Koine Conversation

Resources and methods for teaching and learning New Testament Greek.

Re: Koine Conversation

Postby Louis L Sorenson » September 7th, 2013, 11:15 am

The problem with having a B-Greek composition forum would be several.
(1) Any new composition forum dilutes the current three forums which see some of this traffic.

ΔΙΑΛΟΓΟΙ ΑΤΤΙΚΟΙ https://plus.google.com/communities/107777898399557980319?cfem=1 (No Chat)
Schola: http://schola.ning.com/ (associated with ΔΙΑΛΟΓΟΙ ΑΤΤΙΚΟΙ) Chat (Only Hebrew, Latin, Ancient Greek allowed)
ΣΧΟΛΗ http://sxole.com (Chat, Blogs, more)
Textkit's Composition Forum: http://www.textkit.com/greek-latin-forum/viewforum.php?f=28

Some people have been trying to have video chat sessions.
Living Koine (on Google+) https://plus.google.com/u/0/communities/116296844861689639823

On Textkit there are classes in composition, once in a while. The Greek Study Group (an email list - http://www.quasillum.com/study/greekstudy.php) will sometimes have a class if someone asks. I ran one once there, Most use Sedgewick, but that assumes a full one to two years of prior grammar.

(2) Most people who use the speaking methodology as a class are involved in a college or have a site that tries to build resources - which cost money - so they offer content at cost:
The Biblical Language Center http://www.biblicallanguagecenter.com/immersion-courses/
The Conversational Koine Institute http://www.conversationalkoine.com/

As online teaching becomes more entrenched and internet speed and apps like Google+, GoToMeeting, Skype, etc. get more savvy, you will see more of these types of courses. To have Skype, etc. have more that x number of people, the teacher has to pay for their online meeting software, so there is cost there also. Hope this helps a little.

(3) People who are skilled at Greek, do not participate, at least with their real name, because they are often embarrassed or don't think those methods (spoking or writing) are worth the time or effort for the reward.
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Re: Koine Conversation

Postby George F Somsel » September 7th, 2013, 11:56 am

Unless you are referring to very advanced students, my concern with the idea of Koine Conversation is that it would be a case of the blind leading the blind.
george
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Re: Koine Conversation

Postby Stephen Carlson » September 7th, 2013, 2:07 pm

We occasionally get people composing in Greek in some threads. Often these go off-topic so that they should not really remain in situ, but the practice is beneficial. So I think this forum needs a place for it.

Whether it takes off or not is a different question, but this forum has lots of sub-forums that are rarely used, so one more rarely used sub-form--in the worst case--won't matter too much.
Stephen C. Carlson, Ph.D. (Duke, New Testament)
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Re: Koine Conversation

Postby Jonathan Robie » September 7th, 2013, 3:33 pm

Here's a proposal.

For now, we could use the Other forum for this. I imagine we would want to loosen the rules about topics for discussion in Greek, while retaining the respectful discourse rules. If there is enough discussion to warrant creating a forum, I will do so.

How does that sound?

Also, here's an article on the use of Google Hangouts that discusses Michael Halcomb at the Conversational Koine Institute, he uses Google Hangouts for live language classes:

http://sproutsocial.com/insights/2013/08/google-plus-hangouts-educators/
ἐξίσταντο δὲ πάντες καὶ διηποροῦντο, ἄλλος πρὸς ἄλλον λέγοντες, τί θέλει τοῦτο εἶναι;
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Re: Koine Conversation

Postby Stephen Hughes » September 7th, 2013, 5:04 pm

Stephen Carlson wrote:We occasionally get people composing in Greek in some threads. Often these go off-topic ...
It is extremely difficult to keep ones direction in what one is saying in a language that one is not so used to. It is enough effort to get anything out at all, let alone to say what you initially thought you might have liked to have said. Allowance should be made for that (natural) phenomenon when dealing with posts in Greek in threads.

George F Somsel wrote:Unless you are referring to very advanced students, my concern with the idea of Koine Conversation is that it would be a case of the blind leading the blind.
I agree with this concern. Less-than-fully-competent students (most students) would of course benefit from peer review. Dividing discussions into; "I don't know if this is anything like Greek, but I'm going to try anyway" posts from "I think this is right so here goes" threads might be beneficial. I'm open to suggestions, but it seems to me that the divide is; "Is the writer able to use verbs with prefixed prepositions to any degree?" (ie are collocations accurately handled) and "how well are participles handled?" I think that there would be a broad spectrum of writers, with only a few of them ("very advanced students" as George calls them) who would serve as models of good Greek, and the majority will be writing Greek as a work-in-progress.

Louis L Sorenson wrote:The problem with having a B-Greek composition forum would be several.
Apart from the concerns raised by LLS, I would like to raise the question of what people who aproach the forum will imagine composition to be. People will come with a variety of expectations. A well-planed forum with moderators who can direct / coax participants into one or other option might work okay. Some of those things might be "composing about a verse or topic", "exercises in using a particular tense or set of words", "summarising", "simplifying" or others that don't readily spring to mind.
Stephen Hughes
"If you can't explain it to a six year old, you don't understand it yourself."
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Re: Koine Conversation

Postby Stephen Hughes » September 7th, 2013, 5:21 pm

Tait Sougstad wrote:If you were going to lead a session with second-year Greek students, with the goal of keeping them conversing in Greek the entire time, how would you do it?
The usual "trick" that training schools use when teaching English is to artificially supply students with prepared questions and prepared answers to those questions. Then they check if students have memorised both the answers and questions and answers. Finally, they let them have the conversation that they have prepared. That makes people feel good, and gives them a sense of satisfaction. If fact they know very little, but they have a sense of progress and want to move forward

Tait Sougstad wrote:Would you prescribe topics to discuss?
I think that you would do more than prescribe something, to be a group leader, you would need to supply linguistic (linguistic means the adjective of language) materials that they can use, and simple repetitive patterns to sort of move things along.

Tait Sougstad wrote:How would you help students practice sentence structures that are not intuitive to English speakers?
I think you would have to spend more time on them till they became natural for your fellows. Perhaps memorising a verse (or just a phrase) or two from the NT to serve as a role model for the construction would be okay.

Tait Sougstad wrote:How would you help students use participles? What about verb tenses with which English speakers are unfamiliar (like learning to use the Perfect, Pluperfect, Imperfect, and Aorist tenses properly in conversation)?
Take things step by step and one by one. Don't combine too much and don't push for progress.
Stephen Hughes
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