Re: [compost_tea] Newcomer (one more time:)

From: <soilfoodweb_at_aol.com>
Date: Wed, 25 Feb 2004 15:38:02 EST

In a message dated 25/02/04 8:05:30 PM E. Australia Standard Time,
ted.peterson_at_tcsn.net writes:

> How fast will my bacteria grow in relation to any fungi I may extract
> and/or grow and at what point will the bacteria eat all the food that the fungi
> needs? Does the fungi keep growing or does it grow and what about protoza?
> Are they growing in concert with the brewing time for fungi or do they need
> more time? How much time?
>
There is a continuum of species of bacteria and fungi, and the foods used
select for the precise set of bacteria and fungi which grow. If you pick
molassess, at a low concentration, bacterial growth is pretty much the only thing you
get. The bacteria have enzymes that are better at grabbing simple sugars.
If you use molasses in the 1% range, both bacteria and a few fungi grow, but
typically that's enough molasses to rev up the bacteria so they grow very
rapidly, and the burst of growth they produce can drive the brew anaerobic. They
typically produce some temperature, and so the stage is set for E. coli growth,
IF E. coli is in the compost to begin.

Increasing concentrations of molasses CAN result in a concentration high
enough to inhibit bacterial growth through simple removal of water based on an
osmotic binding. But it seems hard to consistently produce a concentrated enough
condition to be assured of this working to allow fungi to rule, instead of
bacteria.

So, different foods than sugar seem to be the way to go. Besides, most
DECENT compost seems to supply more than enough sugar to maintain bacterial growth.
 It is the fungal component that is hard to wake up and get growing. But a
critical component to have in the tea.

Fungal foods are what need to be added to the brew, and sugars kept to a
minimum. You need to understand your compost, so you know the potential to brew
bacteria. Then, as suggested by MANY people on this list, temperature is
important.

When temperatures are low in the winter, adding sugar to get some heating as
the bacteria grow might be a good idea. In mid-summer when temperatures are
high, adding sugar is NOT a good idea.

Use of cool water in mid-summer is a good idea. Warming the water is good in
winter.

Understanding all the variables is important when you are selling any
product. Growers don't have to understand all the variables, if you can easily and
clearly explain how to make the machine work for them in their conditions.

For example, the Soil Soup machines we have tested don't provide compost tea
with all the organisms in it. I have never been able to produce a decent tea
using the Soil Soup machines available to me - based on my definition of
needing to have both bacteria and fungi, as well as protozoa and nematodes. It
provides a bacterial tea, which can limit black spot, and a few other foliar
disease organisms. But it doesn't give all the benefits one would want from a
compost tea, because it doesn't allow all the organisms to be extracted from the
compost, or allow them to survive in the tea.

My understanding is that the Soil soup machine MAY have been modified, and
perhaps it is better at extracting at this point. Who knows, when the Soil Soup
people never test their machine to determine what organisms actually grow in
the tea?

Anyway, helping growers move in a more sustainable direction is what is
needed. We don't need to be verbally abusive of each other. I don't like reading
posts containing put-downs and un-necessary negativity about other people. I
generally stop reading posts from people who behave that way.

Negativity about things that you can substantiate the reason for that
negativity, which takes the situation out of the opinion category and into hard fact
is different. We can document that Soil Soup machines do not produce teas
with the biology that is needed to give the benefits that I talk about in my
lectures. Facts are facts.

Most other compost tea machines can make teas with the proper biology to
benefit plant growth. Manufacturers need to tell their clients exactly how to
achieve that with their machine. If the buyer chooses not to pay attention to
"how to properly run the machine", then it is not the manufacturer's fault.

If you don't pay attention to how to properly run a chain saw, it is not the
manufacturer's fault if you cut your hand off. The instructions were clear on
how to run the machine properly. Tools are tools. Incorrect use is in the
operator's realm of responsibility.

Getting advice from someone who doesn't know how to operate a machine
correctly just means you wasted your time and possibly money working with an ego that
can't recognize their own limitations or learn that reading the instructions
that came with the machine might be necessary. You learn from that experience
not to work with that person again.

We've all been there and done that, from both sides, most likely. Grin!

Anyway, back to protozoa. Protozoa take longer to reproduce in the brewer
than bacteria or for fungal growth to occur. Thus, nutrient CYCLING is not
likely in a tea brewer, unless brewing occurs for days or weeks. Probably a
minimum of three days would be required.

Hope this helps -

Elaine Ingham




Received on Wed Feb 25 2004 - 16:05:12 EST

This archive was generated by hypermail 2.3.0 : Tue Feb 07 2012 - 14:15:04 EST