[compost_tea] cow pies WASRe: Aged manure?

From: dkemnitz2000 <dkemnitz2000_at_yahoo.com>
Date: Mon, 07 Jun 2004 22:45:16 -0000
--- Since this discussion appeared I went out to investigate them
somewhat.  My cow went out into a new pasture may 7 or 8, 2004 and
the patties there are only 3/4 ths of an inch thick are dry on top
and have very little moisture even near the bottom. They don't look
like manure at this point. I am  spraying ACT on some recently,
mainly in the ok corral, to see if the fly population is reduced in
the future. Dennis






In compost_tea_at_yahoogroups.com, "Kirk Leonard" <kirk@o...> wrote:
> > Date: Fri, 04 Jun 2004 10:11:01 -0400
> > From: soilfoodweb_at_a...
> > Subject: Re: Aged manure?
> >
> > But Kirk, what is aged manure?  It has been composted, so is it
really
> manure? <
> Well, I was actually thinking - and believe I have seen a lot of
this
> stuff - that aged, or "rotted" manure - manure that has not been
maintained
> as compost, with temp, moisture and turning attention...  Passive
heaps that
> have been left to drain, de-gas and dry, maybe turned to make sure
vermin
> aren't making homes there or to deal with stink.  Left to sit and
then put
> into fields when there's time to do it - no maturation
considerations but a
> lot of people work on cycles which probably make it "mature" in
compost
> terms. And while it naturally composts to some extent, I don't
think of it
> as compost.  Good stuff yes, but not compost.  And NOP will not
allow it to
> be used as compost.
>
> Now cow pies are a different matter.  Every cow I ever met pooped
in a plop
> and if they were loose there were plops pretty well distributed,
definitely
> not heaped.  They dry out - one of the functions of age, I hear, so
I call
> that aged manure.  Anyway, no way a 3 pound plop of poop is going
to compost
> on its own...
>
> > Raw manure must be composted. <
> I agree but don't think that's realistic yet.  Please don't take
that to
> mean I support NOP's "processed manure materials" though - I don't -
where's
> the science and experience behind that stuff?
>
> > So, maybe the way to look at the NOP and USDA rules is to only
call
> something manure if it is fresh out of  the animal. <
> That's what they seem to have in mind, but they cast it across
manures that
> are definitely not raw - even going so far as to call compost tea
raw manure
> today!
>
> Another big pinch for me here is that while you can use raw or aged
or
> rotted manures 90-120 days out from harvest, what if you can't get
in the
> field in time?  If you're an organic operator, that's a big deal.
>
> Manure that has been allowed to "age" is not raw manure. 
If "heaped" but
> not composted material is all plant material, there are no
restrictions on
> its use - though it is highly likely to contain the same pathogens
NOP is so
> worried about in manure.  Warped, not real, not sound or sensible. 
Thus my
> vent.  Hopefully will end head-banging on wall...
>
> There's been a bunch of debate about this in the past, I'm sure,
didn't
> intend to spark one.  Don't think it's anything winnable at NOP
anytime
> soon.
>
> > If it has aged, call it organic matter from a mixture of sources.
> Bacteria, fungi, protozoa, nematodes, microarthropods,
worms....that's a
> pretty good mix of organic matter...[snip] ...Anything with the
word manure
> in it is going to make the USDA go ballistic.  But when good aerobic
> organisms have their way with manure, it isn't manure anymore. <
> I agree.  My point precisely.  Yummy stuff for soil - anytime.
>
> And Jimmy - I've never been around dung beetles but their covering
it as you
> suggest suggests to me a natural form of preserving/processing it -
maybe
> even making it edible or habitable?  And how do they cover it
without
> touching it?:)
>
> Kirk


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Received on Mon Jun 07 2004 - 20:28:42 EDT

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