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GBlist: Re: greenbuilding-digest V1 #297



greenbuilding-digest wrote:
> 
> Message forwarded from Classic Prodigy®
> 
>     ---------------------------------------------------------------
> 
> Subject: greenbuilding-digest V1 #297
> Date: Thu, 12 Jun 1997 02:00:24 -0400 (EDT)
> From: owner-greenbuilding-digest@crest.org (greenbuilding-digest)
> Reply-To: greenbuilding@crest.org
> To: greenbuilding-digest@crest.org
> 
> greenbuilding-digest      Thursday, June 12 1997      Volume 01 : Number 297
> 
> ----------------------------------------------------------------------
> 
> Date: Wed, 11 Jun 1997 09:22:48 -0400 (EDT)
> From: TBren46501@aol.com
> Subject: Re: GBlist: GBLIST: greywater, septic, CT
> 
> In a message dated 5/28/97 11:54:48 PM, alex@ludden.com (Alex Ludden) wrote:
> 
> <<Hello!
> 
> I have been lurking on the list for a while, and have enjoyed all the
> different viewpoints presented.
> Thank you!
> 
> I bought 4 1/2 acres in Hays county, TX. It is basically two sides of a hill
> with a wet-weather creek in the middle. The terrain is rocky (collecci
> (sp?)). Hays county has no building permits, but I definitely need a septic
> permit.
> 
> All the neighbors around have very expensive aerobic septic systems. I have
> been quoted figures of $8000 and up (and every contractor I spoke with says
> 'Of course, this system here cost a lot more because of the difficult
> location). I heard of a neighbor who spent $ 30K on his, which I think is
> crazy.>>
> 
> Hi,
> 
> Sorry to be so long posting this, and it may be redundant.  Two fellows gave
> talks at the JLC conference a couple of years ago about alternative
> wastewater treatment systems.  They seemed well thought out to me.  The
> fellows were Anish Jantrania 508-281-9773 (this may actually be the phone
> number for the city of Gloucester, if it is ask for Ellen Katz, Wastewater
> Engineering Coordinator).  The other fellow was George Loomis at the
> University of Rhode Island, 401-792-4558 - has a training program for on-site
> wastewater disposal.  They've done a lot of alternative work.  Lastly, check
> with the National Small Flows Clearinghouse 1-800-624-8301 or 304-293-4191. -
> Terry
> __________________________________________________________________
> This greenbuilding dialogue is sponsored by Oikos (www.oikos.com)
> and Environmental Building News (www.ebuild.com). For instructions
> send e-mail to greenbuilding-request@crest.org.
> __________________________________________________________________
> 
> ------------------------------
> 
> Date: Wed, 11 Jun 1997 09:51:11 -0400 (EDT)
> From: TBren46501@aol.com
> Subject: Re: GBlist: Dangers of CCA Pressure Treated Wood
> 
> In a message dated 6/9/97 3:55:34 PM, crkoehn@mailbag.com (Chris & Ruth
> Koehn) wrote:
> 
> <<We've been considering using some of the  native and naturally rot
> resistant wood species in place of cca treated wood.  My forestry
> connections suggest that walnut, certain species of locust, red cedar,
> and katalpa are all very rot resistent- in some circumstances as much so
> as cca treated wood (my father in law used locust for fence posts on his
> farm, which have been in ground contact for 50 years and still look
> good). In many instances logs can be had for the trouble of removal here
> in Wisconsin. Most of these trees are extremely invasive, and considered
> "weeds" by farmers and woodlot owners.
> 
> Any experiences with these materials? I know it's a hassle cutting and
> sawing and drying.
> 
> How about using this ACQ preserve stuff? Anybody tried it?
> 
> Chris Koehn
> Top Ridge Homes>>
> 
> Hi Chris,
> 
> Yep.  My experience with white locust, arborvitae, red cedar, redwood and
> cypress is that they are extremely well protected from fungal breakdown and
> insect infestation.  I'd like to see programs that grow, transport, machine,
> transport and eventually dispose of them managed in ways that minimize
> impact.  Here's my "yesbuts".  None of these trees are weeds. I don't know if
> any of them are being managed as a renewable resource.  I'd like to hear from
> the eco-foresters on that one.  Last I knew, cypress was a species at risk
> (too bad cause it lasts the best).  Working these woods without respiratory
> protection will expose you to the natural toxins present in every one of
> them.  My old partner and I ended up at the emergency room with toxic shock
> after three days of working with black walnut.  Lastly, locust is damn bear
> to saw, plane or sand - a tool eater.  - Terry
> __________________________________________________________________
> This greenbuilding dialogue is sponsored by Oikos (www.oikos.com)
> and Environmental Building News (www.ebuild.com). For instructions
> send e-mail to greenbuilding-request@crest.org.
> __________________________________________________________________
> 
> ------------------------------
> 
> Date: Wed, 11 Jun 1997 11:42:54 -0500
> From: sbtauto@juno.com
> Subject: Re: GBlist: Dangers of CCA Pressure Treated Wood
> 
> Just to amend TBren:
> 
> South Texas Mountain Juniper (Cedar) is also highly resistant to insect
> and rot.  I have used it for fence posts in two states for over ten
> years.  You can't hardly hurt the stuff.
> 
> It is absolutely prolific in our region, it produces a very aggressive
> pollen in the winter that gives many of us down here bloody hell and it
> is a water hog.  Water is something we can't easily spare.   Cedar's only
> redeeming value is that it's bark serves as a nesting for birds that only
> reside in the hill country here.
> 
> We here in Texas will promise to spare the old large growth if you will
> please come down here and cut just as much as you can and take it home
> with you.
> 
>  (Tongue only slightly in cheek.)
> 
> On Wed, 11 Jun 1997 09:51:11 -0400 (EDT) TBren46501@aol.com writes:
> >
> >In a message dated 6/9/97 3:55:34 PM, crkoehn@mailbag.com (Chris &
> >Ruth
> >Koehn) wrote:
> >
> ><<We've been considering using some of the  native and naturally rot
> >resistant wood species in place of cca treated wood.  My forestry
> >connections suggest that walnut, certain species of locust, red cedar,
> >
> >and katalpa are all very rot resistent- in some circumstances as much
> >so
> >as cca treated wood (my father in law used locust for fence posts on
> >his
> >farm, which have been in ground contact for 50 years and still look
> >good). In many instances logs can be had for the trouble of removal
> >here
> >in Wisconsin. Most of these trees are extremely invasive, and
> >considered
> >"weeds" by farmers and woodlot owners.
> >
> >Any experiences with these materials? I know it's a hassle cutting and
> >
> >sawing and drying.
> >
> >How about using this ACQ preserve stuff? Anybody tried it?
> >
> >Chris Koehn
> >Top Ridge Homes>>
> >
> >Hi Chris,
> >
> >Yep.  My experience with white locust, arborvitae, red cedar, redwood
> >and
> >cypress is that they are extremely well protected from fungal
> >breakdown and
> >insect infestation.  I'd like to see programs that grow, transport,
> >machine,
> >transport and eventually dispose of them managed in ways that minimize
> >impact.  Here's my "yesbuts".  None of these trees are weeds. I don't
> >know if
> >any of them are being managed as a renewable resource.  I'd like to
> >hear from
> >the eco-foresters on that one.  Last I knew, cypress was a species at
> >risk
> >(too bad cause it lasts the best).  Working these woods without
> >respiratory
> >protection will expose you to the natural toxins present in every one
> >of
> >them.  My old partner and I ended up at the emergency room with toxic
> >shock
> >after three days of working with black walnut.  Lastly, locust is damn
> >bear
> >to saw, plane or sand - a tool eater.  - Terry
> >__________________________________________________________________
> >This greenbuilding dialogue is sponsored by Oikos (www.oikos.com)
> >and Environmental Building News (www.ebuild.com). For instructions
> >send e-mail to greenbuilding-request@crest.org.
> >__________________________________________________________________
> >
> __________________________________________________________________
> This greenbuilding dialogue is sponsored by Oikos (www.oikos.com)
> and Environmental Building News (www.ebuild.com). For instructions
> send e-mail to greenbuilding-request@crest.org.
> __________________________________________________________________
> 
> ------------------------------
> 
> Date: Wed, 11 Jun 1997 13:16:12 -0700
> From: loco@montana.com (Steve Loken)
> Subject: GBlist: digest messages
> 
> TO WHOM IT MAY CONCERN:
> 
>         I am writing to request that the greenbuilding digest messages that
> you send out to us at this address be stopped.  Please take us off of your
> list as we are receiving exactly the same messages at a different address
> (CRBT).  I am referring to the messages which are sometimes coming 4 to 5
> times per day and are numbered in the hundreds. You will understand that
> these tend to really clutter an in-box and as office manager of Loken
> Builders (and thus the person who has to wade through the e-mail) I need to
> stop getting these messages.  Please notice this is my second request.
> Thank you -- Leslie Dahl
> STEVE LOKEN
> LOKEN BUILDERS
> 
> __________________________________________________________________
> This greenbuilding dialogue is sponsored by Oikos (www.oikos.com)
> and Environmental Building News (www.ebuild.com). For instructions
> send e-mail to greenbuilding-request@crest.org.
> __________________________________________________________________
> 
> ------------------------------
> 
> Date: Wed, 11 Jun 1997 15:47:08 -0400
> From: Carol Venolia <CVenolia@CompuServe.COM>
> Subject: GBlist: ASHRAE 62-1989
> 
> <squeezing through the de-lurking tunnel>
> 
> Hello GBers--
> 
> I'm grateful to EBN and all the list participants for this forum and its
> content, and I've wondered what profound moment would cause me to step
> forward from the shadows...
> 
> Does anyone have a copy of ASHRAE 62-1989?  I need the figures for "curre=
> nt
> recommended maximum contaminant levels" for 10 major indoor air polluters=
> ,
> and I'm reluctant to pay $45 for the whole publication.
> 
> Please e-mail me and perhaps we can arrange something by fax.
> 
> Thanks!
> 
> Carol Venolia
> CVenolia@compuserve.com
> __________________________________________________________________
> This greenbuilding dialogue is sponsored by Oikos (www.oikos.com)
> and Environmental Building News (www.ebuild.com). For instructions
> send e-mail to greenbuilding-request@crest.org.
> __________________________________________________________________
> 
> ------------------------------
> 
> Date: Wed, 11 Jun 1997 14:51:03 -0700
> From: "Mike O'Brien" <obrien@hevanet.com>
> Subject: Re: GBlist: ASHRAE 62-1989
> 
> Hi, Carol--
> 
> Point your web browser to http://www.trane.com/fresh/ashrae4c.html where
> you will find a table with this information.
> 
> Cheers, Mike
> 
> O'Brien & Associates
> Environmental Building Consultants
> Portland General Electric Earth Smart program
> obrien@hevanet.com
> 
> __________________________________________________________________
> This greenbuilding dialogue is sponsored by Oikos (www.oikos.com)
> and Environmental Building News (www.ebuild.com). For instructions
> send e-mail to greenbuilding-request@crest.org.
> __________________________________________________________________
> 
> ------------------------------
> 
> Date: Wed, 11 Jun 1997 16:12:23 -0700
> From: "John Salmen" <terrain@seaside.net>
> Subject: Re: GBlist: Dangers of CCA Pressure Treated Wood
> 
> What a coincidence I'm covered head to toe in red cedar dust and if I
> can stop sneezing long enough I could put in my two cents
> 
> Waste from milling and processing of cedar and similar woods is as Terry
> implies and my skin testifies a toxic material and in areas like this
> with a hundred years of backwood sawmills there is a fair amount of
> evidence of soil and groundwater contamination. I guess the point I'm
> making is that the use of a naturally decay resistant species is not
> without potential environmental cost that might be comparable to or
> exceed the env. cost of a copper based treatment depending on the
> process. I don't know.
> Another question that comes up is effectiveness. Decay resistant is not
> rot proof and estimates of longevity of naturally decay resistant wood
> start at 20 years but the problem here is that the source of material
> that has been discussed here i.e. quick growing (weeds?) tends to be
> high in sapwood, have little structural integrity and quickly prone to
> decay unlike an older growth version of the same species which you
> really don't want to use for that purpose. You would get longer
> protection for a deck if you left the tree standing and built the deck
> under its canopy.
> 
> I guess my basic opinion on the whole question of wood preservatives is
> one of avoidance in other words that the only wood that should be near
> the ground or in a moist situation should have its roots intact. I can't
> think of any building application that should require the use of
> pressure treated wood to maintain integrity - there is always a design
> alternative and that alternative shouldn't consist of finding an
> environmentally appropriate way of making wood decay resistant.
> 
> I'm not a fan of uncovered decks (I always thought them expressive of
> some fear of being close to the ground) but a wooden deck properly built
> using heartwood planks oriented properly and UNFINISHED should outlast
> its purpose.
> 
> John
> 
> TBren46501@aol.com wrote:
> >
> > In a message dated 6/9/97 3:55:34 PM, crkoehn@mailbag.com (Chris &
> > Ruth
> > Koehn) wrote:
> >
> > <<We've been considering using some of the  native and naturally rot
> > resistant wood species in place of cca treated wood.  My forestry
> > connections suggest that walnut, certain species of locust, red cedar,
> > and katalpa are all very rot resistent- in some circumstances as much
> > so
> > as cca treated wood (my father in law used locust for fence posts on
> > his
> > farm, which have been in ground contact for 50 years and still look
> > good). In many instances logs can be had for the trouble of removal
> > here
> > in Wisconsin. Most of these trees are extremely invasive, and
> > considered
> > "weeds" by farmers and woodlot owners.
> >
> > Any experiences with these materials? I know it's a hassle cutting and
> > sawing and drying.
> >
> > How about using this ACQ preserve stuff? Anybody tried it?
> >
> > Chris Koehn
> > Top Ridge Homes>>
> >
> > Hi Chris,
> >
> > Yep.  My experience with white locust, arborvitae, red cedar, redwood
> > and
> > cypress is that they are extremely well protected from fungal
> > breakdown and
> > insect infestation.  I'd like to see programs that grow, transport,
> > machine,
> > transport and eventually dispose of them managed in ways that minimize
> > impact.  Here's my "yesbuts".  None of these trees are weeds. I don't
> > know if
> > any of them are being managed as a renewable resource.  I'd like to
> > hear from
> > the eco-foresters on that one.  Last I knew, cypress was a species at
> > risk
> > (too bad cause it lasts the best).  Working these woods without
> > respiratory
> > protection will expose you to the natural toxins present in every one
> > of
> > them.  My old partner and I ended up at the emergency room with toxic
> > shock
> > after three days of working with black walnut.  Lastly, locust is damn
> > bear
> > to saw, plane or sand - a tool eater.  - Terry
> > __________________________________________________________________
> > This greenbuilding dialogue is sponsored by Oikos (www.oikos.com)
> > and Environmental Building News (www.ebuild.com). For instructions
> > send e-mail to greenbuilding-request@crest.org.
> > __________________________________________________________________
> __________________________________________________________________
> This greenbuilding dialogue is sponsored by Oikos (www.oikos.com)
> and Environmental Building News (www.ebuild.com). For instructions
> send e-mail to greenbuilding-request@crest.org.
> __________________________________________________________________
> 
> ------------------------------
> 
> Date: Wed, 11 Jun 97 18:58:42 CDT
> From: XINCLXgreenbuilding@txinfinet.com (greenbuilding Conference @ txinfinet.com)
> Subject: GBlist: Fwd: Request for Info on Green Building
> 
> FYI...
> 
> High Performance Building Intititative
> Commonwealth of Pennsylvania
> 
> The PA Department of Environmental Protection and Conservation
> Consultants, Inc., are seeking information from individuals and
> organizations engaged in the design, development and construction or
> renovation of high performance, sustainable buildings.  The purpose of
> the search is to gather information on policy, financing and case
> studies to be featured in public education documents and videos on the
> subject of sustainable design.
> 
> There is particular interest in green schools and other educational
> buildings.  Respondents will be added to a mailing list to solicit
> participants and speakers for upcoming conferences on the subject.
> Please remit your information to
> 
> Robert J Kobet, AIA
> Director of Green Building Services
> Conservation Consultants, Inc.
> 64 S. 14th St.
> Pittsburgh, PA 15203
> 
> vox (412) 431-4449 ext. 225
> fax (412) 431-4558
> email cci@nauticom.net
> 
> - --
> 
> Bill Christensen
> billc@greenbuilder.com
> Sustainable Building Calendar at http://www.greenbuilder.com
> - --------------------------------------------------------------------------
> Sustainable Sources - Internet Solutions with an Environmental Perspective
>           info@greenbuilder.com      BBS  512.462.0633
>               Telnet://fc.greenbuilder.com:3000
>               WWW  http://www.greenbuilder.com/
> __________________________________________________________________
> This greenbuilding dialogue is sponsored by Oikos (www.oikos.com)
> and Environmental Building News (www.ebuild.com). For instructions
> send e-mail to greenbuilding-request@crest.org.
> __________________________________________________________________
> 
> ------------------------------
> 
> Date: Wed, 11 Jun 1997 20:38:04 -0400
> From: "Gregory F. Edwards" <bldgconsulting@rica.net>
> Subject: GBlist: terminating my subscripion to greenbuilding digest
> 
> - -I would like to terminate my subscription to greenbulding digest. How
> do I do this?
> 
> Greg
> bldgconsulting@rica.net
> __________________________________________________________________
> This greenbuilding dialogue is sponsored by Oikos (www.oikos.com)
> and Environmental Building News (www.ebuild.com). For instructions
> send e-mail to greenbuilding-request@crest.org.
> __________________________________________________________________
> 
> ------------------------------
> 
> End of greenbuilding-digest V1 #297
> ***********************************
Remove me from your email list. Thanks. pnmadison@prodigy.com
__________________________________________________________________
This greenbuilding dialogue is sponsored by Oikos (www.oikos.com)
and Environmental Building News (www.ebuild.com). For instructions
send e-mail to greenbuilding-request@crest.org.
__________________________________________________________________