Dear Shri Vishnu, SEshatvam is an undeniable property of every chit and achit i.e. it is the swaroopam. pAratantryam is not a property. It is a behaviour depicted by a chit/achit i.e it is the swabhavam. The difference is, whether we think we are his servant or not, we are, by nature. You can never give up(destroy) the nature of SEshatvam, you may only give up the knowledge of SEshatvam and act arrogantly. Whereas pAratantryam/svAtantryam could be destroyed as it is not a swaroopam, but is a meagre swabhaavam. The only catch is, for performanace of pAratantryam, the knowledge of SEshatvam(swaroopa gnyanam) comes handy. To me, what shri Venkatesan swami mentioned, looks like, this knowledge of SEshatvam shall even be destroyed while trying to perform a complete pAratantrya behaviour - which is true. So, pAratantryam need not make SEshatvam complete, rather, cannot. pAratantryam can only make our acts more appropriate to our real swaroopam that is SEshatvam. By the way, SEsham, in this context, means, something that is incomplete and is dependent on something else for completeness. All achit and chit are incomplete in everything and is dependent on HIM. Whereas HE is complete(poornam....) in himself and makes us complete (by being our antaryami - the niyatha). sarva aparaadhaan kshamasva adiyen, Ramanuja Dasan. --- In ramanuja@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxx, "Vishnu" <vsmvishnu@xxxx> wrote: > Dear Sriman Venkatesan, > > I agree with Sriman Padmanabhan on this. > > The mUlam quoted by Smt Sheela also does not have any mention of > SEshatvam specifically. > > SEsham means something which remains (for Him in our context) and > such nature is SEshatvam. Our AchAryas have derived this as > subservience, servitude etc., though the English words we choose may > not be the best fit. This derviation is due to the fact that nothing > can be superior or equal to Him. > > If we are SEshabhUtam for Him i.e. if we meaningfully remain for Him, > we should not question whatever He wishes including those acts that > are seemingly against our SEshatvam. Hence pAratantryam and SEshatvam > are inter-linked. Thus pAratantryam makes our SEshatvam complete or > perfect rather than destroying it or even tolerating its destruction. > > This can be seen in "nivAsa SayyAsana..." SlOka of yAmuna where SEsha > serves Him as abode, bed, throne, footwear, pillow, umbrella etc. > Here it is important to note that all the objects mentioned are > non-sentient, indicating pAratantryam without any ahankAram. Thus > SEsha has complete SEshatvam. > > Then how do we interpret sUtra 92? > > Dasan > Vishnu > ------------------------ Yahoo! Groups Sponsor --------------------~--> Make a clean sweep of pop-up ads. Yahoo! Companion Toolbar. Now with Pop-Up Blocker. Get it for free! http://us.click.yahoo.com/L5YrjA/eSIIAA/yQLSAA/.itolB/TM --------------------------------------------------------------------~-> azhwAr emberumAnAr jeeyAr thiruvadigalE saranam Yahoo! Groups Links <*> To visit your group on the web, go to: http://groups.yahoo.com/group/ramanuja/ <*> To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: ramanuja-unsubscribe@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxx <*> Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to: http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/
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