Re: [compost_tea] Re: Aphids

From: Robert Norsen <bnbrew_at_yahoo.com>
Date: Mon, 25 Aug 2003 14:26:01 -0700 (PDT)

Hi Dave your careful description is understood.
 
How TEA works - everything is food for something else - TEA has enough diversity some bug will to look for food among many other species. My examples tend to simplofy beyond the facts. My example of run em low on food and the O2 required will drop comes from Elaine's graph of O2 during a cycle. Given a steady stream of O2 the level will remain at 8+ for a while then rapidly drop to a lower number - hope to stay above 5.5 - and after a little while down, as microbes multiply and eat the food we gave them and each other the O2 rises as the multiplication slows.
 
I understood that the multiplication slowed as they ran out of plentiful food and that was the reason the O2 consumprion dropped - as microbes went dormant/ hungry.
 
Since we feed kelp and molasses or fish ( all complex foods) the microbes that thrive on that food would - SWAG- dominate in the ACT. Therefore holding back on those foods - or allowing those foods to be consumed without replacing them, would cause many of the microbes to become dormant. In that condition the use of and need for O2 would be reducced, The O2 curve rises again toward 8.
 
Does all activity stop because molasses is used up? Did I say that? More like you say Dave, there is such diversity no single condition short of intense nuclear radiation will affect them all. and are they finding a few the can cope with that too? .

There are scientific facts and farmer style practical approximations. I agree we need to know the science but then to make the science useful we need to be able to use what we know in a practical way.
 
Elaine suggested a 5 day limit. With some lossses every day. Your description would encourage rapid use. And I fully agree.
The question asked was how can we put the ACT in a container and then go spray without going below O2 = 5.5+. I'm saying don't take the ACT at that low point in the O2 curve. Let O2 consumption decrease, then draw and applu the ACT Bob

 
dloring3 <dloring3_at_cox.net> wrote:
Bob - Actually I was refering to the fact that you can't stop an
insect eating fungi that is alive in your tea from attacking an
insect it uses as a host when when you spray it on a leaf and
conditions are right for infection. Beauveria bassiana fungi is one
that can germinate and live on something as simple as Rose Bengal
agar but give it an aphid and it will eat that too. That's what it
does to live.

As for microbes running out of food in ACT, I'm afraid you have
given a very simple response to a distinctly complex situation.
There are thousands of species of bacteria, fungi and actinomycetes
alive in an aerobic tea. Do you think they all eat only molasses,
soluble kelp, or whatever else might have been added as "food"?
Afraid not! Many are eating each other and many are being eaten by
microarthropods further up on the food chain. Even if you keep the
Oxygen going you'll end up with less and less diversity of species if
you hold a system as complicated as a compost tea for more than a day
or two. At least that is what I've gotten out of Elaine's lectures.
No one even claims to know about more than a fraction of the
microbial species that are in ACT so how can we possibly make simple
statements about what works??

--- In compost_tea_at_yahoogroups.com, Robert Norsen <bnbrew_at_y...> wrote:
> Wrong Dave, They stop eating when they run our of food. Keep the
O2 going as they run out. SWAG : they will eat each other for a
while and go dormant. Stop eating! Bob
>
> David Loring <dloring3_at_c...> wrote:Jeff - You can't stop the
microbes from eating.
>
> Dave
>
> ----- Original Message -----
> From: Jeff Lowenfels
> To: compost_tea_at_yahoogroups.com
> Sent: Friday, August 22, 2003 9:09 AM
> Subject: Re: [compost_tea] Re: Aphids
>
>
> No, ACT does not KILL........read my post again.....
>
>
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Received on Mon Aug 25 2003 - 19:05:51 EDT

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