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Oppiliappan List Archive: Message 00193 Aug 2005

 
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Your advice is well appreciated.
It is true one is to ascertain the true facts from
learned scholars before rushing up to come up with
statements which will affect the sentiments of
Bhaktas.
Dasan
Tamarapu Sampath Kumaran
--- sgopan <sgopan@xxxxxxxxxxxx> wrote:

> Dear Sri KrishNa : Sri VaishNavam existed much
> before AchArya RaamAnuja's time  .
> 
> Swamy Naatha Muni , Swamy AlavanthAr , Periya Nampi
> , GhOstipuram 
> Nampi , and a host of others preceded AchArya
> RaamAnujA as Sri VaishNavite
> AchAryAs . Much before them were our AzhwArs . Hence
> it is not correct to 
> advance the various points that you are making : (1)
> Before Ramanuja  only VaishNavam 
> (Not Sri VaishNavam ) existed (2) Before Ramanuja"s
> time , only advaitha alone existed
> as philosophy (3) Ramanuja is the founder of
> Vaishnavam "sect " (4) Before Ramanuja
> The ThirumaNN  was all gopi . 
> 
> These are all erroneous . What Sriman AMR Kannan
> wrote is correct .
> Sriman MadhavakkaNNan has a whole web site devoted
> to AchArya 
> Ramanuja . Please study the various articles  there
> in . 
> 
> I know you are quite eager to learn about our
> sampradhAyam & its history .
> I do not know where you came across these ideas that
> you are declaring
> categorically . A lot of aasthikAs might get
> offended . I request you to be
> careful in making this kind of incorrect assertions
> . Please approach an
> AchAryan in India and spend some time  with him .
> You will enjoy those
> sessions to get on to the right track .
> 
> With all best wishes ,
> V.Sadagopan      
>   ----- Original Message ----- 
>   From: honganour krishna 
>   To: Oppiliappan@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxx ;
> Srivaishnavam_update ; Thengalaiiyengar ; VEDIC_TALK
> ; Velukkudi Krishnan ; RAMANUJA GROUPS ; ramanuja
> mission ; jetusa JEEYAR 
>   Cc: HONGANUR S SESHADRI ; MYSORE K SRINIVASAN ;
> SRILATHA SRINIVASAN ; SriRangaSri ; HONGANOOR S
> VENKATESH ; SRINIDHI VENKATESH ; shylaja
> krishnamurthy ; MR. & MRS. BALAJI ; MR. & MRS. Dr.
> RAMAPRASAD ; honganour parthasarathy ; SADAGOPAN 
>   Sent: Wednesday, August 24, 2005 1:23 PM
>   Subject: Re: [Oppiliappan] Fw: [SriRangaSri] RE:
> Origin of Hebbar iyengars
> 
> 
>   Swamin:
>   Before Ramanuja there was only Vishnavism, and the
> philosophy existed was only Advita. Sri Ramanuja
> made advita into Vishista-advita also called as
> qualified advita or qualified monoism.He made
> Vishnavism into Srivishnavisam by giving a place to
> SRI also known as Godess Lakshmi. Acharya Ramanuja
> is the founder of Srivishnavism Sect. If you study
> the Life of Sri Ramanuja, you will find that his
> Guru taught Ramanuja and his class-mates advita
> philosophy.Later came Madhwa Charya and his
> philosophy was Dwaitha also called as Dualism.
> Before Ramanuja the Red Line signifying Lakshmi or
> Sri in the center of the Namam did not exist, it was
> Sri Ramanuja who inserted the Red. It is very clear
> that Vishsta-advita philosophy did not exist before
> Sri Ramanuja. I welcome more arguments in this
> subject from learned Scholars.
>    Adijen Krishna Sri Ramanuja Dasan
>   sgopan <sgopan@xxxxxxxxxxxx> wrote:
>     Sri:
> 
>     Dear BhakthAs :
> 
>     It is my pleasure to share with you Sriman AMR
> Kannan Swamy's
>     posting  in the Sri Ranga Sri list .
> 
>     V.Sadagopan
> 
> 
>     > Dear Sri Sampige Srinivasa Swamin,
>     >
>     > Thank you sharing us about the origin of the
> word Hebbar. That was very
>     > informative.
>     >
>     > You have also mentioned that Sri
> Ramanujacharya was not a SriVaishnava
>     > when he was born and was born to an advaitin.
> Could you please refer
>     > some authentic manuscripts regarding this
> claim? I don't think Sri
>     > Ramanuja was born to an Advaitin.
>     >
>     > We first need to understand the social
> structure of Sri Ramanuja's days.
>     > In those days everyone who followed the Vedic
> (vaidika) religion wore
>     > only an urdhava pundram and worshipped Sriman
> Narayana as the supreme
>     > reality. Some of these vedic (vaidika) people
> might have followed
>     > advaita philosophy as well. But the difference
> between now and then was
>     > whether you are a advathi or a vishistadvaithi
> you always wore a urdhva
>     > pundram and worshipped Sriman Narayana as the
> supreme reality unlike the
>     > present scenario. Therefore whatever the
> difference between the (present
>     > day) smarthas and (present day) vaishnavas did
> not exists in those days.
>     > In fact everyone followed smartha dharmam (the
> rituals prescribed in
>     > smrithis) but lived a vaishnavite life.
> Therefore even if we say that
>     > Sri Ramanuja was born in a smartha family, we
> need to clearly understand
>     > that the present smartha-vaishnava grouping
> did not exist in those days.
>     > For example those smarthas did not wear
> thri-pundram. They might have
>     > used thiruman, srichurnam or sandal or gopi or
> something else to wear an
>     > urdhva pundram. Another example is those
> smarthas did not accept other
>     > deities as supreme reality.
>     >
>     > Adiyen still remember the words of Sri
> Velukkudi Varadhacharyar Swami
>     > during one of his upanyasams in
> Tiruvallikkeni. Swami said, "Vaidikas
>     > (those who follow vedic religion) may dispute
> among themselves whether
>     > Advaita is the vedic philosophy, or
> Vishistadvaita is the vedic
>     > philosophy or Dvaita is the vedic philosophy.
> But these vaidikas will
>     > never dispute whether Sriman Narayana is the
> supreme reality or some
>     > other deity is the ultimate truth. Because
> Sriman Narayana's supremacy
>     > is what vedic philosophy and that is what all
> vaidikas including
>     > Advaitis, Vishishtadvaitis and Dvaitis
> believe." But of course the
>     > present day situation is different. We should
> not gauge those days with
>     > present day's standards.
>     >
>     > Now the question comes, how do we know for
> sure? We need to read the
>     > great works done by those acharyas. For
> example, Sri Adhi
>     > Shankaracharya's Brahma Sutra Bhashayam (in
> particular 2nd chapter
>     > (Avirodhathyayam, Dharga Padham) will be a
> good place to start about Sri
>     > Shankaracharya's position on various religions
> practiced in his days.
>     > Similarly, Sri Shankaracharya's Sri Gita
> Bhashayam and Sri Vishnu
>     > Sahasranama Bhashayam would be equally good to
> read in order to
>     > understand his philosophy.
>     >
>     > But if we want to know the essence of these
> writings, there are two
>     > excellent books written by Puththur Sri
> Sudharshanam Sri
>     > Krishnamachariyar Swami entitled: 1. Sanga
> Kala Tamizhar Samayam 2.
>     > Shankararum Vainavamum. These two books were
> written with authenticity.
>     > These books are in Tamil. So, someone needs to
> translate them for
>     > everyone to read. They are truly eye-openers
> for many misconceived
>     > thoughts.
>     >
>     > Adiyen Ramanujadasan Kannan
>     >
>     >
>     >>===== Original Message From "Sampige
> Srinivasa" <sampiges@xxxxxxxxxxx>
>     > =====
>     >>Dear Sri. Balaji,
>     >>
>     >>Yes Hebbar Iyengars were not originally
> Srivaishnavas as you said and
>     > also
>     >>it is true that even Sri. Ramanujacharya was
> not a Srivaishnava when he
>     > was
>     >>born. He was born to an advaitin! So when
> Ramanuja preached
> 
=== message truncated ===



        
        
                
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