visited our campus
   during the Mid-autumn Festival. He said that the IFCSS headquarter was not
   able to do anything about the Lads because the IFCSS Council had ordered the
   headquarter to stop doing anything about the Lads. He said that they had to
   obey the decision of the Council according to the constitution. There are
   nine of sixteen members of the Council are LCs. Before we ask the IFCSS to do
   something about the Lads, we have to ask the majority of the Council to
   support our suggestion.

   BTW, would MI MI try to communicate with the members of the IFCSS Council?



Mi Mi Sr. has been trying to do the aforementioned communication with IFCSS HQ
and IFCSS Council started from July 26, not realizing the aforementioned 
situation "the IFCSS Council had ordered the headquarter to stop doing 
anything about the Lads" in later July. By August 12, without any replying 
heard from IFCSS whatsoever regarding lads-net, one of our committee members
intercepted a message from the net saying the IFCSS Council had invited a lc-l
leader to participate their teleconference. It was not until that incident had
we learnt the sad decision about the order of abandoning our lads issue. We
lads-net committee have been doing our best to launch our own campaign to 
reverse the situation, but the damage had been done already. We had 
communicated with various IFCSS officials regarding the real situation. Lads 
issue is not an one wins and the other loses situation. The lads are 
guaranteed to get their green cards, no matter what happens to them. No body
can change the INA to deny those LADs (or, more precisely, those dependents
of the US PERMANENT RESIDENTS) green cards. As a matter of fact, the speedy
process of those dependents of the US PERMANENT RESIDENTS will benefit LC
community, to the contrary of the common believe accepted by the majority
of LC community. If, all of those dependents of the US PERMANENT RESIDENTS
have to use China's limited pool to adjust their status, then many LC who
have to use EB-3 and/or FB-2 categories will find long long waiting lines 
ahead of them, and unfortunately, the majority of the LC will surely use that
two categories to adjust their status. But it had been very difficult to 
convice those guys who make decisions inside or outside, pro-IFCSS or against
IFCSS. It is quite to our absolute dissappointment that IFCSS Council has made 
such a decision. Neither lads nor LCs win. Both are losers. The biggest losers
are LC themselves. Well, just like a modern Chiese saying, "we pay the 
tuition", that is all. Not realizing what had happened to them, the LC are 
paying their tuition dues dearly, and still claiming they had won a great
victory over the IFCSS! Well, as Chairman Mao says, "You will not know the
tast of the pear without eating it!" Let them enjoy their pears, Mi Mi Sr.
has done enough communications to convey the message to the LC community, but,
who knows how many believed him? 

BTW, it is never to late to learn something, to do something. United, with
or without our LC brothers and sisters, we CAN achieve something. 

Mi Mi Sr.

 


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% Mr. Mi Mi, Sr., A Mice Chasing Dog                          %
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From lads-l@spike.rice.edu  Mon Oct 18 18:10:48 1993
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Date: Mon, 18 Oct 93 18:10:47 CDT
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From: jun@geol.niu.edu (Jun Qi)
To: Multiple recipients of list <lads-l@spike.rice.edu>
Subject: 
X-Listprocessor-Version: 6.0a -- ListProcessor by Anastasios Kotsikonas
X-Comment:  Late-Arrival-DependentS-List 
Status: RO

Here is another confusing story about IFCSS. . .

When I called IFCSS 2 weeks ago regarding my CSPA application, the guy on 
the phone (one of the LCs?) was very impatient and rude. When I started as
saying " Do you have a minute to hear my case?" That guy just said,
"What the hell is that? Hurry up if you got anything to say!" After I told
my story and asked if IFCSS would help, that guy just said "you gotta deal
with INS yourself, it's a waste of time contacting IFCSS".

However, right after I hanged up the phone, the phone rang. This time a 
gentleman was on the phone and he was very nice and told me he's from
IFCSS (one of the CSPAs?). He told me Mr. Shi Heping had got my fax and
he promised that they would try to help in the near future. . .

Well , that's it. It seems to me that some IFCSS people don't even care
about CSPA cases, not to mention LAD!

By the way, if anybody got approval letter dated in October from Northern 
Center, please let me know. Thank you!

Jun Qi


From lads-l@spike.rice.edu  Mon Oct 18 21:42:29 1993
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From: guo@bach.convex.com (Yi Guo)
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Subject: INS cables content (request)
X-Listprocessor-Version: 6.0a -- ListProcessor by Anastasios Kotsikonas
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Hi, there,

I have four questions/help request that some of you may help, it's regarding my
wife's LAD filing.  Some background first, and then the four
questions/requests: 


My wife went to INS today and received a pending decision that she may not be
in her F-1 status due to some questionable judgements and treatments.

We, along with her current school's international advisor, all believe that she
is in F-1 status, until today when the INS examiner told her that the transfer
procedure she had two years ago may not be correct, and so that her status now
as a F-1 student is not valid. 

Two years ago, she got sick leave from the previous school and then she applied
to transfer to the current school.  The international advisor at the previous
school told us on phone that her sick leave is approved and told her to take
care of her health.  Then, when she asked the previous office for help on
transfer procedure they told her that she was out of status and they wouldn't
provide info that she was in F-1 status.  The advisor from the current
international office told us that we can get her reinstated either by filing
for reinstate to INS or by reentering the U.S. on the new I-20.  When we told
her that we had already planned a short trip to Canada, the advisor told us
we can just let the border INS inspecter stamp the new I-20 and get this thing
over with.  So we followed the advice and secured the stamp on her I-20.

Now, during the LAD filing examination on her file, the INS asked the previous
school wheter she had been in status and they said no, along with other 
unthinkable "supporting info" (I may sue the old school on this misinformation
after talking with a lawyer).  And the INS examiner then told us that if she
is out of status then, she should have a new F-1 visa for the current school
when reentering the border from Canada.  Since she just had a stamp on the
I-20, her reentering the states is considered illegal entry (funny that the
border inspecter never point this out to us then, and that we entered with all 
documents and followed the procedures to be inspected).


Now my questions:
    1) Is it really necessary to get another visa when entering the U.S. from
Canada to get the F-1 status?
    2) Should the school advise the student if they think the student is out
of status if not reporting to school at such such time, instead of when
asked by the student way later and told the student of the our-of-status?
If so, is there any way to treat this kind of mistreatment as an excuse for
any unawared out of status situations?
    3) What is the INS rules on out-of-status LADs?  Can anyone provide the
complete INS interim rules, and later INS cables on LAD filing?  (My account
was damaged last weekend by some system fault and I lost all the docs I need
to restudy on).
    4) Can any friends in the Dallas area recommend a good immigration lawyer
to handle the case?  I need to get such legal help to clarify our situation and
bring about possible law suit on the previous school on various concerns 
(including possible embezzlement on my wife's admission deposit by some school
official/organization, since her deposit was erronously said to be returned
to us upon our request while we never asked for that and never received that).


Thank you in advance on any helps/experiences you may offer/share.  And wish
you all good lucks in the INS' ridiculous actions (according to the current
school advisor, the INS examiner we talked to acted "really silly", hope she
is right, sigh!)

From lads-l@spike.rice.edu  Tue Oct 19 11:24:54 1993
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From: hua7291@med2s0.engr.ccny.cuny.edu (Mi Mi)
To: Multiple recipients of list <lads-l@spike.rice.edu>
Subject: 
X-Listprocessor-Version: 6.0a -- ListProcessor by Anastasios Kotsikonas
X-Comment:  Late-Arrival-DependentS-List 
Status: RO


Dear Lads-net Netters:

After revisions made by various concerned netters, and a Ph.D. candidate 
majoring English and his Professor, we finalized our petition letter. 
Since the signatures are still rushing in, we lads-net committee decide to 
send out our petition letters in waves, each wave contains a new collection 
of signatures, until we get the attention we need. 

As CSPA is implemented, our lads, are left forgotten by some parties. More
attention is paid to our undocumented fellow country people, since they
bring more, much more bussiness to the Immigration Lawyer's Community. As
our counterpart, the late-arriving-students are organizing themselvs to 
vigorously participate in the IFCSS and CSPA affairs, we lads community, 
are patiently sitting on the "cold benches" watching the games going on.
Well, we need to do something more than watching.

Following is the final version of our petition letter, and addresses you 
can send them the letters. Our collective petition letters containing first
round of signatures (total 524, cut off before August 25) are sent out by 
Mi Mi and other aommittee members. It is your turn to send in yours, with
your signatures and address. Since there is no lawyers working on our side
(we can not afford the price), since so many lawyers working very hard on the 
other side, we have to do something. If we are even forgotten by ourselvs,
than who cares us? 

Please step forward, and fire your round of bullets: each dear netter
fires 5 bullets, and there will be 1000 letters for each recipients, and 
that will surely make a difference! Remember what I forwarded to you the
other day, Madam Rita A.Boie is back from her vocation, and Mr. Clinton
has nothing particular to do in the comming weekend, so, please!

Madam Rita A.Boie
Senior Immigration Examier
Adjudication Branch
Immigration & Naturalization Services
425 I Street NW, room 5307
Washington, DC 20536
FAX: (202)514-0198

White House:
The Honorable William Clinton
The White House
1600 Pennsyvania Avenue, N.W.
Washington DC 20500
FAX: (202) 456-2461

Attorney General
The Honorable Madam Janet Reno
U.S. Attorney General
Fax: (202) 514-4371

Ms. Philis Coven
Assistant to Attorney General
Fax:(202)-514-0238

Mr. Eric Schwartz
Director of Refugees & Humanitarian Affairs
National Security Council
The White House, !600 Pennsylvania Ave.
Washington D.C. 20506

RE: Chinese Student Protection Act (CSPA)

	We, a group of concerned individuals who have signed 
our names and addresses below, would like to call your 
kindly attention to the following problems involved in 
subjecting Late-Arriving Dependents (LAD) of CSPA principals 
to the China quota.

	(1) According to the survey made by the Headquarters of 
the Independent Federation of Chinese Students and Scholars 
(IFCSS HQ), there are approximately 10000 eligible LADs in 
the U.S., who may file their applications under EB-3 or FB-2 
during this August and September. Since the annual China 
quota in EB-3 or FB-2 is about 2500, these LADs only will 
cause a backlog in China's quota for at least four years. 
This means that no other Chinese nationals can file 
applications for adjustment of status under EB-3 or FB-2 
categories in the next four years. What is worse, according 
to the INS Cable on August 13, those undocumented Chinese 
nationals who came before April 11, 1990 and have since 
obtained an advance parole to re-enter the U.S. are now 
allowed to apply under CSPA. While this new decision 
reflects the humanitarian and protective spirit embedded in 
the Executive Order 12711, these additional applicants with 
their LADs actually face even greater difficulties, because 
most of their LADs are queued after the existing pool of 
LADs whose principals entered the United States legally. 
These people, then, will be subject to an even longer period 
of family separation. In addition, the unpredictable number 
of LADs of undocumented Chinese nationals will jam the 
normal China EB-3 and FB-2 categories for even more years. 
The traditional values of family ties, family unity and 
humanity, cherished so dearly by the American people, are 
also deeply rooted in the Chinese culture and in every 
Chinese family. The anticipated long separation due to visa 
quota allocation will surely bring agony and misery to those 
families, in contradiction to the humanitarian spirit 
embedded in the INA, Executive order 12711 and CSPA.

	(2) For dependents still remaining in China, the 
situation is even more bleak. These individuals, most of 
whom are minor children, as our survey of our LADs community 
shows, would be required to wait in China until visa numbers 
are available. They could potentially be separated from 
their parents for many years. The separation will not only 
deprive these minor children of their much needed parental 
care, but also strain the precious family ties in those 
families. In addition, many of the dependents, both in the 
U.S. and in China, who are now considered children, might 
reach the age of 21 prior to visa availability. This would 
disqualify them for visa issuance.

	To solve these problems, we would like to suggest the 
following:

	(1) Re-allocate the LADs into the world quota. Since 
the CSPA principals have been allocated into the world-wide 
quota leftovers for fiscal year 1993, it is reasonable to 
assume that there might be similar world-wide quota 
leftovers for the next few years. Instead of wasting these 
leftover world-wide quotas while letting the LADs block 
China's regular EB-3 and EB-2 channels, re-allocating LADs 
to the world quota would solve the backlog problem, thus 
benefiting many Chinese families at the expense of no-one.

	(2) Establish a blanket family unity program to include 
all late-arriving dependents. This program should mirror the 
benefits of Executive Order 12711 in (a) giving favorable 
considerations to the dependents in China who request non-
immigrant visas to visit their family in the U.S., so that 
their visa application will not be simply rejected due to 
the "immigration intent"; (b) presuming the non-immigrant 
status of LADs for adjustment purposes, so as to eliminate 
the DED problem faced by an estimated 50% of the LAD 
population; (c) providing liberal advance paroles; (d) 
providing employment authorization for the dependents while 
their applications are being processed; and (e) allowing 
children who are under twenty-one on the date of the CSPA 
principal's approval to be eligible for adjustment, even if 
they are over twenty-one at the date of application for such 
adjustment. This family unity program should solve problems 
in the case by case voluntary departure program and shorten 
family separation resulting from non-immigrant visa denial.

	Thank you for your attention. We are most anxiously 
looking forward to hearing from you.

Sincerely Yours,









From lads-l@spike.rice.edu  Tue Oct 19 14:02:30 1993
Received: from  (localhost.rice.edu) by spike.rice.edu (AA06648); Tue, 19 Oct 93 14:02:30 CDT
Date: Tue, 19 Oct 93 14:02:30 CDT
Message-Id: <9310191853.AA22912@lorien.creol.ucf.edu>
Errors-To: lads-request@spike.rice.edu
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Originator: lads-l@spike.rice.edu
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From: QIAN.admin@admin.creol.ucf.edu (QIAN)
To: Multiple recipients of list <lads-l@spike.rice.edu>
Subject: RE: <None>
X-Listprocessor-Version: 6.0a -- ListProcessor by Anastasios Kotsikonas
X-Comment:  Late-Arrival-DependentS-List 
Status: RO

>Date: 19-Oct-93 11:26
>From: MMi @ SMTP (Mi Mi) {lads-l@spike.rice.edu}
>To: QIAN@admin (Shunning Qian)
>Subject: <None>
>
>Dear Lads-net Netters:
>
>After revisions made by various concerned netters, and a Ph.D. candidate
>majoring English and his Professor, we finalized our petition letter.
>Since the signatures are still rushing in, we lads-net committee decide to
>send out our petition letters in waves, each wave contains a new collection
>of signatures, until we get the attention we need.
>
>As CSPA is implemented, our lads, are left forgotten by some parties. More
>attention is paid to our undocumented fellow country people, since they
>bring more, much more bussiness to the Immigration Lawyer's Community. As
>our counterpart, the late-arriving-students are organizing themselvs to
>vigorously participate in the IFCSS and CSPA affairs, we lads community,
>are patiently sitting on the "cold benches" watching the games going on.
>Well, we need to do something more than watching.
>
>Following is the final version of our petition letter, and addresses you
>can send them the letters. Our collective petition letters containing first
>round of signatures (total 524, cut off before August 25) are sent out by
>Mi Mi and other aommittee members. It is your turn to send in yours, with
>your signatures and address. Since there is no lawyers working on our side
>(we can not afford the price), since so many lawyers working very hard on the
>other side, we have to do something. If we are even forgotten by ourselvs,
>than who cares us?
>
>Please step forward, and fire your round of bullets: each dear netter
>fires 5 bullets, and there will be 1000 letters for each recipients, and
>that will surely make a difference! Remember what I forwarded to you the
>other day, Madam Rita A.Boie is back from her vocation, and Mr. Clinton
>has nothing particular to do in the comming weekend, so, please!
>
>Madam Rita A.Boie
>Senior Immigration Examier
>Adjudication Branch
>Immigration & Naturalization Services
>425 I Street NW, room 5307
>Washington, DC 20536
>FAX: (202)514-0198
>
>White House:
>The Honorable William Clinton
>The White House
>1600 Pennsyvania Avenue, N.W.
>Washington DC 20500
>FAX: (202) 456-2461
>
>Attorney General
>The Honorable Madam Janet Reno
>U.S. Attorney General
>Fax: (202) 514-4371
>
>Ms. Philis Coven
>Assistant to Attorney General
>Fax:(202)-514-0238
>
>Mr. Eric Schwartz
>Director of Refugees & Humanitarian Affairs
>National Security Council
>The White House, !600 Pennsylvania Ave.
>Washington D.C. 20506
>
>RE: Chinese Student Protection Act (CSPA)
>
>	We, a group of concerned individuals who have signed
>our names and addresses below, would like to call your
>kindly attention to the following problems involved in
>subjecting Late-Arriving Dependents (LAD) of CSPA principals
>to the China quota.
>
>	(1) According to the survey made by the Headquarters of
>the Independent Federation of Chinese Students and Scholars
>(IFCSS HQ), there are approximately 10000 eligible LADs in
>the U.S., who may file their applications under EB-3 or FB-2
>during this August and September. Since the annual China
>quota in EB-3 or FB-2 is about 2500, these LADs only will
>cause a backlog in China's quota for at least four years.
>This means that no other Chinese nationals can file
>applications for adjustment of status under EB-3 or FB-2
>categories in the next four years. What is worse, according
>to the INS Cable on August 13, those undocumented Chinese
>nationals who came before April 11, 1990 and have since
>obtained an advance parole to re-enter the U.S. are now
>allowed to apply under CSPA. While this new decision
>reflects the humanitarian and protective spirit embedded in
>the Executive Order 12711, these additional applicants with
>their LADs actually face even greater difficulties, because
>most of their LADs are queued after the existing pool of
>LADs whose principals entered the United States legally.
>These people, then, will be subject to an even longer period
>of family separation. In addition, the unpredictable number
>of LADs of undocumented Chinese nationals will jam the
>normal China EB-3 and FB-2 categories for even more years.
>The traditional values of family ties, family unity and
>humanity, cherished so dearly by the American people, are
>also deeply rooted in the Chinese culture and in every
>Chinese family. The anticipated long separation due to visa
>quota allocation will surely bring agony and misery to those
>families, in contradiction to the humanitarian spirit
>embedded in the INA, Executive order 12711 and CSPA.
>
>	(2) For dependents still remaining in China, the
>situation is even more bleak. These individuals, most of
>whom are minor children, as our survey of our LADs community
>shows, would be required to wait in China until visa numbers
>are available. They could potentially be separated from
>their parents for many years. The separation will not only
>deprive these minor children of their much needed parental
>care, but also strain the precious family ties in those
>families. In addition, many of the dependents, both in the
>U.S. and in China, who are now considered children, might
>reach the age of 21 prior to visa availability. This would
>disqualify them for visa issuance.
>
>	To solve these problems, we would like to suggest the
>following:
>
>	(1) Re-allocate the LADs into the world quota. Since
>the CSPA principals have been allocated into the world-wide
>quota leftovers for fiscal year 1993, it is reasonable to
>assume that there might be similar world-wide quota
>leftovers for the next few years. Instead of wasting these
>leftover world-wide quotas while letting the LADs block
>China's regular EB-3 and EB-2 channels, re-allocating LADs
>to the world quota would solve the backlog problem, thus
>benefiting many Chinese families at the expense of no-one.
>
>	(2) Establish a blanket family unity program to include
>all late-arriving dependents. This program should mirror the
>benefits of Executive Order 12711 in (a) giving favorable
>considerations to the dependents in China who request non-
>immigrant visas to visit their family in the U.S., so that
>their visa application will not be simply rejected due to
>the "immigration intent"; (b) presuming the non-immigrant
>status of LADs for adjustment purposes, so as to eliminate
>the DED problem faced by an estimated 50% of the LAD
>population; (c) providing liberal advance paroles; (d)
>providing employment authorization for the dependents while
>their applications are being processed; and (e) allowing
>children who are under twenty-one on the date of the CSPA
>principal's approval to be eligible for adjustment, even if
>they are over twenty-one at the date of application for such
>adjustment. This family unity program should solve problems
>in the case by case voluntary departure program and shorten
>family separation resulting from non-immigrant visa denial.
>
>	Thank you for your attention. We are most anxiously
>looking forward to hearing from you.
>
>Sincerely Yours,
>
Shunning Qian
>
>
>
>
>
>


From lads-l@spike.rice.edu  Tue Oct 19 14:20:22 1993
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Date: Tue, 19 Oct 93 14:20:22 CDT
Message-Id: <9310191917.AA07799@ame2.math.arizona.edu>
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From: "Tityik Wong" <wong@math.arizona.edu>
To: Multiple recipients of list <lads-l@spike.rice.edu>
Subject: parents of PR
X-Listprocessor-Version: 6.0a -- ListProcessor by Anastasios Kotsikonas
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Dear Lads-net Netters,

Does anyone know if PR's of US can apply immigration visas for their
parents in China? Thank you for your time.

Huang
U of Arizona

From lads-l@spike.rice.edu  Tue Oct 19 23:07:59 1993
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From: Tao Fang <taofang@uhunix.uhcc.hawaii.edu>
To: Multiple recipients of list <lads-l@spike.rice.edu>
Subject: Passport Externsion
X-Listprocessor-Version: 6.0a -- ListProcessor by Anastasios Kotsikonas
X-Comment:  Late-Arrival-DependentS-List 
Status: RO


Dear Netter:

It is said that you should always keep your passport with valid date at least
6 months. Many of the CSPAers' passport will be 5 year old soon. If you know
the proceedure, phone #, to renew passport, could you post it on the net?

Does anyone knows the travel documents for those who get GC approved but have
not get the real card?


Thanks.
Fang



From lads-l@spike.rice.edu  Wed Oct 20 10:09:24 1993
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Date: Wed, 20 Oct 93 10:09:24 CDT
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Errors-To: lads-request@spike.rice.edu
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From: hua7291@med2s0.engr.ccny.cuny.edu (Mi Mi)
To: Multiple recipients of list <lads-l@spike.rice.edu>
Subject: 
X-Listprocessor-Version: 6.0a -- ListProcessor by Anastasios Kotsikonas
X-Comment:  Late-Arrival-DependentS-List 
Status: RO


A netter wrote:

/   Mi Mi Sr.,
/   IFCSS Council had ordered the headquarter to stop doing
/   anything about the Lads. That is real? It looks real. IFCSS is so quiet 
/   on LADS. If so, the current IFCSS Council made a big mistake. Could you, 
/   MI MI Sr, ask IFCSS Council what is happened?   Thanks!
/   S.H.

Mi Mi Sr. had learned this two months ago, and had been trying his best to call
up IFCSS Council members and e-mail them with the current situations and
analysis, including all the development regarding the undocumented Chinese
well before anyone realized the real impact of it on the LC. He even asked the
Council to hook him up for the teleconference, which the Council had invited
LC net Chairman to participate. Unfortunately, Mi Mi Sr. had been told that
if he wanted to audit the teleconference, he had to pay from his own pocket,
and without a chance to voice the concern of the lads. It is understandable
that the LC had not been well represented in the IFCSS before, so to shift the
weight towards the LC is the eventual outcome and natural development of
the IFCSS. But, in this particular case, to shut up the EC's voice realy
hurts LC's best interests. Mi Mi Sr. is at the most a lobbist to the IFCSS
organization, he does not belong to any organization except the Lad-Net
Committee, which is a volunteer network group. So he has no mandate to do
anything inside IFCSS. EC do have representatives inside IFCSS. A netter
posted his experience in contacting with IFCSS, and the V.P., an EC, did pay
attention to him. But, as a democratic organization, number does speak itself.
Even though, some lc-l members want to see the downfall of the IFCSS! It
really does not make any sense to me!
                                               
As a matter of fact, Mi Mi Sr. has been auditing the IFCSS Council's
e-mail conference for a quite long time since earlier August, and kept
communication with various members. To his surprise, many members who
realy made the decision were shocked by the arguments Mi Mi Sr. had presented
them, and wanted to investigate further more. Neverthereless, it was too
late.

Well, we are human beings. Human beings make mistakes. IFCSS Council
wants to serve the whole CSS community, not EC in particular. They have
good intention towards all the parties, we shall appreciate this. For the
past and current terms, IFCSS has been trying her best to serve CSS
in general. Those guys are the same as you and me, a foreign student
studying aboard. They spare their precious time to serve us all. Even
though there are many interest groups inside CSS, basically, we are all
seeking a better life in this land. As a matter of fact, just ask yourself,
how many of YOU had contributed to the CSPA lobbying activity? Even though
the lads are yours, what have YOU done to solve the lads problem? When
everyone is happy to reap the harvest, how many cared the crops before
the harvest? Not many. Our current survey shows a very sad tendency
of free-lunchnism. So, please do not blame anyone indide or outside IFCSS.
If you are happy with your green card, please make some little contribution
to the IFCSS. IFCSS's CSPA efforts have saved you thousands dollars and 
troubles. If you are not happy with the CSPA, just think if there had not 
been CSPA, how many more CSS would have lined up in China's EB-2 and EB-3 
in front of you? Assumming all of those EC's are garbages who can not find 
a decent job and get their green cards is a purely fantasy. Please think 
about this. Please DO NOT always demand MORE. If everyone demands more than
he contributes, then this CSS community has absolutely NO future.

As Mi Mi Sr. remembers, he recieved much less insult than those IFCSS
guys. One reason for this is the previous censorship of the lads-net. Some
such messages tried to get through the posting address but were bounced back
to their senders. Some other insulting messages did get through other public
nets. Basically, Mi Mi Sr. is not a big target for anybody. But the insulting
messages were realy disencouraging. Every body should remember how many such
messages have been posted on the public net, and everybody could imagin how 
those IFCSS guys would feel about it? 

IFCSS needs your support, guys!

Mi Mi Sr.

In New York City



From lads-l@spike.rice.edu  Wed Oct 20 10:43:44 1993
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Errors-To: lads-request@spike.rice.edu
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From: hua7291@med2s0.engr.ccny.cuny.edu (Mi Mi)
To: Multiple recipients of list <lads-l@spike.rice.edu>
Subject: PR application window for lads closed in November
X-Listprocessor-Version: 6.0a -- ListProcessor by Anastasios Kotsikonas
X-Comment:  Late-Arrival-DependentS-List 
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Dear Netters:

PR application window for lads is closed in November. You can not apply EB-3 
for your lads NOW until future window openning. However, you can apply FB-2 
anytime once you received your approval notice. You can file EB-3 again later
when the window opens for you. To play it safe and quick, you are encouraged
to file both. There is no penalties if you file a hundred times in a hundred
of categories, except your pocket, and the application fee is not tax 
deductable!

Mi Mi knows quite a few lads have gotten their temporary I-551, the same as 
Mi Mi has right now, and a bounch of CSPAers who are still waiting for the 
approval notice! Is that interesting?

But the way, it seems there is no such category for PR's parents to apply 
for PR. Is there any category for US Citizen's parents to apply PR?

Mi Mi


----------------------------------------------------------------------------
5. Immigration Visa Numbers for November 1993 ........................... 65
----------------------------------------------------------------------------
Source: World Journal, October 13, 1993
Summarized and Translated by Bo Xiong

The U.S. State Department's Visa Bulletin (Telephone: 202-663-1541)
for November 1993:

(Note: the dates in the parentheses are those for the previous month)

Employment-Based

1st (Workers with             Current for most countries including Mainland
     extraordinary skills)    China (Current)

2nd (Advanced degree
     holders and special      Current for most countries, for Mainland China:
     skilled workers):        February 15, 1992 (December 1, 1992)

3rd (Skilled workers
     and Professionals):      Current for most countries, for Mainland China:
                              July 1, 1993 (July 1, 1993)

3rd (other workers):          For most countries including Mainland China:
                              January 8, 1988 (January 1, 1988)

CSPA (1992 Chinese Student
      Protection Act):        Current

4th (Special Immigrants):     Current for most countries including Mainland
                              China (Current)

4th (Religious Workers):      Current for most countries including Mainland
                              China (Current)

5th (Employment-creation):    Current for most countries, for Mainland China:
                              No quota (No quota)

5th (Targeted Employment      Current for most countries, for Mainland China:
     Areas):                  No quota (No quota)


Family-Based Preference Dates Are as Follows:

1st  (Unmarried children      Current for most countries including Mainland
      of U.S. citizens):      China (Current)

2A  (Exempt from per
     country limit):          Worldwide date: May 1, 1991 (April 15, 1991)

2A  (Subject to per
     country limit):          Worldwide date: May 1, 1991 (April 15, 1991)
    (2A: Spouses and children of permanent residents)

LB  (Spouses & children of    For most countries including Mainland
    legalized beneficiaries): China: May 1, 1991 (April 15, 1991)

2B  (Adult children of        For most countries including Mainland
     permanent residents):    China: October 22, 1989 (October 22, 1989)

3rd  (Married children        For most countries including Mainland
      of U.S. citizens):      China: September 1, 1991 (August 8, 1991)

4th  (Sisters and brothers    For most countries including Mainland
     of adult U.S. citizens): China: April 22, 1984 (March 22, 1984)

----------------------------------------------------------------------------

From lads-l@spike.rice.edu  Wed Oct 20 11:10:40 1993
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From: mri@spec.mda.uth.tmc.edu (Generic Account)
To: Multiple recipients of list <lads-l@spike.rice.edu>
Subject: Petition Drive
X-Listprocessor-Version: 6.0a -- ListProcessor by Anastasios Kotsikonas
X-Comment:  Late-Arrival-DependentS-List 
Status: RO

Hi There;

I have an idea, I hope it is a good idea:

Is there way we can sign a petition letter to IFCSS council    
that can make Mi Mi a council member like the petition drive
for Rose Perot? Well, if Mi Mi himself is not interested then
just forget my idea. Does IFCSS constitution allow petition?
I guess here in Houton if you can get 50,000(or some thing alike)
signatures, then you can be a city council member. For IFCSS
council member, 1000 signatures shoule be good enough.

Just my 2 cents.

MRI

From lads-l@spike.rice.edu  Wed Oct 20 11:24:37 1993
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Subject: passport extension
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>From:	IN%"taofang@uhunix.uhcc.hawaii.edu" 20-OCT-1993 00:16:37.59
To:	IN%"lads-l@spike.rice.edu"  "Multiple recipients of list"
CC:	
Subj:	Passport Externsion

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>From: Tao Fang <taofang@uhunix.uhcc.hawaii.edu>
Subject: Passport Externsion
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Dear Netter:

It is said that you should always keep your passport with valid date at least
6 months. Many of the CSPAers' passport will be 5 year old soon. If you know
the proceedure, phone #, to renew passport, could you post it on the net?

Does anyone knows the travel documents for those who get GC approved but have
not get the real card?


Thanks.
Fang


------------------------------------------------------------------------
  

I got my passport extened in June at NYC consulate. You don't need anything
just go there and hand in your passport and fee ($10). One week later you can
pick it up. That is noly true for private passport.

 Good luck.

ZHM

From lads-l@spike.rice.edu  Wed Oct 20 11:58:39 1993
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From: hua7291@med2s0.engr.ccny.cuny.edu (Mi Mi)
To: Multiple recipients of list <lads-l@spike.rice.edu>
Subject: passport extension
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X-Comment:  Late-Arrival-DependentS-List 
Status: RO


You may try to convert your public passport into private ones. For CSPAers,
it should be okay. Although Mi Mi has no experience in this, he knows quite
a few had done so.

For private passports, Mi Mi just extended it in last May in New York. $10 and
one week to pick it up. 

Even you can have a US passport later on, you still have to extend it from
time to time.

It is interesting that a netter suggests Mi Mi be a Council member. If you
guys want to launch a petition campaign to do that, I am sure there are more 
than enough votes out there to carry out a counter-campaign to against Mi Mi.

Mi Mi Sr. in NYC

From lads-l@spike.rice.edu  Wed Oct 20 12:21:06 1993
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From: zhu@spec.mda.uth.tmc.edu (Yunqiang Zhu)
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Subject: Re: Petition Drive
X-Listprocessor-Version: 6.0a -- ListProcessor by Anastasios Kotsikonas
X-Comment:  Late-Arrival-DependentS-List 
Status: RO

Hi;

I only heard of Petition Drive to support someone, never heard of
any petition drive to do otherwise. I guess most constitutions allow
petition to sign someone on, not sign someone off the ballot. Even
a lot of people hate Rose Perot, however, nobody tried to sign him
off. That may mean it is not allowed in Amerinan constitution.

I guess if IFCSS constitution does not have any rule about petition,
then it is not a completed one.

Y.Z.


From lads-l@spike.rice.edu  Wed Oct 20 12:56:48 1993
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Subject: Re: Petition Drive
X-Listprocessor-Version: 6.0a -- ListProcessor by Anastasios Kotsikonas
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Status: RO

> From lads-l@spike.rice.edu Wed Oct 20 12:09:27 1993
> Date: Wed, 20 Oct 93 11:10:39 CDT
> Reply-To: mri@spec.mda.uth.tmc.edu
> Originator: lads-l@spike.rice.edu
> Sender: lads-l@spike.rice.edu
> From: mri@spec.mda.uth.tmc.edu (Generic Account)
> To: Multiple recipients of list <lads-l@spike.rice.edu>
> Subject: Petition Drive
> X-Listprocessor-Version: 6.0a -- ListProcessor by Anastasios Kotsikonas
> X-Comment:  Late-Arrival-DependentS-List 
> Content-Length: 507
> 
> Hi There;
> 
> I have an idea, I hope it is a good idea:
> 
> Is there way we can sign a petition letter to IFCSS council    
> that can make Mi Mi a council member like the petition drive
> for Rose Perot? Well, if Mi Mi himself is not interested then
> just forget my idea. Does IFCSS constitution allow petition?
> I guess here in Houton if you can get 50,000(or some thing alike)
> signatures, then you can be a city council member. For IFCSS
> council member, 1000 signatures shoule be good enough.
> 
> Just my 2 cents.
> 
> MRI
> 
That's a good idea

From lads-l@spike.rice.edu  Wed Oct 20 14:01:47 1993
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From: hua7291@med2s0.engr.ccny.cuny.edu (Mi Mi)
To: Multiple recipients of list <lads-l@spike.rice.edu>
Subject: Petition Drive
X-Listprocessor-Version: 6.0a -- ListProcessor by Anastasios Kotsikonas
X-Comment:  Late-Arrival-DependentS-List 
Status: RO

   Date: Wed, 20 Oct 93 12:23:52 CDT
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   From: zhu@spec.mda.uth.tmc.edu (Yunqiang Zhu)
   X-Listprocessor-Version: 6.0a -- ListProcessor by Anastasios Kotsikonas
   X-Comment:  Late-Arrival-DependentS-List 

   Hi;

   I only heard of Petition Drive to support someone, never heard of
   any petition drive to do otherwise. I guess most constitutions allow
   petition to sign someone on, not sign someone off the ballot. Even
   a lot of people hate Rose Perot, however, nobody tried to sign him
   off. That may mean it is not allowed in Amerinan constitution.

   I guess if IFCSS constitution does not have any rule about petition,
   then it is not a completed one.

   Y.Z.


Yeah, there is: to impeach somebody. The former President Nixon was impeached
by the Congress, because the Water Gate Scandal. Hopefully, no one will try
to impeach Mi Mi as a Committee Member of Lads-Net! 

Mi Mi Sr.

From lads-l@spike.rice.edu  Wed Oct 20 14:06:56 1993
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Subject: Re: Petition Drive
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Good try. Please designate a LAD committe member to organise this matter
and collect signatures. So we can send out our signatures.

JSL

From lads-l@spike.rice.edu  Wed Oct 20 16:36:42 1993
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From: yue@mohlsun.physics.upenn.edu (NY.)
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Subject: Re
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Status: RO

   We should learn how to play by the rules, not at the wills.
   As I understand, the IFCSS council members are elected according
to the regions by the Constitution of IFCSS, never heard of anything
like a council member being elected from an interest group.
   Though I will be elated to see the Lads get PRs sooner, we have to act by
by the rules. 
   One of the big reasons why there are so many stupid fights among ourselves
is that we don't know we should play by the rules and we don't know what
the democracy is and often ignore the Constitution and rules and try to 
solve problems in our ways only!

From lads-l@spike.rice.edu  Wed Oct 20 17:26:22 1993
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Subject: random thoughts
X-Listprocessor-Version: 6.0a -- ListProcessor by Anastasios Kotsikonas
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Hi:
  I have seen several messages recently regarding the lads issues
ignored by the IFCSS, presumably due to the objections of LC committee
members.  We will agree with the argument that that attitude will hurt
LCs more than Lads as they will compete for visa numbers in the same
category in the near future.  We should also bear in mind that there is
no great incentive for the LC committee members in the IFCSS or the
general LCs to lobby for lads world-wide-quote affairs.  Most LCs are
busy studying and have not realized the reality of visa problems except
those who are looking for jobs.
  I also want to mention that several messages carry an anti-undocumented-
Chinese feeling because they will have more lads.  As IFCSS argued in one
message that if the US goverment wants to legelize the Chinese students, 
no one can stop the action; the same is true with the undocumented Chinese.
INS has sent the cable that an undocumented Chinese will be eligible for
CSPA benefit if he or she reenters with an inspection.  Many of Chinese
cannot accept the fact those less educated Chinese also has a chance to
immigrate into the great American society, because of their vanity.  This
is another example of "Wu Shi Bu Xiao Bai Bu".  CSPA principals are
classified as EB-3, not EB-1 or EB-2, because as a whole it is not
considered to extraordinary professionals or special skilled professionals.
Remember, we are just skilled workers.
  We with lads are neglected as our number is small.  I agree that we
should push the move to put MI MI in the IFCSS, but we should also support
the move that undocumented CSPA people to benefit from CSPA because:
This is humanitarian.  This will increase the number of lads.  This will
create a great incentive for LCs to lobby for lads.  This will not hurt
those LC who has the potential to be "extraordinary" and "special" to 
benefit from EB-1 and EB-2, a category I used to consider myself in.

From lads-l@spike.rice.edu  Wed Oct 20 17:45:26 1993
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From: mtang@civilgate.ce.uiuc.edu (Ming Tang)
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>
> From: yue@mohlsun.physics.upenn.edu (NY.)
> 
>    We should learn how to play by the rules, not at the wills.
>
>    As I understand, the IFCSS council members are elected according
> to the regions by the Constitution of IFCSS, never heard of anything
> like a council member being elected from an interest group.
>    Though I will be elated to see the Lads get PRs sooner, we have to act by
> by the rules. 
>

There should be some relationship between rules and wills. Wills are very 
important motivations for setting new rules or modifying/revising the existing
ones. The Constitution of IFCSS should have some "rules" to set new rules, 
otherwise, it won't work. I agree with only "We should learn how to play by
the rules."

>
>    One of the big reasons why there are so many stupid fights among ourselves
> is that we don't know we should play by the rules and we don't know what
> the democracy is and often ignore the Constitution and rules and try to 
> solve problems in our ways only!
>

The word 'democracy' is a highly abstract term. For individuals, it does not
make much sense to say they know or don't. Some wills from anyone may make a
perfectly democratic sense. Ignoring the Constitution and rules sometime is
not so 'stupid' since the rules are not set by GOD.

From lads-l@spike.rice.edu  Wed Oct 20 21:58:57 1993
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From: jhongshu@matt.ksu.ksu.edu (Junhong Shu)
To: Multiple recipients of list <lads-l@spike.rice.edu>
Subject: name-change
X-Listprocessor-Version: 6.0a -- ListProcessor by Anastasios Kotsikonas
X-Comment:  Late-Arrival-DependentS-List 
Status: RO

Hi, there:
since I already became a PR under CSPA and considering the chinese version
of my name inconvenient. What I supposed to do if I want to change it to
a more Americanized one. Answers or hints would be appreciated. 

From lads-l@spike.rice.edu  Wed Oct 20 22:13:35 1993
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From: jhongshu@matt.ksu.ksu.edu (Junhong Shu)
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Subject: name-change
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X-Comment:  Late-Arrival-DependentS-List 
Status: RO

hi, there :
since I already became a PR under CSPA and considering the chinese version
of my name inconvenient and want to change it to a more americanized one legally
what I supposed to do. Answers would be appreciated.

From lads-l@spike.rice.edu  Wed Oct 20 23:14:44 1993
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Status: RO


-------------------------------

	From: jhongshu@matt.ksu.ksu.edu (Junhong Shu)

   Hi, there:
   Since I already became a PR under CSPA and considering the chinese version
of my name inconvenient. What I supposed to do if I want to change it to
a more Americanized one. Answers or hints would be appreciated. 

--------------------------------

	During lunch time, I chatted with my American officemate about
official name change.  When getting married, most women have to go through
the process in America.  He said he also changed his name once.  He changed
his name from Alex to Alec.

	To complete the process, you will have to go to your local city/county
government offices.  You may also need an attorney.  It could cost more than
$500.  You will also have to report all the changes to social security administ-
ation, INS, and other related offices.  It is very complicated.  He even 
mentioned that once you change your name, if somebody gives a big piece of 
property to you in his will under your old name, you may have trouble getting
it.  Off course, this is not a problem for most of us.

	To simplfy the whole thing, he suggests you use an American name as
your middle name, such as:  K. "John" Wang.  Remember quote your middle name.
It means it is not your official name.  You just want people to call you "John."

	***** FOR YOUR INFORMATION ONLY *****             


JLi


From lads-l@spike.rice.edu  Thu Oct 21 08:22:21 1993
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Subject:      parents of PR
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Status: RO

Subject:  parents of PR in China

    This is reply to the question about "parents of PR". PR of US can not
apply immigration visas for their parents in China. But you can do that
after you get your citizenships.

    Good luck.

From lads-l@spike.rice.edu  Thu Oct 21 08:44:25 1993
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Hi There;

I have an idea, I hope it is a good idea:

Is there way we can sign a petition letter to IFCSS council    
that can make Mi Mi a council member like the petition drive
for Rose Perot? Well, if Mi Mi himself is not interested then
just forget my idea. Does IFCSS constitution allow petition?
I guess here in Houton if you can get 50,000(or some thing alike)
signatures, then you can be a city council member. For IFCSS
council member, 1000 signatures shoule be good enough.

Just my 2 cents.

MRI

Good idea! I CAN NOT AGREE MORE!!

CL


From lads-l@spike.rice.edu  Thu Oct 21 09:48:43 1993
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From: hua7291@med2s0.engr.ccny.cuny.edu (Mi Mi)
To: Multiple recipients of list <lads-l@spike.rice.edu>
Subject: Mi Mi Sr. & IFCSS Council
X-Listprocessor-Version: 6.0a -- ListProcessor by Anastasios Kotsikonas
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Thanks for so many netters' trust and move to put me into the Council!
I think the problem is realy the number of EC, and EC with lads. As a 
democratic organization, IFCSS is elected by IFCSS 5th Congress, and 
the delegates to the Congress were elected by regional schools. Well,
you may move me to IFCSS, but you can not change the fact that the majority
of CSS in schools are LC. If you move someone who is very infamous as 
an EC or lads activitist into IFCSS, then our dear LC counterpart will
move two or three lc activitists too, to counter-balance the infamous
Mi Mi all together! So it does not sound too good for me!

As for the discussion of rules vs. wills, Mi Mi believes the number one
and the only one characteristic of the democracy is to play by rules.
Of course wills determines rules, but there IS a rule which governs the
determination of rules by wills. That is the majority rule. Look at the
passage of CSPA. Bush wanted to block that, but he gave in because he
had to obey the majority rule. It is too tedious to discuss here, but
if I were the Chairman of the IFCSS Council, I would consider more of
the LC too. Besides, There are at least two EC in the HQ, President
and Vice President of the HQ are both EC. It is not an issue of EC vs. 
LC. It is an issue of emotional vs. rationale, which, is to preserve
the unity of the CSS community to achieve the maximum mutual benefits for
the WHOLE CSS. It is very sad that it had been considered as a EC vs. LC
war on the issue of CSPA and all its related issues. While LC and EC were
fighting on how to cut the pie, we lost the chance to get a bigger pie
for everybody. That is what realy happened several months ago. Now the LC
are still unaware the aftermath of that fight, and still do not want
to join our lads-net petition for world-quota issue. Otherwise, we can
easily collect 10,000 signatures!

What we committee members had achieved for this, is a much more 
friendlier lc-l now. You must remember the lc-l carried our petition
letter and signature address earlier September. I had relayed that 
newsrelease to you.

Good luck everybody, and thank you for all youu support. We now 
still have 1086 netters on this net. Thank you all!

Mi Mi Sr.





From lads-l@spike.rice.edu  Thu Oct 21 10:32:11 1993
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Subject: mini-survey result
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The number of valid response is 73. (among more than 100 responses, some do not
have any answers, some are for close-open issue survey.)

The first part is the overall result.  At the begining of each answer is
its percentage of the total valid responses except for questions 4 and 5 for which the numbers at the begining are the mean scores.

1) What is your status?

 3%        a) CSPA beneficiary without lad(s).
81%        b) CSPA beneficiary with lad(s).
 0%        c) CSPA DED lad.
12%        d) CSPA non-DED lad.
 0%        e) LC student.    
 4%        f) None of the above(explain:__________________)


2) What is your purpose to join lads-net?

42%        a) For information only.
56%        b) To do something which can make a difference
 1%        c) Just for monitoring lads-net activity.


3) What is the function of lads-net?

 1%      a) There is no need of lads-net at all.
12%      b) It should only be an information sharing service.
86%      c) It should make effort to push forward lad issues.


4) How do you rank lads-net's information? Please give scales 
   from 0 to 10, as 10 is the best.

 8       a) promptness: 
 7       b) accuracy:   
 8       c) fairness: 

  
5) How do you rank lads-net's another activities? Please give 
   scales from 0 to 10, as 10 is the best.

 6       a) work with LCnet.  
 7       b) work with IFCSS.  
 6       c) work with Dr. Zhao's NCCA.  
 5       d) work with U.S. government.   
 8       e) petition letter drive. 

   
6) Do you think DED problem should be solved?
 1%       a) No.
16%       b) Not concerned.
48%       c) Yes.       
10%       d) Yes, but it should be solved after most of CSPA principals
                has been approved.
25%       e) Yes, but undocumented DED should be excluded.


7) What do you think we should do next?

 7%        a) Nothing. No chance at all for us to achive our goal.
53%        b) push Dr. Zhao Haiqing to make effort.
19%        c) Focus on the petiton letter. Wait to see what happens.
21%        d) We should do more ourselves, i.e lobby.


8) If you think we should do more, you would contribute
23%        a) little manpower or donation.
52%        b) donation.
 8%        c) manpower
16%        d) manpower and donation.


Most of the netters still believe Dr.Zhao, Most of the netter will donate money
or contribute manpower or both.  Most of them think we should do something.
But many of them do not like undocumented DED.


PART II -- complex analysis:

Among those who believe lad net should make efforts to push forward lad issue (3c), only 52% want to push Dr. Zhao (7b).

The mean score of petition letter drive (5e) among those who believe lad net should make efforts to push forward lad issue(3c) is 8
 
Among those who do not like undecumented DED (6e), 40% want to work with LCnet.
.
.
.
netters please feel free to name.


Frank.

From lads-l@spike.rice.edu  Thu Oct 21 14:18:57 1993
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Message-Id: <9310211915.AA01534@matt.ksu.ksu.edu>
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Subject: follow-up
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thank you for the replies from some netters. suppose I go ahead with my name-
change at a appropriate authority, a follow-up question is what I supposed to
do with chinese authority, e.g. chinese consulate. we are still chinese citezensand we need to use our passport from time to time. again answers would be
highly appreciated.

From lads-l@spike.rice.edu  Thu Oct 21 15:01:39 1993
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From: hua7291@med2s0.engr.ccny.cuny.edu (Mi Mi)
To: Multiple recipients of list <lads-l@spike.rice.edu>
Subject: LADS
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/   Date:    Wed, 20 Oct 93 22:25 EDT
/   From: <YXL6@PSUVM.PSU.EDU>
/
/   Maybe Mi Mi should also work together with Haiqing, Zhao, President of
/   Council of Chinese Affairs.  Remember he has worked very hard to include
/   LADs in the initial legislation?  I guess he is still willing to help LADs.

Yes we do. We have a committee member working on this with Dr. Haiqing, Zhao.
We also have some inside stories regarding many facts which we do not want
to disclose. 

Do not expect some great savors to save us all. "Only you save yourself, then
God will save you."

Mi Mi Sr.

%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%   
% Mr. Mi Mi, Sr., Member of Lads-Net Committee                %
% Sign on/off at listserv@spike.rice.edu, with mailbody as:   %
%    sub lads-l Firstname Lastname, or signoff lads-l         %
% Post at lads@lucerne.rice.edu                               %
% Anonymous ftp at spike.rice.edu, in /lads/ subdirectory     %
% Sign our petition letter at lads-sig@spike.rice.edu.        %
%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%

From lads-l@spike.rice.edu  Thu Oct 21 16:38:53 1993
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Message-Id: <01H4DQA5AR2Q8WWD1A@MSUVX1.MEMST.EDU>
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Subject: on lad,Lc ,EB?
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Dear Mi Mi Sir:

After reading these e-mail talks regarding CSPA and Laders and Lcers,
I disappoint what Ifcss has done and appreciate What you have done for Ladnet.
I am a CSPA principal and got pr approved. Now I like to send small
donation to Ifcss (I did before), but What Ifcss has done on Lad issue
keeps me from sending out the check. The mainly upset to me is that 
the anti-CSPA (or anti-lad) atmosphere will destroy the Ifcss and LCer's
interest in furture. 

My wife is a lader and filed I-485 and got working permit. Of course
I hope she can get PR approved as soon as possible. But now what bother
me most is LCer issue. My sister is a LCer and she got a job.
Now she is going to apply PR through employment catogory. She has good chance 
for EB-3 and due to current situation she has no choice but EB-2.

>From my family experience ,what Ifcss has done recently really hurts the LCer 
interests, As Mi Mi has said they will pay the "tuition" from their own 
"pockets".

It seems to me that without IFcss any efforts on LAd and Lc isuues have their 
limitation, since Ifcss has already established the credit and reputation 
among the U.S goverment agencies. It is a tragedy for Chinese commuity if
they can not unite together.

Finally I like someone to have some comments on following questions.
(By the way I always find Mi Mi's opinions are convinced)
(1) what is possibility (10%) of that the INS will allow lads use other than 
   china quota in the final rule of CSPA?
     Does my sister have to chose EB-2 instead of EB-3?
 (2) Can lads in U.S ( who filed I-485)  pay in-state tuition for their
 study in a college?

Thank you for your reading!

Ru Ding
10/21/1993


From lads-l@spike.rice.edu  Thu Oct 21 16:43:30 1993
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Subject: EB-3 vs FB-2
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Hi, anyone has any idea that EB-3 or FB-2 will have a fast progress
for LADs?  Currently,  the priority date for FB-2 is about 2.5 years
and EB-3 is about 3 months.  But which queue will go fast?

If 10,000 visa numbers for Chinese each year, how many percent is for
FB and how many percent is for EB?

Any answer is highly appreciated!

ZY

From lads-l@spike.rice.edu  Thu Oct 21 16:49:54 1993
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From: hua7291@med2s0.engr.ccny.cuny.edu (Mi Mi)
To: Multiple recipients of list <lads-l@spike.rice.edu>
Subject: [Jie.Yang@IUS4.IUS.CS.CMU.EDU: Advanced Parole]
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Date: Thu, 21 Oct 1993 16:45-EDT
>From: Jie.Yang@IUS4.IUS.CS.CMU.EDU
To: hua7291@med2s0.engr.ccny.cuny.edu
Subject: Advanced Parole
In-Reply-To: hua7291's mail message of Thu, 21 Oct 93 15:03:37 CDT

Mi Mi Sr.,

As most of lads filed their applications, they think everything is OK.
However, there is a lot of potential problems. Here are two of them:

A friend of mine got his PR under CSPA and his lad wife filed application
in local INS. They are going to visit their parents in China at the end
of this year. The lad wife applied advanced parole from INS and she got
it yesterday. However, there is a block box with remarks on the advanced 
parole:

----------------------------------------------------------------------
Remarks:

This authorization will permit you to resume application for permanent 
resident upon returning the United States.

Per O.I. 212.5.(c)(5). humanitarian reasons

Warning: Pursuant to 8 CFR 245.3.(a)(2) if your application for adjust 
of status is denied, you will subject to exclusion proceedings under
Section 236 of the Immigration and Nationality Act.

----------------------------------------------------------------------

Based on the above remarks, there are two concerns:

1. It seems the application will be suspended before she come back to
   the US, i.e., before she returns the advanced parole to the INS.
2. There exists a risk she can't enter this country if her case is 
   denied during her absence.

What is your opinion? Thanks.
BTW, we have problem to post at  lads@lucerne.rice.edu.  we sent it
to the network this morning and it has appeared on the net so far.

-JY


Mi Mi Sr. has a copy of his Advanced Parole per EO12711. The remarks 
are different. But he think it is Okay. When you leave this country,
of course you run the risks of not being able to return. Your case is 
pending, not yet approved. If it is denied, how come INS should allow
you to return?

Do not worry. 

Mi Mi Sr.
%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%   
% Mr. Mi Mi, Sr., Member of Lads-Net Committee                %
% Sign on/off at listserv@spike.rice.edu, with mailbody as:   %
%    sub lads-l Firstname Lastname, or signoff lads-l         %
% Post at lads@lucerne.rice.edu                               %
% Anonymous ftp at spike.rice.edu, in /lads/ subdirectory     %
% Sign our petition letter at lads-sig@spike.rice.edu.        %
%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%

From lads-l@spike.rice.edu  Fri Oct 22 09:29:54 1993
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Date: Fri, 22 Oct 93 09:29:54 CDT
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From: jw@seas.smu.edu (Jianglin Wang)
To: Multiple recipients of list <lads-l@spike.rice.edu>
Subject: Advanced Parole
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Hi,

Can anybody tell the procedure for applying Advanced Parole for a Lad and 
it will take about how long to get it. My son has a interview appointment 
at local INS office in early November (he is a Lad), and we plane to visit
China in December, should we apply for Advanced Parole for him right now 
or wait until the interview? Any suggestions and comments are welcome.

Thanks in advance.

JW


From lads-l@spike.rice.edu  Fri Oct 22 10:01:44 1993
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Date: Fri, 22 Oct 93 10:01:43 CDT
Message-Id: <9310221458.AA08990@milo.math.scarolina.edu>
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From: chchen@milo.math.scarolina.edu (Changan Chen)
To: Multiple recipients of list <lads-l@spike.rice.edu>
Subject: 
X-Listprocessor-Version: 6.0a -- ListProcessor by Anastasios Kotsikonas
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Hi,

This is just for your information. I received a letter from Chicago INS
about my Lad PR application. Here is the contents:

Form I-181b(Rev. 3-1-83) N

			Cat:	E39
			File No.:	A72 *** ***
			Date:	Oct 18 1993


My name & address

	The processing of the application for adjustment of status to
	that of permanent resident filed by the above named individual
	has been completed. (A request has been forwarded for the allocation
	a visa number. Note the last sentence was scratched out)

				Sincerely yours,

				District Director


I wonder is there some knoledgible person has any ideal about:
(I hand in my application at Sep 17, and my priority date is 
 June 30, 1993)

A.  Why INS scratch out the last sentence?
B.  Does this letter mean that I need do nothing but just wait?
C.  How long is the reasonable waiting time? 1 years ? 6 years ?

Sincerely yours,
Changan Chen

From lads-l@spike.rice.edu  Fri Oct 22 10:39:49 1993
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Subject: The Date of PR
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Hi, does anybody know when is considered as the beginning which can be
counted as to the 5 years for the citizenship?  Say, the date of approved
in the blue I-767 form (i.e. 9/30/93) or the date the formal Green Card
is issued?  thank you for any answers.

--ZY

From lads-l@spike.rice.edu  Fri Oct 22 13:24:11 1993
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Message-Id: <9310221818.AA01791@spec.mda.uth.tmc.edu>
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From: zhu@spec.mda.uth.tmc.edu (Yunqiang Zhu)
To: Multiple recipients of list <lads-l@spike.rice.edu>
Subject: **Help**
X-Listprocessor-Version: 6.0a -- ListProcessor by Anastasios Kotsikonas
X-Comment:  Late-Arrival-DependentS-List 
Status: RO

Hi There;

Has any LAD who filed his/her I-485 received anything from INS in Houston?
If someone did, What did the letter say? did anyone get an interview?
Is it possible that a decision is made on an application before interview?

Thanks in advance

Y. Zhu

From lads-l@spike.rice.edu  Fri Oct 22 14:20:06 1993
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From: jun@geol.niu.edu (Jun Qi)
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Dear Netters:

I'm really sick to see those shitty mails posted on our LADNET. With all
those typos and terribly written sentences, some of the netters did not
show any respect to themselves and 1000 others. They are so selfish and
careless that they care for nothing but help from others. . .

I like LADNET because I think it is a great net and I met lots of good 
people here and gained lots of supports from those netters. Now we have
the freedom to post mails to the whole net and to reach all the people.
However, some netters seem to take granted for that and simply dump
whatever they scratched into the net without checking it a little bit.

I love our LADNET. I would not mind to see your laughter or cry and I am
willing to share your anger or happiness. But I would like to see more
responsibilities from all of us and a quality net.


From lads-l@spike.rice.edu  Fri Oct 22 14:48:01 1993
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> From lads-l@spike.rice.edu Fri Oct 22 14:17:31 1993
> Date: Fri, 22 Oct 93 14:20:06 CDT
> Reply-To: jun@geol.niu.edu
> Originator: lads-l@spike.rice.edu
> Sender: lads-l@spike.rice.edu
> From: jun@geol.niu.edu (Jun Qi)
> To: Multiple recipients of list <lads-l@spike.rice.edu>
> Subject: 
> X-Listprocessor-Version: 6.0a -- ListProcessor by Anastasios Kotsikonas
> X-Comment:  Late-Arrival-DependentS-List 
> Content-Length: 847
> 
> Dear Netters:
> 
> I'm really sick to see those shitty mails posted on our LADNET. With all
> those typos and terribly written sentences, some of the netters did not
> show any respect to themselves and 1000 others. They are so selfish and
> careless that they care for nothing but help from others. . .
> 
> I like LADNET because I think it is a great net and I met lots of good 
> people here and gained lots of supports from those netters. Now we have
> the freedom to post mails to the whole net and to reach all the people.
> However, some netters seem to take granted for that and simply dump
> whatever they scratched into the net without checking it a little bit.
> 
> I love our LADNET. I would not mind to see your laughter or cry and I am
> willing to share your anger or happiness. But I would like to see more
> responsibilities from all of us and a quality net.
> 
> 

I do not understand what are you referng to. LADNET is a place to share
info and ask questions. English is not our native language, it is understandable
that some of us may write broken English. If there are some shitty mails in the
LADNET, yours is really a typical one. From the wording in your E-mail, I do not
see any respect you showed to others.

Well, just a thought, no hard feelings.


Y. Zhu

From lads-l@spike.rice.edu  Fri Oct 22 15:01:33 1993
Received: from  (localhost.rice.edu) by spike.rice.edu (AA17886); Fri, 22 Oct 93 15:01:33 CDT
Date: Fri, 22 Oct 93 15:01:33 CDT
Message-Id: <9310221958.AA07742@bach.convex.com>
Errors-To: lads-request@spike.rice.edu
Reply-To: guo@bach.convex.com
Originator: lads-l@spike.rice.edu
Sender: lads-l@spike.rice.edu
Precedence: bulk
From: guo@bach.convex.com (Yi Guo)
To: Multiple recipients of list <lads-l@spike.rice.edu>
Subject: Flame Alert!
X-Listprocessor-Version: 6.0a -- ListProcessor by Anastasios Kotsikonas
X-Comment:  Late-Arrival-DependentS-List 
Status: RO

<<<<<<<<<< FLAME ALERT! FLAME ALERT! FLAME ALERT! >>>>>>>>>>

The net is a public place, so please supress feelings that is too subjective
and too flamable here.  Word choice, emotion control, ...

Starting a war on this topic is senseless if both parties think of the 
well-being of this net.

Please, control yourself.  There is always something reasonable in one 
posting.  Take in what you like, discard others, that's it!  You just cannot
persuade others on the net.  Let's keep it a place for info sharing only,
flames should be redirected to email exchanges.

> > I'm really sick to see those shitty mails posted on our LADNET. With all
> > those typos and terribly written sentences, some of the netters did not
> > show any respect to themselves and 1000 others. They are so selfish and
> > careless that they care for nothing but help from others. . .
> > 
> > I like LADNET because I think it is a great net and I met lots of good 
> > people here and gained lots of supports from those netters. Now we have
> > the freedom to post mails to the whole net and to reach all the people.
> > However, some netters seem to take granted for that and simply dump
> > whatever they scratched into the net without checking it a little bit.
> > 
> > I love our LADNET. I would not mind to see your laughter or cry and I am
> > willing to share your anger or happiness. But I would like to see more
> > responsibilities from all of us and a quality net.
> > 
> > 
> 
> I do not understand what are you referng to. LADNET is a place to share
> info and ask questions. English is not our native language, it is understandable
> that some of us may write broken English. If there are some shitty mails in the
> LADNET, yours is really a typical one. From the wording in your E-mail, I do not
> see any respect you showed to others.
> 
> Well, just a thought, no hard feelings.
> 
> 

From lads-l@spike.rice.edu  Fri Oct 22 22:52:48 1993
Received: from  (localhost.rice.edu) by spike.rice.edu (AA18904); Fri, 22 Oct 93 22:52:48 CDT
Date: Fri, 22 Oct 93 22:52:48 CDT
Message-Id: <9310230349.AA06409@med2s0.engr.ccny.cuny.edu>
Errors-To: lads-request@spike.rice.edu
Reply-To: hua7291@med2s0.engr.ccny.cuny.edu
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From: hua7291@med2s0.engr.ccny.cuny.edu (Mi Mi)
To: Multiple recipients of list <lads-l@spike.rice.edu>
Subject: todays lc-l newsrelease
X-Listprocessor-Version: 6.0a -- ListProcessor by Anastasios Kotsikonas
X-Comment:  Late-Arrival-DependentS-List 
Status: RO


Liu Chenyan and He Enhua:

Got your message.

Do not know how you will think, but if you guys are interested, why
do not you join our world-wide-quota campaign for lads. I am not begging 
you to do this, but it is a relief for the visa crisis. Besides, I do
not believe that CSPA is using EB-2. You guys can make any independent
confirm on this? It is a pure speculation.

To me it is quite possible that some have both CSPA and EB-2 options just
waited to see what was going to happen. When they see the visa type for
CSPA is different (EC6 instead of EB3), they just go ahead to file for
EB-2. Some of my friends are actually doing this. only 300 nationwide
applications can cause this kind of backlog, if everyone has a family of 
three! Some just see the policy is no good for lads as CSPA. 

Mi Mi
  

From lads-l@spike.rice.edu  Sun Oct 24 22:22:26 1993
Received: from  (localhost.rice.edu) by spike.rice.edu (AA23801); Sun, 24 Oct 93 22:22:26 CDT
Date: Sun, 24 Oct 93 22:22:26 CDT
Message-Id: <01H4IB0DSOOW9FTKCD@BINAH.CC.BRANDEIS.EDU>
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From: AN@binah.cc.brandeis.edu
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Subject: Boston Lad Work Permit
X-Listprocessor-Version: 6.0a -- ListProcessor by Anastasios Kotsikonas
X-Comment:  Late-Arrival-DependentS-List 
Status: RO

Hi! Has any one had any info about the Boston INS's processing of lad
work permit?  or PR application?  For many lads, it will soon be 90 days
after they filed both applications but at least my lad has not heard
anything yet. Thanks for your attention.           

From lads-l@spike.rice.edu  Mon Oct 25 09:31:30 1993
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From: Heshun Chen <hnchen@umaxc.weeg.uiowa.edu>
To: Multiple recipients of list <lads-l@spike.rice.edu>
Subject: lad in Omaha
X-Listprocessor-Version: 6.0a -- ListProcessor by Anastasios Kotsikonas
X-Comment:  Late-Arrival-DependentS-List 
Status: RO

Hi,
    Has any one had any info about Omaha INS's processing of lad's PR
application? 
    Thank you for your time.




From lads-l@spike.rice.edu  Mon Oct 25 10:51:35 1993
Received: from  (localhost.rice.edu) by spike.rice.edu (AA25336); Mon, 25 Oct 93 10:51:35 CDT
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From: hua7291@med2s0.engr.ccny.cuny.edu (Mi Mi)
To: Multiple recipients of list <lads-l@spike.rice.edu>
Subject: on lad,Lc ,EB?
X-Listprocessor-Version: 6.0a -- ListProcessor by Anastasios Kotsikonas
X-Comment:  Late-Arrival-DependentS-List 
Status: RO


Ru Ding wrote: 
(1) what is possibility (10%) of that the INS will allow lads use other than
    china quota in the final rule of CSPA?
    Does my sister have to chose EB-2 instead of EB-3?
(2) Can lads in U.S ( who filed I-485)  pay in-state tuition for their
    study in a college?

Mi Mi Sr. writes:
No one knows for sure the probability for (1). Now, especially after July 1,
and August 2, we lost two opportunities. We can petition, can argue, but
the authority does not think it is a real BIG problem, only you and me do.
Just remember that as Chinese in whole, we are minorities, not mention as
CSS' sub-minority as lads. To the Washington, we are only a handful of 
people. Besides, all the lads are covered by INA, it just takes sometime,
that is all. Nothing is urgent. For the authority, it takes time to react,
from bottom up. It gets handsful of other foreign problems, Somalia, for
example. So no quick response at all. As a splited CSS community, we lose
our edge under IFCSS. IFCSS is the only credited CSS organization in US for
the last several years, and has been a major player in the making of CSPA.
Now there are lads-net and lc-l, we have different voices, and different
interests. That is a huge setback of the ability of IFCSS to push anything
further effectively, besides any other problems IFCSS is facing now, 
financial problem, for example. Without a strong united IFCSS and CSS, 
anything will be difficult.

(2) varies from state to state. Mi Mi just got a letter from school asking
him to establish his residency in the New York State. A approval notice
is the crucial document. After the residency in the New York State has
been established then he can pay in-state-tuition. But some other states
does not require PR at all. Just ask your school authorities.

Mi Mi



%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%   
% Mr. Mi Mi, Sr., Member of Lads-Net Committee                %
% Sign on/off at listserv@spike.rice.edu, with mailbody as:   %
%    sub lads-l Firstname Lastname, or signoff lads-l         %
% Post at lads@lucerne.rice.edu                               %
% Anonymous ftp at spike.rice.edu, in /lads/ subdirectory     %
% Sign our petition letter at lads-sig@spike.rice.edu.        %
%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%

From lads-l@spike.rice.edu  Mon Oct 25 11:27:10 1993
Received: from  (localhost.rice.edu) by spike.rice.edu (AA25460); Mon, 25 Oct 93 11:27:10 CDT
Date: Mon, 25 Oct 93 11:27:10 CDT
Message-Id: <9310251626.AA25450@spike.rice.edu>
Errors-To: lads-request@spike.rice.edu
Reply-To: ZXY2@psuvm.psu.edu
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From: <ZXY2@psuvm.psu.edu>
To: Multiple recipients of list <lads-l@spike.rice.edu>
Subject: VISA to Hongkong
X-Listprocessor-Version: 6.0a -- ListProcessor by Anastasios Kotsikonas
X-Comment:  Late-Arrival-DependentS-List 

Hi, does anybody can confirm the information that chinese citizens do not
need to get a visa to visit Hongkong, if the person comes back from abroad?
So a valid Chinese passport is the only document that will be needed to
enter Hongkong?

Since my mother will go back China soon and will have a stop in Hongkong,
any information is really welcome.

Thanks!

From lads-l@spike.rice.edu  Mon Oct 25 13:54:37 1993
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Message-Id: <9310251851.AA16991@eng.auburn.edu>
Errors-To: lads-request@spike.rice.edu
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From: Chen Yige <yigeche@eng.auburn.edu>
To: Multiple recipients of list <lads-l@spike.rice.edu>
Subject: 
X-Listprocessor-Version: 6.0a -- ListProcessor by Anastasios Kotsikonas
X-Comment:  Late-Arrival-DependentS-List 


----- Begin Included Message -----

>From lads-l@spike.rice.edu Mon Oct 25 11:29:16 1993
Date: Mon, 25 Oct 93 11:29:04 CDT
Reply-To: ZXY2@psuvm.psu.edu
Originator: lads-l@spike.rice.edu
Sender: lads-l@spike.rice.edu
>From: <ZXY2@psuvm.psu.edu>
To: Multiple recipients of list <lads-l@spike.rice.edu>
Subject: VISA to Hongkong
X-Listprocessor-Version: 6.0a -- ListProcessor by Anastasios Kotsikonas
X-Comment:  Late-Arrival-DependentS-List 
Content-Length: 357

Hi, does anybody can confirm the information that chinese citizens do not
need to get a visa to visit Hongkong, if the person comes back from abroad?
So a valid Chinese passport is the only document that will be needed to
enter Hongkong?

Since my mother will go back China soon and will have a stop in Hongkong,
any information is really welcome.

Thanks!


----- End Included Message -----

Right, Chine passport only.  BUT at most 7 days and with effective leaving air  or train ticket.  See "People Daily"

From lads-l@spike.rice.edu  Mon Oct 25 23:13:21 1993
Received: from  (localhost.rice.edu) by spike.rice.edu (AA27771); Mon, 25 Oct 93 23:13:21 CDT
Date: Mon, 25 Oct 93 23:13:21 CDT
Message-Id: <9310260419.AA10580@biomech.mech.utah.edu>
Errors-To: lads-request@spike.rice.edu
Reply-To: cheng@biomech.mech.utah.edu
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From: cheng@biomech.mech.utah.edu (Geping Cheng)
To: Multiple recipients of list <lads-l@spike.rice.edu>
Subject: Salt Lake City LADS
X-Listprocessor-Version: 6.0a -- ListProcessor by Anastasios Kotsikonas
X-Comment:  Late-Arrival-DependentS-List 

Hi, Does anybody know any LADs in Salt Lake City has got PR approved or
a future interview?  Thanks for your attention.

G. Cheng

From lads-l@spike.rice.edu  Tue Oct 26 00:03:14 1993
Received: from  (localhost.rice.edu) by spike.rice.edu (AA27924); Tue, 26 Oct 93 00:03:14 CDT
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Reply-To: juyu@mtu.edu
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From: juyu@mtu.edu (juyun)
To: Multiple recipients of list <lads-l@spike.rice.edu>
Subject: 
X-Listprocessor-Version: 6.0a -- ListProcessor by Anastasios Kotsikonas
X-Comment:  Late-Arrival-DependentS-List 

Recently, I got a letter from Northern INS center, dated at Oct. 18. I was
asked to go to local INS office for final procession. The content of this
letter is exactly same as the letter which I received a month ago, except
for the different date. Because I already went to local INS for making
finger printing and I received a letter from the Nothern center which told
me I do not need to go local INS if I already have done my finger printing.
As I know now, there are some other CSPA principals in MTU received same
letters recently. I wonder if INS Northern center made a mistake again?
Do I should go to local INS office? Are there any more people have same
problems? Could Mi Mi give us any information about this situation?
Thank you very much for any response.
  


From lads-l@spike.rice.edu  Tue Oct 26 01:40:03 1993
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Date: Tue, 26 Oct 93 01:40:03 CDT
Message-Id: <01H4JU0E3KZC9224FS@Jetson.UH.EDU>
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Reply-To: OPTO2E@jetson.uh.edu
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From: OPTO2E@jetson.uh.edu
To: Multiple recipients of list <lads-l@spike.rice.edu>
Subject: Lads at Houston don't have clear final says yet...
X-Listprocessor-Version: 6.0a -- ListProcessor by Anastasios Kotsikonas
X-Comment:  Late-Arrival-DependentS-List 

My friend's wife just finished her interview at Houston INS. No question was
even asked. The whole process included only taking back the medical exam
form which was not handed in while petition submitted and check the passport.,
No final say of Approved or Disapproved was given. In stead, it was told to 
wait at least five month to get the PR.
Stay tuned, I will go to INS on Nov. 3, 93 with my wife for her interview.

From lads-l@spike.rice.edu  Tue Oct 26 09:19:43 1993
Received: from  (localhost.rice.edu) by spike.rice.edu (AA29590); Tue, 26 Oct 93 09:19:43 CDT
Date: Tue, 26 Oct 93 09:19:43 CDT
Message-Id: <9310261416.AA18597@med2s0.engr.ccny.cuny.edu>
Errors-To: lads-request@spike.rice.edu
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From: hua7291@med2s0.engr.ccny.cuny.edu (Mi Mi)
To: Multiple recipients of list <lads-l@spike.rice.edu>
Subject: [lads-l@spike.rice.edu: Error Condition Re: Lads at Houston don't have clear final says yet...]
X-Listprocessor-Version: 6.0a -- ListProcessor by Anastasios Kotsikonas
X-Comment:  Late-Arrival-DependentS-List 

   From: OPTO2E@jetson.uh.edu
   X-Listprocessor-Version: 6.0a -- ListProcessor by Anastasios Kotsikonas
   X-Comment:  Late-Arrival-DependentS-List 

   My friend's wife just finished her interview at Houston INS. No question was
   even asked. The whole process included only taking back the medical exam
   form which was not handed in while petition submitted and check the passport.,
   No final say of Approved or Disapproved was given. In stead, it was told
                                                                ^^^^^^^^^^^
   wait at least five month to get the PR.
   ^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^
   Stay tuned, I will go to INS on Nov. 3, 93 with my wife for her interview.



Mi Mi's opinoin:

The underlined words means "Approved". What does it mean the otherwise?
DO not worry, folks, everyone has a share of the pie! It was realy 
disappoint to know the event went so simple and boring! It should sound
great and interesting!

We need some more posts for interesting interviews! 

I do think the world-quota is more lc than lads. Lads are getting the pie,
but where does it come from? I wish it does not neccessary to hurt lc's
bowls! If the proposed 3-year-limitation on H1b visa type becomes true,
it will be realy tough for the lc to get a share of PR! 

Good luck folks, wish all of you get your lads's PR quickly and smoothly!

Mi Mi Sr.

P.S. Mi Mi Sr.'s contact with INS was nothing interesting too! The officer
just called my name, showed me the spelling of my name, and handed me my 
passport and approval notice, without ANY COMMENT AT ALL! It was damn simple.

%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%   
% Mr. Mi Mi, Sr., Member of Lads-Net Committee                %
% Sign on/off at listserv@spike.rice.edu, with mailbody as:   %
%    sub lads-l Firstname Lastname, or signoff lads-l         %
% Post at lads@lucerne.rice.edu                               %
% Anonymous ftp at spike.rice.edu, in /lads/ subdirectory     %
% Sign our petition letter at lads-sig@spike.rice.edu.        %
%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%


From lads-l@spike.rice.edu  Tue Oct 26 10:27:19 1993
Received: from  (localhost.rice.edu) by spike.rice.edu (AA29701); Tue, 26 Oct 93 10:27:19 CDT
Date: Tue, 26 Oct 93 10:27:19 CDT
Message-Id: <9310261521.AA00611@spec.mda.uth.tmc.edu>
Errors-To: lads-request@spike.rice.edu
Reply-To: zhu@spec.mda.uth.tmc.edu
Originator: lads-l@spike.rice.edu
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From: zhu@spec.mda.uth.tmc.edu (Yunqiang Zhu)
To: Multiple recipients of list <lads-l@spike.rice.edu>
Subject: **Queston**
X-Listprocessor-Version: 6.0a -- ListProcessor by Anastasios Kotsikonas
X-Comment:  Late-Arrival-DependentS-List 

Hi there;

My friend is a out of status LAD and his PR application was accepted
by INS. He applied Advance Parole and now he is visiting China. His
concern is that is it possible that his application may be denied
before his return from China. If this happens, then he may not be allowed
to enter US. My question is that; is it possible at all? Any helpful
information will be fully appreciated.

P.S. He filed his application in late Sept. He has not got interview notice
yet. Is it possible that INS will review his file before interview? Or
INS only review it during interview? 

Thanks


Yunqiang

From lads-l@spike.rice.edu  Tue Oct 26 10:48:41 1993
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Date: Tue, 26 Oct 93 10:48:40 CDT
Message-Id: <9310261545.AA05531@bach.convex.com>
Errors-To: lads-request@spike.rice.edu
Reply-To: guo@bach.convex.com
Originator: lads-l@spike.rice.edu
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From: guo@bach.convex.com (Yi Guo)
To: Multiple recipients of list <lads-l@spike.rice.edu>
Subject: Forms and Procedures for Out of Status LADs (question)
X-Listprocessor-Version: 6.0a -- ListProcessor by Anastasios Kotsikonas
X-Comment:  Late-Arrival-DependentS-List 

Hi, there,
    I am puzzled by the LADs application for out of status lads.  Although
my wife's out of status issue is still under dispute and consideration with
the Dallas INS examiner, I would like to get some idea on the out of status
situation and voluntary departure program.
    From INS cable #4, it only addressed the issue of in status lads' 
adjustment of status (I-485).  What is the situation facing out of status
lads?  I have consulted a lawyer on this one, and he said we should file
a I-824 if my wife is out of status, and by entering voluntary departure
she can still use my priority date as hers.  
    What then is the complete procedure for an out of status lad to get 
PR?  Filing I-485, I-824 and wait for notice from a consulate abroad, and
get the immigrant visa from there?  And how long compared with in status
lads would she wait (i.e. is my priority date valid for her visa number
assignment?)
    Any opinion, experience is appreciated.  Thanks!

From lads-l@spike.rice.edu  Tue Oct 26 16:19:44 1993
Received: from  (localhost.rice.edu) by spike.rice.edu (AA00510); Tue, 26 Oct 93 16:19:44 CDT
Date: Tue, 26 Oct 93 16:19:44 CDT
Message-Id: <199310262055.AA33089@ns2.CC.Lehigh.EDU>
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From: xl01@lehigh.edu (Xiangdong Lu)
To: Multiple recipients of list <lads-l@spike.rice.edu>
Subject: Need your help
X-Listprocessor-Version: 6.0a -- ListProcessor by Anastasios Kotsikonas
X-Comment:  Late-Arrival-DependentS-List 


Dear Chinese fellows:
I am a f-1 student from China and I came to the U.S. in 1989. I went back to
China in 1991 for 92 days. The reason that kept me staying in China longer
than 90 days was a sickness. Because I was so close to the 90 day restriction I
filed an application for permanent residence under the CSPA. Unfortunately, my
application was denied and the immigration officer even didn't give me a chance
to appeal the case. That means that I will lose my legel status after Jan. 1,
1994. I need your help. Please let me know if you have any suggestions for my
next step: Should I reopen the case? or file another application for getting
myself back to f-1 after Jan. 1, 1994, if possible, or..... If you know any one
whose similar case was approved or denied please contact me. Thanks.


From lads-l@spike.rice.edu  Tue Oct 26 16:40:18 1993
Received: from  (localhost.rice.edu) by spike.rice.edu (AA00584); Tue, 26 Oct 93 16:40:18 CDT
Date: Tue, 26 Oct 93 16:40:18 CDT
Message-Id: <9310262137.AA14774@eng.auburn.edu>
Errors-To: lads-request@spike.rice.edu
Reply-To: yigeche@eng.auburn.edu
Originator: lads-l@spike.rice.edu
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Precedence: bulk
From: Chen Yige <yigeche@eng.auburn.edu>
To: Multiple recipients of list <lads-l@spike.rice.edu>
Subject: 
X-Listprocessor-Version: 6.0a -- ListProcessor by Anastasios Kotsikonas
X-Comment:  Late-Arrival-DependentS-List 

> From lads-l@spike.rice.edu Tue Oct 26 16:24:18 1993
> Date: Tue, 26 Oct 93 16:24:19 CDT
> Reply-To: xl01@lehigh.edu
> Originator: lads-l@spike.rice.edu
> Sender: lads-l@spike.rice.edu
> From: xl01@lehigh.edu (Xiangdong Lu)
> To: Multiple recipients of list <lads-l@spike.rice.edu>
> Subject: Need your help
> X-Listprocessor-Version: 6.0a -- ListProcessor by Anastasios Kotsikonas
> X-Comment:  Late-Arrival-DependentS-List 
> Content-Length: 797
> 
> 
> Dear Chinese fellows:
> I am a f-1 student from China and I came to the U.S. in 1989. I went back to
> China in 1991 for 92 days. The reason that kept me staying in China longer
> than 90 days was a sickness. Because I was so close to the 90 day restriction I
> filed an application for permanent residence under the CSPA. Unfortunately, my
> application was denied and the immigration officer even didn't give me a chance
> to appeal the case. That means that I will lose my legel status after Jan. 1,
> 1994. I need your help. Please let me know if you have any suggestions for my
> next step: Should I reopen the case? or file another application for getting
> myself back to f-1 after Jan. 1, 1994, if possible, or..... If you know any one
> whose similar case was approved or denied please contact me. Thanks.
> 
> 

Not only you was denied by 90 days restriction.  We think the best way should be
a lawer hired.  Spending money can save you.  The lawer can do anything that youthink impossible.  Try.  God bless you.

netter

From lads-l@spike.rice.edu  Tue Oct 26 16:52:08 1993
Received: from  (localhost.rice.edu) by spike.rice.edu (AA00650); Tue, 26 Oct 93 16:52:08 CDT
Date: Tue, 26 Oct 93 16:52:08 CDT
Message-Id: <9310262148.AA24876@bach.convex.com>
Errors-To: lads-request@spike.rice.edu
Reply-To: guo@bach.convex.com
Originator: lads-l@spike.rice.edu
Sender: lads-l@spike.rice.edu
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From: guo@bach.convex.com (Yi Guo)
To: Multiple recipients of list <lads-l@spike.rice.edu>
Subject: Re: Need your help
X-Listprocessor-Version: 6.0a -- ListProcessor by Anastasios Kotsikonas
X-Comment:  Late-Arrival-DependentS-List 

--> Dear Chinese fellows:
--> I am a f-1 student from China and I came to the U.S. in 1989. I went back to
--> China in 1991 for 92 days. The reason that kept me staying in China longer
--> than 90 days was a sickness. Because I was so close to the 90 day restriction I
--> filed an application for permanent residence under the CSPA. Unfortunately, my
--> application was denied and the immigration officer even didn't give me a chance
--> to appeal the case. That means that I will lose my legel status after Jan. 1,
--> 1994. I need your help. Please let me know if you have any suggestions for my
--> next step: Should I reopen the case? or file another application for getting
--> myself back to f-1 after Jan. 1, 1994, if possible, or..... If you know any one
--> whose similar case was approved or denied please contact me. Thanks.
--> 
--> 

   Like the other netter has suggested, use a lawyer definitely helps to 
clarify some facts.  But, I hope you would also take your time to find a
good lawyer, asking recommendations from people in your area who is the
reputable lawyer.

   The reason to say so is that I have encountered some initial appointments
with some lawyers in Dallas area, and I found some are just "filing clerk"
that know less than I am on some immigration points, needless to say to 
argue for your case.  All they do is to take cases which are pretty routine
and make big money on it.  However, I do know a pretty competent one from
recommendations of my collegues here.  Don't waste money on those money
sucker who in the end do nothing constructive for you.

-- 
        Jimmy Guo                |   CONVEX Computer Corporation
        E-mail: guo@convex.com   |   3000 Waterview Parkway
        Phone : (214) 497-3120   |   P.O. Box 833851
        Fax   : (214) 497-4245   |   Richardson, TX 75083-3851, U.S.A.

From lads-l@spike.rice.edu  Tue Oct 26 17:18:20 1993
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Message-Id: <9310262215.AA27372@uhep2.phy.syr.edu>
Errors-To: lads-request@spike.rice.edu
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Subject: Re: Need your help 
X-Listprocessor-Version: 6.0a -- ListProcessor by Anastasios Kotsikonas
X-Comment:  Late-Arrival-DependentS-List 


hi there,

someone told me that CSPAers wont lose their status if you are denied, he also
said that this is written in the regulation, you may check the regulation.
sorry I didnt check it.

I havent heard anyone with the 90 day problem gets the approved. it is
frustrating that this fact is contradicting to what we were told by the
IFCSS, which said 90-day will be reviewed case by case. IFCSS has
been taken credit for it has done this or that, but I havent heard one
(90-day) case being approved since IFCSS has said so. I dont mean IFCSS 
is responsible for anything, but it can certainly help, for example,
could it get a confirmation from INS that nobody stayed in china for 
90 days gets approved? or how many get approved? 

if no 90-day case has ever been approved, I dont think a lawyer can help, 
because the INS can always say:
"Since this restriction is statutorily imposed, the Service has no
discretionary authority to waive compliance with the 90-day aggregate on
physical presence in the PRC, regardless of the reasons you may have been
forced to remain there."
as it said to me.

good luck everybody!

another 92-dayer


From lads-l@spike.rice.edu  Tue Oct 26 17:36:59 1993
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From: hua7291@med2c1.engr.ccny.cuny.edu (Mi Mi)
To: Multiple recipients of list <lads-l@spike.rice.edu>
Subject: [lads-l@spike.rice.edu: Error Condition Re: Need your help]
X-Listprocessor-Version: 6.0a -- ListProcessor by Anastasios Kotsikonas
X-Comment:  Late-Arrival-DependentS-List 

xl01@lehigh.edu (Xiangdong Lu) wrote:
   Dear Chinese fellows:
   I am a f-1 student from China and I came to the U.S. in 1989. I went back to
   China in 1991 for 92 days. The reason that kept me staying in China longer
   than 90 days was a sickness. Because I was so close to the 90 day restriction I
   filed an application for permanent residence under the CSPA. Unfortunately, my
   application was denied and the immigration officer even didn't give me a chance
   to appeal the case. That means that I will lose my legel status after Jan. 1,
   1994. I need your help. Please let me know if you have any suggestions for my
   next step: Should I reopen the case? or file another application for getting
   myself back to f-1 after Jan. 1, 1994, if possible, or..... If you know any one
   whose similar case was approved or denied please contact me. Thanks.




Mi Mi Sr.'s response:

As per CSPA, any case which has been denied has no chance to appeal. The 
only thing you can do is when you are deported, the INS officer can review
your case. 

My suggestion is why not try Dr. Zhao Haiqing's NCCA, or, even better, try
Arent & Fox who drafted the CSPA itself. You certainly need an informative
attorney to represent you. It will cause you big money, but you have to try.
Do not find those cheap forms-filling vendors who has no more knowledge than
you and I do. It your case is killed twice, than you realy have no chance.
During the mean time, try to get back to F-1 status as soon as possible. 
It will save you somewhat if you fell again.

You got a very tough job to do. Good luck!

Mi Mi Sr.

 %%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%   
% Mr. Mi Mi, Sr., Member of Lads-Net Committee                %
% Sign on/off at listserv@spike.rice.edu, with mailbody as:   %
%    sub lads-l Firstname Lastname, or signoff lads-l         %
% Post at lads@lucerne.rice.edu                               %
% Anonymous ftp at spike.rice.edu, in /lads/ subdirectory     %
% Sign our petition letter at lads-sig@spike.rice.edu.        %
%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%


From lads-l@spike.rice.edu  Tue Oct 26 19:56:02 1993
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Date: Tue, 26 Oct 93 19:56:02 CDT
Message-Id: <9310270055.AA01143@spike.rice.edu>
Errors-To: lads-request@spike.rice.edu
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From: "b" <C492347@mizzou1.missouri.edu>
To: Multiple recipients of list <lads-l@spike.rice.edu>
Subject: ask for help
X-Listprocessor-Version: 6.0a -- ListProcessor by Anastasios Kotsikonas
X-Comment:  Late-Arrival-DependentS-List 

Dear fellows:
    I am a CSPA. I have a J-1 LAD who has not got the 2-year waiver. That
because we have no way to get a "no-objection" letter from our working unit
in China. Anybody knows what we should do next step? Is there any local INS
accept the J-1 LAD's PR application? Please let me know if you have any
suggestions or you know anyone whose similar situation was accepted or rejected
. Thanks for your help.

From lads-l@spike.rice.edu  Wed Oct 27 08:39:02 1993
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Message-Id: <9310271335.AA04377@lamont.ldgo.columbia.edu>
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From: cheng@lamont.ldgo.columbia.edu
To: Multiple recipients of list <lads-l@spike.rice.edu>
Subject: Re: [lads-l@spike.rice.edu: Error Condition Re: Need your help]
X-Listprocessor-Version: 6.0a -- ListProcessor by Anastasios Kotsikonas
X-Comment:  Late-Arrival-DependentS-List 

> From lads-l@spike.rice.edu Tue Oct 26 18:36:21 1993
> Date: Tue, 26 Oct 93 17:36:59 CDT
> Reply-To: hua7291@med2c1.engr.ccny.cuny.edu
> Originator: lads-l@spike.rice.edu
> Sender: lads-l@spike.rice.edu
> From: hua7291@med2c1.engr.ccny.cuny.edu (Mi Mi)
> To: Multiple recipients of list <lads-l@spike.rice.edu>
> Subject: [lads-l@spike.rice.edu: Error Condition Re: Need your help]
> X-Listprocessor-Version: 6.0a -- ListProcessor by Anastasios Kotsikonas
> X-Comment:  Late-Arrival-DependentS-List 
> Content-Length: 2126
> 
> xl01@lehigh.edu (Xiangdong Lu) wrote:
>    Dear Chinese fellows:
>    I am a f-1 student from China and I came to the U.S. in 1989. I went back to
>    China in 1991 for 92 days. The reason that kept me staying in China longer
>    than 90 days was a sickness. Because I was so close to the 90 day restriction I
>    filed an application for permanent residence under the CSPA. Unfortunately, my
>    application was denied and the immigration officer even didn't give me a chance
>    to appeal the case. That means that I will lose my legel status after Jan. 1,
>    1994. I need your help. Please let me know if you have any suggestions for my
>    next step: Should I reopen the case? or file another application for getting
>    myself back to f-1 after Jan. 1, 1994, if possible, or..... If you know any one
>    whose similar case was approved or denied please contact me. Thanks.
> 

One of things you can do yourself is to get back to F-1 status before Jan.1, 1994. If you fall out
out status, you will have no chance to change to any legal status in the U.S.A. 

From lads-l@spike.rice.edu  Wed Oct 27 09:26:27 1993
Received: from  (localhost.rice.edu) by spike.rice.edu (AA03317); Wed, 27 Oct 93 09:26:27 CDT
Date: Wed, 27 Oct 93 09:26:27 CDT
Message-Id: <9310271422.AA22203@med2s0.engr.ccny.cuny.edu>
Errors-To: lads-request@spike.rice.edu
Reply-To: hua7291@med2s0.engr.ccny.cuny.edu
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From: hua7291@med2s0.engr.ccny.cuny.edu (Mi Mi)
To: Multiple recipients of list <lads-l@spike.rice.edu>
Subject: [lads-l@spike.rice.edu: Error Condition Re: Need your help]
X-Listprocessor-Version: 6.0a -- ListProcessor by Anastasios Kotsikonas
X-Comment:  Late-Arrival-DependentS-List 

In the case of recent postings from a 92-dayer's, the problem is realy that
if he IS covered under EO 12711. Even if he is covered by EO12711, then does
INA forgive his out-of-status after his return here? If both EO12711 and CSPA 
say no, then he is no more than an illegal immigrant under the eye of INA.
The only choice for him, is to fight a real battle against that decision.
Maybe Arent & Fox is the best and most expensive way of doing this, but if
Arent & Fox fails, he will never regret he hired a wrong one. 

Mi Mi Sr.

P.S.One suggestion: Why not try to unite a group of over-90-day people to hire
Arent & Fox? It might be cheapper. How about calling IFCSS HQ and find out?
You guys are losing time, and as the battle you are fighting is not a easy
one, there is no way you can win by your own. Try to fight collectively is
better than individually. 

%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%   
% Mr. Mi Mi, Sr., Member of Lads-Net Committee                %
% Sign on/off at listserv@spike.rice.edu, with mailbody as:   %
%    sub lads-l Firstname Lastname, or signoff lads-l         %
% Post at lads@lucerne.rice.edu                               %
% Anonymous ftp at spike.rice.edu, in /lads/ subdirectory     %
% Sign our petition letter at lads-sig@spike.rice.edu.        %
%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%

From lads-l@spike.rice.edu  Wed Oct 27 11:15:25 1993
Received: from  (localhost.rice.edu) by spike.rice.edu (AA03487); Wed, 27 Oct 93 11:15:25 CDT
Date: Wed, 27 Oct 93 11:15:25 CDT
Message-Id: <199310271544.AA19214@ns2.CC.Lehigh.EDU>
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From: xl01@lehigh.edu (Xiangdong Lu)
To: Multiple recipients of list <lads-l@spike.rice.edu>
Subject: Need your help again
X-Listprocessor-Version: 6.0a -- ListProcessor by Anastasios Kotsikonas
X-Comment:  Late-Arrival-DependentS-List 

Hi, Friends:

Thank you all very much for your kindly help. As you have suggested I am going
to contact Mr. Zhao Haiqing's NCCA, Arent & Fox and IFCSS headquarters. I
wonder if someone can offer me their phone # or fax #.
I talked to the director of the international student office at my school. She
said, as she understood, I would be able to keep my lawful f-1 status since I
am still under the protection of president's order. But She also said that she
was not 100% sure and she would clear it out for me in a few days. I will keep
you all informed if I have any progress. Thanks again.

Xiangdong

From lads-l@spike.rice.edu  Wed Oct 27 11:24:05 1993
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Date: Wed, 27 Oct 93 11:24:05 CDT
Message-Id: <9310271618.AA02953@ozone.ps.uci.edu>
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Subject: Re: Need your help
X-Listprocessor-Version: 6.0a -- ListProcessor by Anastasios Kotsikonas
X-Comment:  Late-Arrival-DependentS-List 


Did you use the advance parole for your trip to China?  My understanding on
some following rules of CSPA is that once an used to be illegal immigrants
managed to re-enter this country by advanced parole he is eligible for CSPA.
Why not those in status but just passed 90 magic days?  How about get an
advance parole and cross the country line back and forth now and therefore
become qualified for CSPA?  Any comments?

From lads-l@spike.rice.edu  Wed Oct 27 11:49:55 1993
Received: from  (localhost.rice.edu) by spike.rice.edu (AA03642); Wed, 27 Oct 93 11:49:55 CDT
Date: Wed, 27 Oct 93 11:49:55 CDT
Message-Id: <9310271646.AA03667@med2c1.engr.ccny.cuny.edu>
Errors-To: lads-request@spike.rice.edu
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From: hua7291@med2c1.engr.ccny.cuny.edu (Mi Mi)
To: Multiple recipients of list <lads-l@spike.rice.edu>
Subject: Re:  Need your help again
X-Listprocessor-Version: 6.0a -- ListProcessor by Anastasios Kotsikonas
X-Comment:  Late-Arrival-DependentS-List 

As you requested, I am forwarding the phone numbers to you. Good luck!

Mi Mi Sr.

NCCA	SONG@MATH.CORNELL.EDU   
	FAX it to:  (202) 835-1883
	You can also send your letter to:
	National Council on Chinese Affairs
	P.O. Box 77418
	Washington, D.C. 20013-7418

IFCSS   733 15th Street, N.W., Suite 440, Washington, D.C.20005
	Tel. (202)347-0017  Fax:   (202)347-0018
	Email: ifcss@wam.umd.edu

From lads-l@spike.rice.edu  Wed Oct 27 12:02:52 1993
Received: from  (localhost.rice.edu) by spike.rice.edu (AA03735); Wed, 27 Oct 93 12:02:52 CDT
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From: hua7291@med2c1.engr.ccny.cuny.edu (Mi Mi)
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Subject: Need your help
X-Listprocessor-Version: 6.0a -- ListProcessor by Anastasios Kotsikonas
X-Comment:  Late-Arrival-DependentS-List 


stacy@ozone.ps.uci.edu wrote:

   Did you use the advance parole for your trip to China?  My understanding on
   some following rules of CSPA is that once an used to be illegal immigrants
   managed to re-enter this country by advanced parole he is eligible for CSPA.
   Why not those in status but just passed 90 magic days?  How about get an
   advance parole and cross the country line back and forth now and therefore
   become qualified for CSPA?  Any comments?

Those illegal immigrants are eligible ONLY when they have met all the 
requirements under CSPA, PLUS have obtained an advance parole to re-enter 
this country. Illegal immigrants are NOT exempted from the 90-day-rule. 
However, since all illegally entered immigrants have no prior entry records
in INS, they can probably forge some fake documents to persuade INS that they
are covered under CSPA. As the 92-day netter's case, there is no way he can
change that record. The only way for him is to fight all the way through 
himself.

Mi Mi Sr.


 
%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%   
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From lads-l@spike.rice.edu  Wed Oct 27 12:35:35 1993
Received: from  (localhost.rice.edu) by spike.rice.edu (AA03854); Wed, 27 Oct 93 12:35:35 CDT
Date: Wed, 27 Oct 93 12:35:35 CDT
Message-Id: <01H4LVEOQ2SWADF87Y@WSUHUB.UC.TWSU.EDU>
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Subject: 
X-Listprocessor-Version: 6.0a -- ListProcessor by Anastasios Kotsikonas
X-Comment:  Late-Arrival-DependentS-List 



Hi! Dear Over-90-Dayers:

The following untailored IFCSS HQ's News Release is just FYI.  In this
news release you could find the phone/fax #s of:

*	IFCSS HQ
*	A agent in Arent/Fox (I do not know if she is still working on
	the 90-day issue or not).

*	The Haiqing's NCCA phone # is: (202) 835-1880

I agree Mi Mi Sr.'s opinion, DO NOT WAST TIME.

Good luck!

LX

------------------------------------------------------------------

**************************************************************
IFCSS Headquarters News Release No.5026        July 22, 1993

**************************************************************
Independent Federation of Chinese Students and Scholars (IFCSS)
   733 15th Street, N.W., Suite 440, Washington, D.C.20005
         Tel. (202)347-0017  Fax: (202)347-0018
                Email: ifcss@wam.umd.edu


     The Correct Phone Number for 90 day Issue Consultation
     ======================================================

By now you may have received our IFCSS HQ News Release 5025 about
the 90 day restriction. We put on the wrong phone number for Mrs.
Lynda Zengerle's office, and the CORRECT number to contact her is

     (202)857-8935

For your convenience, we attach the original news release in the
following:

                  The 90 Days Limit of the CSPA
                  =============================

Under the CSPA, any individual who has returned to and stayed in
China for more than 90 days is considered to be ineligible for PR
in the United States. The IFCSS HQ has spoken to Senator Kennedy's
staff and requested consideration of certain events such as
government interference or illness which would have forced an
individual to remain in China for a total of more than 90 days
between April 11, 1990 and October 9, 1992. Senator Kennedy's staff
members have indicated that while the CSPA seems to be fairly
inflexible with regard to the 90 day rule, the Senetor MAY be
willing to ask for a case-by-case consideration for those
applicants who have remained more than 90 days but can explain
their overstay as an event beyond their control. Mr. Jerry Tinker,
the Senator staff director, also indicated that a return to China
and stay of more than 90 days based on one's own free will, such as
teaching even in a U.S. foundation program, should not be
considered as grounds for a waiver.

If you believe that you would qualify for a waiver from the 90 day
requirement, based on the criteria we have discussed above, and you
wish to have an attorney assist you with your application, we
suggest that you contact

Lynda S. Zengerle
1050 Connecticut Avenue, NW.
Washington D.C. 20036

Tel: (202) 857-8935 (This is the correct number)
Fax: (202) 857-6395

Mrs Zengerle is the partner in charge of the Immigration Practice
at Arent/Fox. She has assisted us in our CSPA lobbying effort in
many ways, and is directly involved in working on the 90 day issue.
However, as the 90 day issue will be handled case by case, the Firm
will bill for legal services at an hourly rate. This you can
discuss with Mrs Zengerle.


*********************************************************************
*                 IFCSS Headquarters Office                         *
*-------------------------------------------------------------------*
* President:      Lin Changsheng        Vice President:  Shi Heping *
*-------------------------------------------------------------------*
* PBS-L is IFCSS's news distribution list for individuals. To sign  *
* on or off from the list, please send email to listserv@ifcss.org  *
* leave the subject line open and put in the mail body:             *
*    (For signing on)      sub PBS-L last name first name           *
*    (For signing off)     unsub PBS-L last name first name         *
* For more information about IFCSS, write to ifcss-info@ifcss.org   *
*********************************************************************



From lads-l@spike.rice.edu  Wed Oct 27 15:54:24 1993
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Subject: ask for more help
X-Listprocessor-Version: 6.0a -- ListProcessor by Anastasios Kotsikonas
X-Comment:  Late-Arrival-DependentS-List 

Dear fellows: Thank you all very much for your kindly help. For my LAD's J-1
  waiver, we even no way to get a letter to prove that the J-1 holder did not
  use any money from the working unit in China. Although my J-1 LAD really did
 not use the Chinese gorvement or the working unit in China one cent. We wrote
 to the working unit in China several times asked for a letter to prove that
  we did not use their money. But no any answers a few months passed. Could
  anybody have any suggestions what should we do next step, or even do not need
 any letters to go to consulate to fill a form?  Thanks very much for your help
.

From lads-l@spike.rice.edu  Wed Oct 27 21:18:24 1993
Received: from  (localhost.rice.edu) by spike.rice.edu (AA04811); Wed, 27 Oct 93 21:18:24 CDT
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From: zhen@jove.rutgers.edu (Zhen Zhang)
To: Multiple recipients of list <lads-l@spike.rice.edu>
Subject:  How long is physical exam valid?
X-Listprocessor-Version: 6.0a -- ListProcessor by Anastasios Kotsikonas
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Dear netters,

	My lads had their physical exam in late July this year. Their interview
with local INS has been schduled in late November? I don't know if they need new
physical exam. Could anybody give me some advices?

	By the way, could anyone who filed their lads' application with Newark
INS, New Jersey and has had their lads' interview share some experience with me?

	Your reply will be greatly appreciated.

Z. Zhang


From lads-l@spike.rice.edu  Thu Oct 28 08:38:43 1993
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Subject: Re: How long is physical exam valid?
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> From lads-l@spike.rice.edu Wed Oct 27 22:20:54 1993
> Date: Wed, 27 Oct 93 21:18:24 CDT
> Reply-To: zhen@jove.rutgers.edu
> Originator: lads-l@spike.rice.edu
> Sender: lads-l@spike.rice.edu
> From: zhen@jove.rutgers.edu (Zhen Zhang)
> To: Multiple recipients of list <lads-l@spike.rice.edu>
> Subject:  How long is physical exam valid?
> X-Listprocessor-Version: 6.0a -- ListProcessor by Anastasios Kotsikonas
> X-Comment:  Late-Arrival-DependentS-List 
> Content-Length: 427
> 
> Dear netters,
> 
> 	My lads had their physical exam in late July this year. Their interview
> with local INS has been schduled in late November? I don't know if they need new
> physical exam. Could anybody give me some advices?
> 
> 	By the way, could anyone who filed their lads' application with Newark
> INS, New Jersey and has had their lads' interview share some experience with me?
> 
> 	Your reply will be greatly appreciated.
> 
> Z. Zhang
> 
> 
Finally I saw someone got an interview appointment from Newark INS.  Newark INS
has very bad reputation for its bureaucracy and bad attitude towards aliens.
My wife ( a lad ) filed her follow-up application in August, but has received
nothing from Newark INS.  I don't think your dependent would have much trouble
in interview.

Frank.


From lads-l@spike.rice.edu  Thu Oct 28 09:49:53 1993
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Date: Thu, 28 Oct 93 09:49:53 CDT
Message-Id: <9310281446.AA28210@bach.convex.com>
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From: guo@bach.convex.com (Yi Guo)
To: Multiple recipients of list <lads-l@spike.rice.edu>
Subject: Re: Forms and Procedures for Out of Status LADs (question)
X-Listprocessor-Version: 6.0a -- ListProcessor by Anastasios Kotsikonas
X-Comment:  Late-Arrival-DependentS-List 

HSIUNG%MHD.DECNET@MSUS1.BITNET wrote:
--> Hi, I have the same situation and same question as you, so please
--> post the message on the net if you receive from other netter.  Thanks a lot.
--> 
    Sure.  The correct answer would be wait till the final CSPA rule is
published (by the end of this year maybe), since the issue of voluntary
departure and how local INS should implement that is not clear at this moment.
But, basically under normal circumstances, you (the principal) should file
a I-824 (to a foreign consulate) for the out of status lad, the fee is
30 dollars.  Since I haven't started that yet, I am not clear about the
procedures that might follow.
    Also, just one thing I felt confused when I asked the Dallas INS office
examiner if out of status lad entering voluntary departure can have work
authorization (I-765 filing), she said it's not so.  I didn't have a copy
with me then, so I couldn't cite any credible source to correct her.  But
the interim rule does spell out clearly that lads in voluntary departure
can file I-765 to get a work authorization.  This might show you how confused
local INS offices are about out of status lads and voluntary departure for
this group of people.

-- 
        Jimmy Guo                |   CONVEX Computer Corporation
        E-mail: guo@convex.com   |   3000 Waterview Parkway
        Phone : (214) 497-3120   |   P.O. Box 833851
        Fax   : (214) 497-4245   |   Richardson, TX 75083-3851, U.S.A.

From lads-l@spike.rice.edu  Thu Oct 28 11:19:57 1993
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Message-Id: <9310281616.AA03341@bach.convex.com>
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To: Multiple recipients of list <lads-l@spike.rice.edu>
Subject: Re: Forms and Procedures for Out of Status LADs (question)
X-Listprocessor-Version: 6.0a -- ListProcessor by Anastasios Kotsikonas
X-Comment:  Late-Arrival-DependentS-List 

cheng@lamont.ldgo.columbia.edu wrote:
--> I saw your post. What is I-824 form? You meant we had to file PR applications
--> for our out-of-status dependents with  foreign consulates instead of local 
--> INS offices? Thanks.

    I haven't seen one exactly, but I remember it sounds like 'request for
forwarding of approval notice to consulate abroad'.  
    Since I-485 is ADJUSTMENT of status, and out of status lads don't have
any valid status to adjust from, they are basically treated same like 
dependents in China.  To comply with the INA, one who is out of status cannot
adjust status or obtain legal status within the states, instead he/she has
to obtain an immigration VISA from abroad, a consulate.  I would still suggest
waiting till the final version of the CSPA is out.  Out of status, voluntary
departure, benefits related, etc. are all too unclear both to the field
INS officials and the lads concerned.
    Also I think you don't file I-824 to a consulate, neither do you file it
to a local INS office, instead you should file to your regional service 
center (both my lawyer and an examiner at local INS told me so).  
    Please give feedbacks on your experience.  Thanks!

p.s. forgot one thing here:  out of status lads use your priority date if
they file for eb-3, so where to file does not affect a lot on the position
of the application in the queue shared with others for adjustment of status.
but I am still not clear if you file I-824, your lad's petition will be
considered for eb-3 or not (I've never seen the form, so I cannot tell if
there is any column for you to specify, or if the final CSPA rule will
make this point clear).

From lads-l@spike.rice.edu  Thu Oct 28 21:20:03 1993
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X-Comment:  Late-Arrival-DependentS-List 


Hi there!

Did any LAD filing with Kansas City INS get an approval, an interview or any
kind of response from them.  If some, please send me a E-mail.

Thank you.

LX

From lads-l@spike.rice.edu  Fri Oct 29 13:29:57 1993
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Subject: <NONE>
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X-Comment:  Late-Arrival-DependentS-List 

Hi, there:

I would appreciate if you could tell me how much the application fee for work
permit is.


From lads-l@spike.rice.edu  Fri Oct 29 15:49:04 1993
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In message Fri, 29 Oct 93 13:34:09 CDT,
  QIAN.admin@admin.creol.ucf.edu (QIAN)  writes:

> Hi, there:
>
> I would appreciate if you could tell me how much the application fee for
> work permit is.
>
It is $60 at INS in Chicago.
 

From lads-l@spike.rice.edu  Fri Oct 29 16:02:55 1993
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Forwarded message:
>From shun@galton.uchicago.edu Wed Oct 27 11:46:22 1993
Date: Wed, 27 Oct 93 11:43:23 CDT
>From: shun@galton.uchicago.edu (Zhenming Shun)
Message-Id: <9310271643.AA28417@galton.uchicago.edu>
To: lads-request@spike.rice.edu
Subject: question


As I heard, some people who came to the US after 04/11/90 also got their
PR under CSPA. IN fact they just sent their files like those who came to US
before 04/11/90. Any comments on this? I am in Chicago, does anyone in
other place know the similar thing?

From lads-l@spike.rice.edu  Fri Oct 29 16:49:46 1993
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From: hua7291@med2c1.engr.ccny.cuny.edu (Mi Mi)
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Subject: <NONE>
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   Date: Fri, 29 Oct 93 15:52:11 CDT
   Reply-To: jinmeng@rs6000.cmp.ilstu.edu
   Originator: lads-l@spike.rice.edu
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   X-Comment:  Late-Arrival-DependentS-List 

   In message Fri, 29 Oct 93 13:34:09 CDT,
     QIAN.admin@admin.creol.ucf.edu (QIAN)  writes:

   > Hi, there:
   >
   > I would appreciate if you could tell me how much the application fee for
   > work permit is.
   >
   It is $60 at INS in Chicago.


It is $60 anywhere in US.

Mi Mi Sr.

From lads-l@spike.rice.edu  Fri Oct 29 16:57:30 1993
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Subject: [xhuang@eos.ncsu.edu: LCnet News-Release(10/29/93)]
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=FYI==FYI==FYI==FYI==FYI==FYI==FYI==FYI==FYI==FYI==FYI==FYI==FYI==FYI=
=Mi-Mi-Sr.==Mi-Mi-Sr.==Mi-Mi-Sr.==Mi-Mi-Sr.==Mi-Mi-Sr.==Mi-Mi-Sr.=
=FYI==FYI==FYI==FYI==FYI==FYI==FYI==FYI==FYI==FYI==FYI==FYI==FYI==FYI=

Subject: LCnet News-Release(10/29/93)

Subject: LCnet_News102993

+---------------------------------------------------------------------------+
|                                                                           |
|                           WE CAME AFTER 04/11/90                          |
|                                  NETWORK                                  |
|                                                                           |
+---------------------------------------------------------------------------+



			TABLE OF CONTENTS
	=====================================================
	1. A Letter from LCnet Reader
	2. Comment on the Reader's Letter
	=====================================================

---------------------------------------------------------------------------
1. A Letter from LCnet Reader
---------------------------------------------------------------------------
>From xxxx@xxx.xxx.uc.EDU  Sat Oct 23 01:06:20 1993
Subject: CSPA Affect on job-finding
To: lc-l@ifcss.org

LCnet Editors:

   Following is my recent job-finding experience. I'd like to share it with
everyone who came after 04/11/1990.

   My major is in computer engineering, which is said, and I am told too, to 
be a major very easy to find a job. It seemed so before because every Chinese 
student who graduated from my group found a job. It was not too difficult.
Even someone got two or three job offers. Some of their job offers came from 
large companies.   
 
   This year it is my turn. But it turns out to be very difficult for me. 
One reason is the bad economy in US. But last year the economy was bad too. 
Another reason, more important to me, is the CSPA. OK, you can see why.

   There is this middle-size company, which I sent a resume. I am quite sure 
they will interview me, if I am lucky enough, they will hire me, because my 
background closely matches to their requirements. Sure, I got a telephone call 
from a technical guy from that company ( a group manager where I applied the 
position) and he interviewed me through telephone. I felt he was pretty 
satisfied with my background and said he would ask their personal manager to 
contact me to arrange a visit-company interview (This company is in another 
state so they will pay for my travel expenses of the interview) and other 
non-technical things. After one or two days, a lady who is a personal manager
called me. I was very glad since I had known she would arrange me to visit 
their company for the further interview. Oh, if I had passed this interview, 
I would be one of engineers in this company.

   However, the first question she asked me was if I was authorized to work in
US and asked me to tell her what my visa status was. I was not too surprised 
and told her I was a F-1 student. But to my surprise was that she asked me: 
"Did you come to the United States before the deadline defined by the new 
immigration law for Chinese Students?" What? If I heard clearly, did she 
really refer to the CSPA and did she really know that? So I asked her if she 
was referring to the CSPA and after confirmed I told her: "No, I am not 
covered by that". 

   After a while (I did not know what she did at that time, maybe talked with
somebody), she said: "I am very sorry. We can not further interview you". 
After I asked her why, she said: "At present, it is really difficult to 
sponsor a Chinese student to change the visa status, so our company's new 
policy is we can not hire F-1 student any more even though we DID before". 
Oh, Jesus. I knew the CSPA will affect us, but I did not realize it would 
happen so fast. I also wondered how an American company knew this so well and 
so quickly. 

   Another example is the Digital Equipment Company. They do not hire Chinese
students with F-1 visa any more, but before they did. I can not say that is
also the CSPA's effect. But who knows.

   If you are hunting or going to hunt for a job in today's so tight job 
market, I am sure you will meet this kind of things that happened to me. 
So, what does the CSPA affect us? When you experience, you will know.

WH


---------------------------------------------------------------------------
2. Comment on the Reader's Letter 
---------------------------------------------------------------------------
   After being shocked by the above job hunting experience, believing it or 
not, we should realize one thing: it's the time for our late comers to unite
together and take an action!

   All of our fellow students are hoping CSPA will not have a bad effect on 
our future. But as the unhappy experience of the person who wrote the above
letter indicates, the CSPA already begins to show its effect on late comers.
It begins so fast, much faster than we late comers expected. Who knows how 
much it will affect us in the future?

   While dreaming about CSPA does not hurt our late comers, while dreaming
about the harm of CSPA will become less and less as economy becomes better 
and better, we should be realistic and wake up right now. We should unite 
together and control our lives in our own hands, because this is the United 
States. If you can't let your voice heard by the people, you have to just 
accept all the unfairness you will encounter.

   We hope that every late-come fellow student will get a job easily after
finishing their studies. However, we have to prepare for the drawback of CSPA. 
When the CSPA shows its prejudice on late comers, if every victimized late 
comer fights for the unfairness he/she experiences individually, we can gain
nothing at the end. But if all of us join together, it will be a different 
story. For instance, after 1 or 2 years, our net has more than 10,000 readers.
When we take action, our voice will be much much louder and we late comers' 
strength will be much much more powerful. If we unite together, we will hold 
our lives in our OWN hands and change our fate. The pass of CSPA just showed 
this.

   To act earlier is much better than later. Dear friends, please pass the
information to your friends, please be patient to tell your friends and fellow
students what the situation is. Let them join the LCnet. Unite as many our 
fellow students as you can. Contribute a little now, everyone will get 
pay-offs in the future!

   Unite! We late comers!

HR

~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
Editors' note:

If your friends want to sub this list, please tell them send
    SUB LC-L first name last name
as body msg to listserv@ifcss.org. 

If you or your friends want sign off
this list, please send
    UNSUB LC-L
as body msg to listserv@ifcss.org.

If you want post something, please send it to lc-l@ifcss.org.

Past issues of LCnet News-Release are now FTP-able from CND.ORG in 
directory "pub/community/LCN".

+--------------------------------------------------------------------------+
|        Editor-in-Chief: Enhua He, New York University                    |
|        Executive Editor: Xiaodong Huang, North Carolina State University |
|        Editors: Huan Ren, University of California at Berkeley           |
|                 George Gao, University of Arizona                        |
|        Comments and Posts: lc-l@ifcss.org                                |
|        Sign on/off: listserv@ifcss.org                                   |
+--------------------------------------------------------------------------+
                        Unite, We Late Comers!!  





From lads-l@spike.rice.edu  Fri Oct 29 17:30:24 1993
Received: from  (localhost.rice.edu) by spike.rice.edu (AA10754); Fri, 29 Oct 93 17:30:24 CDT
Date: Fri, 29 Oct 93 17:30:24 CDT
Message-Id: <9310292227.AA10968@bach.convex.com>
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From: guo@bach.convex.com (Yi Guo)
To: Multiple recipients of list <lads-l@spike.rice.edu>
Subject: Re: LCnet posting
X-Listprocessor-Version: 6.0a -- ListProcessor by Anastasios Kotsikonas
X-Comment:  Late-Arrival-DependentS-List 

I could just sigh when I saw the second article in that posting (forwarded
by Mi Mi Sr.).  While I am really sorry for the first article's writer,
I just cannot see if the second article (comment from the LCnet commettee?)
has anything constructive to solve the problem!

What is these commettee members' logic?  The comments sound like campaign
promises to me that contains nothing!  Sure, united we stand.  But you have to
provide some plans on how to better this situation.  And, you have to be
realistic to realize you are dealing with laws.  

The LC commettee should provide their past activities and analyze these
activities, to find out how many are just empty promises, and how many have
worked in the right direction, esp. how many are failures that made the
situation worse!  They are too hot-headed to arrive at a good sense.

Finally, the tone in the second article is damaging to the Chinese community
here in the states.  What they want maybe a union of so-called LCs, versus all
other Chinese here.  They want it to be 10,000 member strong, what are they
going to do with it?  Arm it up?  Or rather try to work constructively and
reduce the number of such LC group (by providing solutions to the problem and
enabling more people realize their goal of obtaining employment here).  I am
just feeling sorry for any future members of such group unless they have a good
leader and useful tactics.  Just like Mi Mi Sr. and other netters in this group
has always said, we SHARE THE SAME INTEREST!  Haven't they realized this
already?  Sigh!!!!!! 


From lads-l@spike.rice.edu  Fri Oct 29 18:21:37 1993
Received: from  (localhost.rice.edu) by spike.rice.edu (AA10830); Fri, 29 Oct 93 18:21:37 CDT
Date: Fri, 29 Oct 93 18:21:37 CDT
Message-Id: <9310292317.AA05759@med2c1.engr.ccny.cuny.edu>
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From: hua7291@med2c1.engr.ccny.cuny.edu (Mi Mi)
To: Multiple recipients of list <lads-l@spike.rice.edu>
Subject: LCnet posting
X-Listprocessor-Version: 6.0a -- ListProcessor by Anastasios Kotsikonas
X-Comment:  Late-Arrival-DependentS-List 


guo@bach.convex.com (Yi Guo) Wrote:

   I could just sigh when I saw the second article in that posting (forwarded
   by Mi Mi Sr.).  While I am really sorry for the first article's writer,
   I just cannot see if the second article (comment from the LCnet commettee?)
   has anything constructive to solve the problem!

   What is these commettee members' logic?  The comments sound like campaign
   promises to me that contains nothing! Sure, united we stand. But you have to
   provide some plans on how to better this situation.  And, you have to be
   realistic to realize you are dealing with laws.  

   The LC commettee should provide their past activities and analyze these
   activities, to find out how many are just empty promises, and how many have
   worked in the right direction, esp. how many are failures that made the
   situation worse!  They are too hot-headed to arrive at a good sense.

   Finally, the tone in the second article is damaging to the Chinese community
   here in the states. What they want maybe a union of so-called LCs, versus 
   all other Chinese here. They want it to be 10,000 member strong, what are 
   they going to do with it?  Arm it up?  Or rather try to work constructively
   and reduce the number of such LC group (by providing solutions to the 
   problem and enabling more people realize their goal of obtaining employment
   here). I am just feeling sorry for any future members of such group unless 
   they have a good leader and useful tactics.  Just like Mi Mi Sr. and other 
   netters in this group has always said, we SHARE THE SAME INTEREST! Haven't
   they realized this already?  Sigh!!!!!! 

Well, paying tuition is not good enough to attend a school. It takes time
and many times a failure grade too! It is true the CSS in schools will be
dominated by LC, but so what? LC will leave schools also. It is true IFCSS
will lose its foundation and power base since if all the LC do not care her
and make her an enemy, she will surely die of this kind of bleeding, but so
what? If IFCSS is dead, what is the best interest of all the CSS in US? I 
can see the miniature of Chinese history unfolding just before my eyes. As
one dynasty replaces another, the foundation of the nation has been damaged
and reconstructed, again and again. Is that is nature of Chinese culture?
Is that the foundation of a culture we used to be so proud of? Why can
not change IFCSS from within? Why can not take a peaceful evolution? 

Be realistic, guys! If you want to fight US law, go ahead. It does not
show your heroism if you fight the windmill. It just shows, I am sorry to
say this, stupitity.

As my experience tells me, those Committee guys, may not represent the 
interests of majority LC fellow students. Well, there are only a handful
of guys on the netland are active. Do not be fooled by those short-sighted,
willing-to-fight guys. Mi Mi Sr. wants to collect their 10,000 signatures
to get a bigger immigration pie for everybody, mainly for LC. But he is 
able to do it. Now let us see what those Committee guys want to use that
10,000 strong signatures? 

Well, just feel sorry for the irrational authors of the LC news-release.

Mi Mi Sr.

 

%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%   
% Mr. Mi Mi, Sr., Member of Lads-Net Committee                %
% Sign on/off at listserv@spike.rice.edu, with mailbody as:   %
%    sub lads-l Firstname Lastname, or signoff lads-l         %
% Post at lads@lucerne.rice.edu                               %
% Anonymous ftp at spike.rice.edu, in /lads/ subdirectory     %
% Sign our petition letter at lads-sig@spike.rice.edu.        %
%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%

From lads-l@spike.rice.edu  Fri Oct 29 20:39:03 1993
Received: from  (localhost.rice.edu) by spike.rice.edu (AA11133); Fri, 29 Oct 93 20:39:03 CDT
Date: Fri, 29 Oct 93 20:39:03 CDT
Message-Id: <9310300135.AA05811@med2c1.engr.ccny.cuny.edu>
Errors-To: lads-request@spike.rice.edu
Reply-To: hua7291@med2c1.engr.ccny.cuny.edu
Originator: lads-l@spike.rice.edu
Sender: lads-l@spike.rice.edu
Precedence: bulk
From: hua7291@med2c1.engr.ccny.cuny.edu (Mi Mi)
To: Multiple recipients of list <lads-l@spike.rice.edu>
Subject: 
X-Listprocessor-Version: 6.0a -- ListProcessor by Anastasios Kotsikonas
X-Comment:  Late-Arrival-DependentS-List 


Mi Mi Jr.'s mother got her Green Card through mail. Her priority date is
July 1. 

Package mailed: 6/30/93
Receipt notice: 7/27/93
Approval date:  9/22/93

Dates on the card: 10/05/93 (request to make the card? No idea)
                   07/03/03 expiration date
There are DOB (date of birth);
A#, EC6, and so on.

It took one month to get the real card! Just wonder how long it will
take for a lad.

I am sure before most of principals will get their GC very soon.

Mi Mi Sr. is still waiting. He did finger prints (I-89) on 10/01/93

Cheers!

Mi Mi Sr.


%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%   
% Mr. Mi Mi, Sr., Member of Lads-Net Committee                %
% Sign on/off at listserv@spike.rice.edu, with mailbody as:   %
%    sub lads-l Firstname Lastname, or signoff lads-l         %
% Post at lads@lucerne.rice.edu                               %
% Anonymous ftp at spike.rice.edu, in /lads/ subdirectory     %
% Sign our petition letter at lads-sig@spike.rice.edu.        %
%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%

From lads-l@spike.rice.edu  Fri Oct 29 20:52:51 1993
Received: from  (localhost.rice.edu) by spike.rice.edu (AA11243); Fri, 29 Oct 93 20:52:51 CDT
Date: Fri, 29 Oct 93 20:52:51 CDT
Message-Id: <9310300149.AA05832@med2c1.engr.ccny.cuny.edu>
Errors-To: lads-request@spike.rice.edu
Reply-To: hua7291@med2c1.engr.ccny.cuny.edu
Originator: lads-l@spike.rice.edu
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Precedence: bulk
From: hua7291@med2c1.engr.ccny.cuny.edu (Mi Mi)
To: Multiple recipients of list <lads-l@spike.rice.edu>
Subject: [CZCY%CORNELLA.bitnet@CUNYVM.CUNY.EDU: Re: [xhuang@eos.ncsu.edu: LCnet News-Release(10/29/93)]]
X-Listprocessor-Version: 6.0a -- ListProcessor by Anastasios Kotsikonas
X-Comment:  Late-Arrival-DependentS-List 


This is a misdirected message. The author seems to me responded to
a anonymous arcticle carried by LCnet News-Release(10/29/93), which had
been forwarded to the lads-net committee member Mi Mi Sr.. In order to
reach the its destination, I forwarded this message to ccnl, and lads-net.

Mi Mi Sr.

=FYI==FYI==FYI==FYI==FYI==FYI==FYI==FYI==FYI==FYI==FYI==FYI==FYI==FYI==FYI=
=FYI==FYI==FYI==FYI==FYI==FYI==FYI==FYI==FYI==FYI==FYI==FYI==FYI==FYI==FYI=



Date:         Fri, 29 Oct 93 21:04:32 EDT
>From: CZCY%CORNELLA.bitnet@CUNYVM.CUNY.EDU
Subject:      Re: [xhuang@eos.ncsu.edu: LCnet News-Release(10/29/93)]
To: hua7291@med2c1.engr.ccny.cuny.edu
In-Reply-To:  Your message of Fri, 29 Oct 93 16:57:29 CDT

   I THINK YOUR IMPRESSION IS AUFULLY INEPT AND INEQUABLE IN TERMS OF ITS
CONNECTION WITH CSPA ISSUE.  HOW COULD YOU COMPLAIN THE RESPONSABILITY OF
CSPA WITHOUT ANY SOLID EVIDENCE.  HAVE YOU EVER EXAMINE YOURSELF FOR THE
POSSIBLE LIABILITY OF THE FAILURE.
   FIRST, AS A MANAGER OF THE COMPANY, ESPECIALLY A SMALL ONE, SHE/HE WOULD
PUT THE COMPANY IN A PRIORITY POSITION.  IF THEY HIRED YOU THEY WOULD HAVE
TO SPEND AT LEAST THOUSANDS OF DOLLARS TO CHANGE YOUR VISA STATUS.  WHY
SHOULD THEY CHOSE YOU IF THEY HAD MANY CANDIDATES IN HANDS.  IN SOME SENSE,
YOUR BACKGROUND OR SKILL WAS NOT SO STRONG TO CONVINCE THEM THAT IT WOULD
BE WORTHWHILE PAYING FOR CHANGE IN YOUR VISA STATUS.  YOU WOULD HAVE
ENCOUNTERED THE SAME FATE EVEN WITHOUT THE EMEREGENCE OF THE CSPA ISSUE.
SECONDLY, PLEASE CHECK YOUR INADEQUATE LINQUISTIC PRACTICE WHILE INTERVIEWING.
I CAN INSIGHT IT FROM YOUR MAIL.  TRY TO BE CAUTIOUS WHILE MAKING ANY
CONCLUSION.  GOOD LUCK.


From lads-l@spike.rice.edu  Sat Oct 30 10:53:51 1993
Received: from  (localhost.rice.edu) by spike.rice.edu (AA14358); Sat, 30 Oct 93 10:53:51 CDT
Date: Sat, 30 Oct 93 10:53:51 CDT
Message-Id: <9310301550.AA06245@med2c1.engr.ccny.cuny.edu>
Errors-To: lads-request@spike.rice.edu
Reply-To: hua7291@med2c1.engr.ccny.cuny.edu
Originator: lads-l@spike.rice.edu
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Precedence: bulk
From: hua7291@med2c1.engr.ccny.cuny.edu (Mi Mi)
To: Multiple recipients of list <lads-l@spike.rice.edu>
Subject: 
X-Listprocessor-Version: 6.0a -- ListProcessor by Anastasios Kotsikonas
X-Comment:  Late-Arrival-DependentS-List 


An unauthorized interpretation of YOUR Resident Alien Card (I-551)

EC6:   E(mployment-Based)C(hinese Students)6(.4 Incident)
Color: Pink----> faded red (color of the blood)

Just Kidding!

Mi Mi Sr.

%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%   
% Mr. Mi Mi, Sr., Member of Lads-Net Committee                %
% Sign on/off at listserv@spike.rice.edu, with mailbody as:   %
%    sub lads-l Firstname Lastname, or signoff lads-l         %
% Post at lads@lucerne.rice.edu                               %
% Anonymous ftp at spike.rice.edu, in /lads/ subdirectory     %
% Sign our petition letter at lads-sig@spike.rice.edu.        %
%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%

From lads-l@spike.rice.edu  Sat Oct 30 15:28:23 1993
Received: from  (localhost.rice.edu) by spike.rice.edu (AA14610); Sat, 30 Oct 93 15:28:23 CDT
Date: Sat, 30 Oct 93 15:28:23 CDT
Message-Id: <00974CC9.B5AC1440.6243@nuclear.physics.sunysb.edu>
Errors-To: lads-request@spike.rice.edu
Reply-To: hao@nuclear.physics.sunysb.edu
Originator: lads-l@spike.rice.edu
Sender: lads-l@spike.rice.edu
Precedence: bulk
From: hao@nuclear.physics.sunysb.edu
To: Multiple recipients of list <lads-l@spike.rice.edu>
Subject: 
X-Listprocessor-Version: 6.0a -- ListProcessor by Anastasios Kotsikonas
X-Comment:  Late-Arrival-DependentS-List 

   
  
  My friend who is CSPA got his Green Card yesterday. But the DOB(date of birth)
  on the card is not right. His birthday should be xx xx 66 instead of 
  xx xx 60 appeared in his green card. Certainly, INS made a mistake.
  He would like to know how to correct it and where he has to go.
  Thanks for your attention. 
   
  Any reply and suggestion will be greatly apppreciated.

  



From lads-l@spike.rice.edu  Sat Oct 30 15:33:52 1993
Received: from  (localhost.rice.edu) by spike.rice.edu (AA14697); Sat, 30 Oct 93 15:33:52 CDT
Date: Sat, 30 Oct 93 15:33:52 CDT
Message-Id: <9310302025.AA18597@mickey.WPI.EDU>
Errors-To: lads-request@spike.rice.edu
Reply-To: djiang@ee.wpi.edu
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From: Dan Jiang <djiang@ee.wpi.edu>
To: Multiple recipients of list <lads-l@spike.rice.edu>
Subject: Re: [xhuang@eos.ncsu.edu: LCnet News-Release(10/29/93)]
X-Listprocessor-Version: 6.0a -- ListProcessor by Anastasios Kotsikonas
X-Comment:  Late-Arrival-DependentS-List 


I have a few comments on LCnet News-Release(10/29/93).

1) While most immigration lawyers don't know CSPA very well, a manager in
   "middle-size" company know it, so funny.

2) Computer engineering is not easy to find a job now, it goes
   down. Right now, software application is very easy to find a job for
   foreigners. So far as I know, most companies require candidates at least 
   have work permit except software companies, because software application 
   is so hot. But golden time of computer engineering has passed.
   Everyone whose major is EE should know it. 
 
   Yes, before every chinese student whose major is computer engineering 
   can get a few job offers, some guys are working in large companies and 
   companies help them get PR using EC-2, at least it's true in my school. 
   But this year, the situation has changed. For example, in this passed May, 
   Digital Equipment Company posted 10 entry level job opening in VLSI area 
   at our school, it's pretty good for chinese students without any work 
   experience in U.S, but PERMANENT RESIDENT is required. WHO CARES HOW YOU 
   GET PR? Only PR or work permit without time restriction is required. So 
   some students in my department didn't have interview chance, but ABC can 
   get these job. Do you hate ABC?
   
   I don't believe the company is only interested in CSPA beneficiary,
   they are just interested in guys who have workpermit without time
   restriction. So without CSPA, that student( in LCnet News-Release) still 
   can't get that job. Can we say we hate all PR or American citizen?

3) I signed on LCnet when it appeared immediately, but only one week later, 
   I gave up, because I don't believe stories made in that net. I don't know
   what they want to do? And I don't think they know what they should do.
   Well, if you look through all LCnet News-Release, you can find a lot of
   willing-to-fight( as Mi Mi pointed out) words, then...... nothing!


--

Dan Jiang(~{=/5$~})                        E-mail:djiang@ee.wpi.edu
Dept. of ECE.                                     djiang@wpi.wpi.edu
Worcester Polytechnic Institute.
Worcester, MA 01609

Phone: 508-831-5652(office)

--

From lads-l@spike.rice.edu  Sat Oct 30 16:41:14 1993
Received: from  (localhost.rice.edu) by spike.rice.edu (AA14872); Sat, 30 Oct 93 16:41:14 CDT
Date: Sat, 30 Oct 93 16:41:14 CDT
Message-Id: <9310302137.AA06400@med2c1.engr.ccny.cuny.edu>
Errors-To: lads-request@spike.rice.edu
Reply-To: hua7291@med2c1.engr.ccny.cuny.edu
Originator: lads-l@spike.rice.edu
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From: hua7291@med2c1.engr.ccny.cuny.edu (Mi Mi)
To: Multiple recipients of list <lads-l@spike.rice.edu>
Subject: [xhuang@eos.ncsu.edu: LCnet News-Release(10/29/93)]
X-Listprocessor-Version: 6.0a -- ListProcessor by Anastasios Kotsikonas
X-Comment:  Late-Arrival-DependentS-List 


One more comment on the LCnet News-Release(10/29/93). The CSPA is targeted
as a scapegoat for everything. EC are all evils. Everything is done on the
expense of the LC. Nothing good is to be said about the EC & CSPA. Come on
guys, what are you going to do with all of those messages? If you hate CSPA,
then why not hate INA? If you hate CSPA PRers, then why not ALL the PRers of
the Chinese mainlanders? why not ALL the PRers of China origin? why not ALL 
the PRers of all the nationalities? then ALL of the citizens of the United 
States? Since you hate them ALL, why did you come here? For hatred only? For
hatred torward EC only? Your fighting spirit is high, I must say, but your
rationale is rather poor, so poor to make any sense! 

Just my two cents. 

Mi Mi Sr.

%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%   
% Mr. Mi Mi, Sr., Member of Lads-Net Committee                %
% Sign on/off at listserv@spike.rice.edu, with mailbody as:   %
%    sub lads-l Firstname Lastname, or signoff lads-l         %
% Post at lads@lucerne.rice.edu                               %
% Anonymous ftp at spike.rice.edu, in /lads/ subdirectory     %
% Sign our petition letter at lads-sig@spike.rice.edu.        %
%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%

From lads-l@spike.rice.edu  Sat Oct 30 17:08:08 1993
Received: from  (localhost.rice.edu) by spike.rice.edu (AA14931); Sat, 30 Oct 93 17:08:08 CDT
Date: Sat, 30 Oct 93 17:08:08 CDT
Message-Id: <00974CD7.A7D8EC40.6271@nuclear.physics.sunysb.edu>
Errors-To: lads-request@spike.rice.edu
Reply-To: hao@nuclear.physics.sunysb.edu
Originator: lads-l@spike.rice.edu
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From: hao@nuclear.physics.sunysb.edu
To: Multiple recipients of list <lads-l@spike.rice.edu>
Subject: help
X-Listprocessor-Version: 6.0a -- ListProcessor by Anastasios Kotsikonas
X-Comment:  Late-Arrival-DependentS-List 

   
  
  My friend who is CSPA got his Green Card yesterday. But the DOB(date of birth)
  on the card is not right. His birthday should be xx xx 66 instead of 
  xx xx 60 appeared in his green card. Certainly, INS made a mistake.
  He would like to know how to correct it and where he has to go.
  Thanks for your attention. 
   
  Any reply and suggestion will be greatly appreciated.



From lads-l@spike.rice.edu  Sat Oct 30 17:12:47 1993
Received: from  (localhost.rice.edu) by spike.rice.edu (AA14972); Sat, 30 Oct 93 17:12:47 CDT
Date: Sat, 30 Oct 93 17:12:47 CDT
Message-Id: <9310302207.AA06448@med2c1.engr.ccny.cuny.edu>
Errors-To: lads-request@spike.rice.edu
Reply-To: hua7291@med2c1.engr.ccny.cuny.edu
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From: hua7291@med2c1.engr.ccny.cuny.edu (Mi Mi)
To: Multiple recipients of list <lads-l@spike.rice.edu>
Subject: Re: LCnet News-Release(10/29/93)
X-Listprocessor-Version: 6.0a -- ListProcessor by Anastasios Kotsikonas
X-Comment:  Late-Arrival-DependentS-List 


I do not to launch any fightings on the public nets. It is rather senseless
to me. The pointing is, IF LC AND EC are fighting each other, than who is
the winner? As far as CSPA is concerned, ALL the EC and their LADS are PRers
and would be PRers, no matter what you can or can not do. It is totally 
senseless to argue this. The things we BOTH can do NOW, is to move all
the lads into the world-wide pool. If you do not want to do this, it is
your choice. If you want to live here, why not make some more friends? 

Mi Mi Sr.



%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%   
% Mr. Mi Mi, Sr., Member of Lads-Net Committee                %
% Sign on/off at listserv@spike.rice.edu, with mailbody as:   %
%    sub lads-l Firstname Lastname, or signoff lads-l         %
% Post at lads@lucerne.rice.edu                               %
% Anonymous ftp at spike.rice.edu, in /lads/ subdirectory     %
% Sign our petition letter at lads-sig@spike.rice.edu.        %
%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%

From lads-l@spike.rice.edu  Sat Oct 30 20:17:51 1993
Received: from  (localhost.rice.edu) by spike.rice.edu (AA15348); Sat, 30 Oct 93 20:17:51 CDT
Date: Sat, 30 Oct 93 20:17:51 CDT
Message-Id: <27458052@um.cc.umich.edu>
Errors-To: lads-request@spike.rice.edu
Reply-To: xy.zhou@um.cc.umich.edu
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From: xy.zhou@um.cc.umich.edu
To: Multiple recipients of list <lads-l@spike.rice.edu>
Subject: My proposal
X-Listprocessor-Version: 6.0a -- ListProcessor by Anastasios Kotsikonas
X-Comment:  Late-Arrival-DependentS-List 

     Reflections on the lads issues
  IFCSS is supposed to represent the whole CSS community in the
US, but the IFCSS council erroneously made the decision in June
or July to terminate the service to those who would benefit from
the CSPA, and especially those who have something to do with
lads.  This decision is unfair, hazardous, and totally wrong.
It reflects the weak leadership of IFCSS headquarter and the
poor and inmature judgements of the IFCSS council members of the
present term.
  I am sympathetic to those who can not benefit from the CSPA and
those who suffer from the job search because of the CSPA, but the
bottom line is: those who have lads should not be neglected and
their immediate interests should be protected as well.  We are
happy if the late comers are willing to work for our interests,
such as lobbying for the worldwide quote issue, as well as their
interests; we do not mind if they do not want to do that due to
lack of interests; but we do mind that the interests of us with
lads are jeopardized.
  Several months have passed, and the date is near when the final
rule will be published.  I am disappointed to see that no sig-
nificant progress be made on the lads issue in IFCSS, not even
a nominal one.  I propose that we request the IFCSS headquarter
to reverse the wrong decision on the lads issue and that the lads
issues be brought into their daily agenda.
  Think of those "out of status" lads who are suffering day and
night because they will be separated from their loved ones for an
indefinite time in an alien nation.  Think of those whose family
members are still in the mainland and the hardship they will have
to face in an uncertain future.  etc.....  I see no reason that
the interests of those with lads not be given consideration in an
organization like IFCSS.
  I would also like to express my sincere thanks to NACC here as
Dr. Haiqing Zhao deserves full credits for clearing the way for
all F-2 and J-2 lads who were considered at that time to be "out
of status" technically by the INS in late July.  I would have had
to hire a lawyer to file my wife's application.  I am also grate-
ful to Dr. Haiqing Zhao and former IFCSS staff, who had done a
great deal in 1992 to lobby the pass of CSPA by the Congress.
  The present IFCSS is disappointed in the recent donation drive
in the CSS community, and it is not surprising.  This is a sign
that the present IFCSS is losing the support of early comers, who
have the greatest potential, the greatest interests, and the 
greatest responsibilities to support an organization like IFCSS.
I would be saddened to see that IFCSS is becoming the de facto
LC task force.  I urge the present IFCSS council members to think
carefully and seriously of the lads issues.
X. Zhou

From lads-l@spike.rice.edu  Sat Oct 30 20:38:54 1993
Received: from  (localhost.rice.edu) by spike.rice.edu (AA15492); Sat, 30 Oct 93 20:38:54 CDT
Date: Sat, 30 Oct 93 20:38:54 CDT
Message-Id: <9310310135.AA24424@cs1.bradley.edu>
Errors-To: lads-request@spike.rice.edu
Reply-To: weili@cs1.bradley.edu
Originator: lads-l@spike.rice.edu
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From: weili@cs1.bradley.edu (Wei Li)
To: Multiple recipients of list <lads-l@spike.rice.edu>
Subject: Advanced parole
X-Listprocessor-Version: 6.0a -- ListProcessor by Anastasios Kotsikonas
X-Comment:  Late-Arrival-DependentS-List 

Hi netter:
	From the net I found some of LADs got their advanced paroles 
form their local INS.  Could any one tell me the application procedures 
for advanced paroles?
	Your response will be greatly appreciated!





From lads-l@spike.rice.edu  Sat Oct 30 22:46:09 1993
Received: from  (localhost.rice.edu) by spike.rice.edu (AA15999); Sat, 30 Oct 93 22:46:09 CDT
Date: Sat, 30 Oct 93 22:46:09 CDT
Message-Id: <9310310345.AA15989@spike.rice.edu>
Errors-To: lads-request@spike.rice.edu
Reply-To: ZXY2@psuvm.psu.edu
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From: <ZXY2@psuvm.psu.edu>
To: Multiple recipients of list <lads-l@spike.rice.edu>
Subject: Re: [xhuang@eos.ncsu.edu: LCnet News-Release(10/29/93)]
X-Listprocessor-Version: 6.0a -- ListProcessor by Anastasios Kotsikonas
X-Comment:  Late-Arrival-DependentS-List 

I happen to have a good friend who has a MS in computer engineering,
and who came to US in Jan. 1991.

He got two offers from two mid-size companies near boston in the same
week. (of course he got several interviews before that)  He only has
a work permit for financial difficulty. He chose one company which gives
him a higher title last month. And the company has filed H-1 for him.

It seems that is not everyone from CmpEng out of luck...:-)

FYI.

From lads-l@spike.rice.edu  Sun Oct 31 10:17:43 1993
Received: from  (localhost.rice.edu) by spike.rice.edu (AA01438); Sun, 31 Oct 93 10:17:43 CST
Date: Sun, 31 Oct 93 10:17:43 CST
Message-Id: <01H4RBQHLDKWADF7VC@WSUHUB.UC.TWSU.EDU>
Errors-To: lads-request@spike.rice.edu
Reply-To: HXYUE@wsuhub.uc.twsu.edu
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From: HXYUE@wsuhub.uc.twsu.edu
To: Multiple recipients of list <lads-l@spike.rice.edu>
Subject: Wrong Infor. on GC
X-Listprocessor-Version: 6.0a -- ListProcessor by Anastasios Kotsikonas
X-Comment:  Late-Arrival-DependentS-List 


Hi there!

The four INS service centers are in charge of the CSPA principals'
applications.  If your GC contains some wrong infor., your should
contact with the INS service center to correct it.

LX

From lads-l@spike.rice.edu  Sun Oct 31 16:35:07 1993
Received: from  (localhost.rice.edu) by spike.rice.edu (AA02015); Sun, 31 Oct 93 16:35:07 CST
Date: Sun, 31 Oct 93 16:35:07 CST
Message-Id: <9310312232.AA03208@lorien.creol.ucf.edu>
Errors-To: lads-request@spike.rice.edu
Reply-To: QIAN.admin@admin.creol.ucf.edu
Originator: lads-l@spike.rice.edu
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From: QIAN.admin@admin.creol.ucf.edu (QIAN)
To: Multiple recipients of list <lads-l@spike.rice.edu>
Subject: RE: <NONE>
X-Listprocessor-Version: 6.0a -- ListProcessor by Anastasios Kotsikonas
X-Comment:  Late-Arrival-DependentS-List 

>Date: 29-Oct-93 15:50
>From: JMeng @ SMTP (Jin Meng) {lads-l@spike.rice.edu}
>To: QIAN@admin (Shunning Qian)
>Subject: RE: <NONE>
>
>In message Fri, 29 Oct 93 13:34:09 CDT,
>  QIAN.admin@admin.creol.ucf.edu (QIAN)  writes:
>
>> Hi, there:
>>
>> I would appreciate if you could tell me how much the application fee for
>> work permit is.
>>
>It is $60 at INS in Chicago.
>

Thank you for the reply !


From lads-l@spike.rice.edu  Sun Oct 31 19:44:20 1993
Received: from  (localhost.rice.edu) by spike.rice.edu (AA02262); Sun, 31 Oct 93 19:44:20 CST
Date: Sun, 31 Oct 93 19:44:20 CST
Message-Id: <9311010140.AA25488@eng.auburn.edu>
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From: Hong Tan <tan@eng.auburn.edu>
To: Multiple recipients of list <lads-l@spike.rice.edu>
Subject: 
X-Listprocessor-Version: 6.0a -- ListProcessor by Anastasios Kotsikonas
X-Comment:  Late-Arrival-DependentS-List 


I felt sorry for the guy who did not get the job interview (LCnet News-Release),
but I am confused of what he/she wanted by telling the story this way. The 
comments made by the second article was even harder to understand. 

There are still many jobs available in today's market. Some people have good
luck while others are not so lucky. Visa status might be a problem sometimes
but not always. Computer Engineering major now has a tough time to get a 
satisfied job because of the poor economy. You need both luck and courage to 
win the battle of job hunting but should not blame the CSPA for all 
responsibilities.

So stop fighting your fellow Chinese.


