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Ramanuja List Archive: Message 00101 Sep 2006

 
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Dear Swamin:

your thanks are due to HIM only, not to adiyEn. Adiyen
is poor in sampradhAyam knowledge and jn~aanam.
Adiyen always prays for HIS krupA and HIS bhaagavada
sampandham.

senthil.b


--- pratyagatma <kannan_mukundam@xxxxxxxxxxx> wrote:

> Dear Senthil,
> 
>    Thank you very much to spend your time to
> enlighten me.
> 
>    Yes, I got the answers to all of my doubtm, and
> now my ignorance 
> is removed.
> 
>     I got the answer for even Bhagavata Shlokas,
> where Shiva was 
> praised during churning of milk ocean (Those
> prasings were by 
> Devathas and just to make him ready for swallowing
> the poison, and 
> whatever the Puranic statemnt contradicts with
> Shruthi is not the 
> valid truth.) 
> 
>   And I came to know that Rudra is also a jeeva (his
> sinful birth 
> stated by Sathapatha Brahmana and many other
> Upanishads cleared 
> that .)
> 
>   There are many quotes in Upanishds which reveal
> Narayana as 
> paramAtma (and the NArAyaNa can't be associated with
> any other deity 
> other than Lakshmi pathy as per Panini grammar, this
> is enough to 
> refute all other vadaas).
> 
>  Bhallaveya Shrthi is very clear that mentions all
> names are 
> primarily belong to Vishnu , so wherever Shruthi
> explains Brahman 
> with other
> names(Rudra,Shamhu,Shiva,Indra,Hiranyagarbha etc.,)
> those  
> refer to Narayan only, otherwise nobody can
> interpret the Vedas 
> without contradictions.
> 
>   Purusha Suktham is very clear that mentions
> "HrEschatE , 
> LakshmIscha patnyaow" (Parama purusha has wives
> Bhoodevi and Lakshmi 
> devi ).
> 
>   And there are no.of Upanishad vakyAs to prove
> Sreeman Narayana's 
> paratvam without any doubt.
> 
>   "yasya tathA kapyAsam pudarIkamEvamakshiNI" , it
> clearly tells that 
> Paramtma has the two(AkshinI is in dviteeya samasam)
> beutiful lotus 
> like eyes (which proves Brahman is not Rudra who has
> three eyes 
> ("tryaksha soola pAnih"), not Brahma who has four
> heads and 8 eyes .
> 
>  Narayana is "apahatapApmA divyo deva Eko Narayana"
> , who has no sins
> (no karma), where as Rudra is "anapahatpApma" ,
> clearly tells Rudra 
> is also under Karma bondage like any other jeeva.
> (so he is not even 
> avtara of Narayana).
> 
>   Thanks for your help.
> 
>  Adiyen.
>  Kannan
>  
>   
>   
> --- In ramanuja@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxx, senthil b
> <b_senthil2002@...> wrote:
> >
> > Dear bhagavathAs,
> > 
> > adiyEn will try to prove that Sriman Narayanan
> > is parantattvam by using paasurams from 
> > Thirumazhisai Alwar who is best to condemn
> > all other sAshtrAs.
> > 
> > adiyEn will now try to give some pasurams which 
> > conforms the supremeness, parantattvam of Sriman
> > Narayanan.
> > 
> > 1)In pasuram 53: (nAnmugam thiruvanthAthi)
> > 
> > "...................- pollAtha
> > thEvaraith thEvarallAraith thiruvillAth
> > thEvaraith thErElmin thEvu."
> > 
> > In the above pasuram, Alwar states that, he wont
> > consider others as "dEvar" or "deivam", because 
> > they dont have any sampandham with Sri Devi
> Naachiyar.
> > 
> > The person who had sampandham with Sri Mahalaksmi
> > is none other than Sriman Narayanan, is considered
> > to be "deivam" or "dEvar". Others including
> > "brahma-rudrAdhigal" aren't considered as
> > "deivam or dEvar".
> > 
> > Now, the saivites starts refusing Alwar by saying
> > that, "You state that, only Narayanan is deivam,
> > others aren't. Then the sAshtrAs says that, your
> > lord is one of person who born along with Indran
> as 
> > UpEndran during Vaama Avataram, and one among
> > trimurtis "brahma-vishnu-rudran". Then the dosha's
> > for the brahma-rudrAdhi's wont comes to your lord
> > also? Because, vishnu is also one dEvar among the
> > brahma-rudrAdhi's."
> > 
> > To this question, now Thirumazhisai Alwar refutes
> > clearly in his 54 Pasuram in nAnmugam
> thiruvanthAthi.
> > 
> > 2.paasuram 54
> > 
> > "thEvarAi  niRkumath-thEvum  ath-thEvaril
> > moovarAi niRkum muthupunarppum ? yaavarAi
> > niRkindrathellAm nedumAlen rOrAthAr
> > karginRa thellAm kadai."
> > 
> > The alwar says that "even though HE born as
> brother 
> > to Indran and stood as one dEvar among trimurti's,
> > it is true that HE is antharyAmi to
> brhama-rudhrAdhi's
> > which is explained by Vishnu Puraanam as
> > 
> > "srushtisdhithyanthakaranIm 
> brahmavishnusivAthmikAm |
> > sa samj~nam yaathi bhagavAnEga  Eva  janArthdhana:
> ||
> > "
> >                            [Vishnu Puranam 1.2-66
> ]
> > 
> > muthpunarppum ? old avathAram of Sriman Narayanan;
> > muthu ? old ;  punarppu ? sankalpam ;
> > It means that it's an avataram due to HIS
> sankalpam. 
> > Not like others as due to their karmam, they took
> > birth
> > which is stated in Purusha Sooktam as follows:
> > 
> > "thripAthUrdhva udhaith purusha: padhOsyEhAbhavAth
> 
> > puna:"
> >                                [Purusha Sooktam]
> > 
> > Even in Gita Lord Krishna says that HE took birth
> due 
> > to HIS sankalpa roopa gna~nam.
> "sambhavAmyAthmamAyayA"
> > 
> > Eventhough HE stood one among trimUrti's, HE is
> none 
> > other than avatAram of Parama Purushan Sriman 
> > Narayanan. 
> > 
> > In next word - "yaavarAi nirkinrathellAm" -alwar
> > proves
> > that as a Parantattvam, HE stood to withhold all
> the 
> > chethanAs' and sarva pathArthangal like dEvar, 
> > manushyar, thiryak, sthAvaram, etc., Apart from
> HIM, 
> > emperuman is in all other things which is
> different 
> > from HIS roopam, qualities, etc., through
> "vyApakam"
> > HE gives roopam, naamam to all those things which 
> > different from HIM. HE only born as Upendran,
> Vishnu 
> > among trimurti's.
> > 
> > 1.thEvarAi  niRkumath-thEvum ? born as Upendran,  
>  
> > brother to Indran during Vaamana Avataram
> > 
> > 2.moovarAi niRkum muthupunarppum ? old avataram of
> 
> > Sriman Narayanan as Vishnu among trimurti's
> > 
> > 3.yaavarAi niRkindrathellAm  ?  all other things
> which
> > 
> > got its     saththai, roopam, naamam, et.c,
> > 
> > 4.nedumAlE     --   all the above are only Sriman 
> > Narayanan, sarvEshwaran, paramporul;
> > 
> 
=== message truncated ===



                
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