RE: [compost_tea] Re: barometric pressure and compost tea Oxygen levels

From: Robert Norsen <bnbrew_at_yahoo.com>
Date: Sun, 12 Oct 2003 14:21:56 -0700 (PDT)

Hi TaChung - Your information is right. The test results showed much higher microbe activity in brewer #1 on run 1 and run 3. Not as good as we expected but bacteria of 2,000 or more, fungal of 3 test 1 and test 3, 5.8 . We have used the Bitti with the moderate amount of air Elaine mentioned. It delivers well with most recipes but fish proves to be MUCH more activating that I expected. And compost in brewer 1 ( GU ) was apparently much more active with fish than were the other composts. Our conclusion is that more air is essential with some recipes. So more air is in our plans for future production. Bob

TaChung Huang <tachung_h_at_yahoo.com> wrote:From the response that I have seen, I do not think I made my point across; Here is the test described by Bob:
Identical Bitti brewers, pumps, tanks, DO probe & calibration etc.....
 

Bob described his Test 1: 3 equal 4 cups of compost added each brewer, GU, AH, NCO

            3 equal amounts fish ( 80 ml fish ) in each brew.

>>>>>>>>>>>>>>

He used three different compost with "identical" amount of fish in each brewer.

Bob's test results was

Test 1 fish The max readings 7.6 , 7.1, 7.8

                     Min 3.3 7.0 5.7

Bob did his Test 2: same equal amounts, same compost, 80 ml kelp.
He used kelp instead of Fish as the food in each brewer and his DO results was
                    Test 2 Kelp Max 8.6 8.1 8.6
                                          Min 8.1 6.8 7.7

Apparently, using Kelp as food stimulated MUCH LESS microbe activity.
 
Bob did his third test as Test 3: Same equal amounts ACTIVATED compost , 80 ml fish.
 
He used activated compost instead of regular compost. He also used fish again. And his result was
   Test 3 fish. Activated compost
                                                 Max 7.8 7.5 7.9

                                                 Min 2.3 6.8 5.4

Whenever Bob used Fish, his DO reading drops. When he used Activated Compost, his DO reading dropped even further.

In brewer One, the readings were 3.3 and 2.3. Compared with brewer Three, 5.7 and 5.4. Compared with brewer Two, 7.0 and 6.8.

It was my observation from these test data that the pump in brewer One produced the least amount of effective air diffusion. The pump in brewer Three was better and the pump in brewer Two seemed to produced the most DO.

It is just a straight observation.

I am located in Taiwan and there is no SFI lab nearby. Sorry, I do not have means to send Tea across and get meaningful SFI results.




Regards
TaChung Huang (é»ƒå¤§å¿ )

-----Original Message-----
From: Robert Norsen [mailto:bnbrew_at_yahoo.com]
Sent: Friday, October 10, 2003 5:00 AM
To: compost_tea_at_yahoogroups.com
Subject: Re: [compost_tea] Re: barometric pressure and compost tea Oxygen levels




Dave, Tom Kirk and All

 

Much conjecture about the 9 test series Kevin and I did at SFI. Let me clarify the objectives and methods and touch on results.

 

Our objective was

1 to compare 3 types compost, GU wood based, AK Humus, and North Country Oranics,

   each in normal as composted and activated by oat flour.
2 to compare fish with kelp.

Many more objectives would have been of interest but we steeled ourselves to what we expected to be able to accomplish. Our plan was to hold compost quantities and nutrient loads to where Air and D O2 would not become a factor

 

We started with

3 identical new Bitti brewers,

3 new identical pumps,

3 identical 10 gallon 'tanks'

fish

kelp

3 different compost types ( Ground up based on wood)

                                      ( AK Humus )

                                      ( North Country Compost as was used by Paul Sachs)

3 identical D O2 meters calibrated and cross calibrated small adjustments recorded.

  3 meter probes were hung to get equally agitated water during the brew.

 

3 brewers were set up side by side, turned on and off by a single switch.

 

SFI Tap water was drawn in 5 gallon lots, each split between 3 brewers to get equal conditions, temps. Temp 77F at start. temp Dropped equally during brew.

 

Test 1 3 equal 4 cups of compost added each brewer, GU, AH, NCO

            3 equal amounts fish ( 80 ml fish ) in each brew.

 

Test 2 same equal amounts, same compost, 80 ml kelp.

 

Test 3 Same equal amounts ACTIVATED compost , 80 ml fish.

 

O2 readings on

                        Test 1 fish The max readings 7.6 , 7.1, 7.8

                                                 Min 3.3 7.0 5.7

 

                         Test 2 Kelp Max 8.6 8.1 8.6

                                                 Min 8.1 6.8 7.7

                         Test 3 fish. Activated compost

                                                 Max 7.8 7.5 7.9

                                                 Min 2.3 6.8 5.4

 

Test results - The highest TF was from test 3, GU compost at 5.8 ug/ml

Excellent TB on all samples. TF varied none exceptional

That 2.3, Kirk, is why I was elling? IT TAKES MORE THAN ORMAL?AIR

to meet O2 needs of the unusual activity that can occur outside of plans.

 

 

It reminds be of when I was asked how much fuel a formation headed for Berlin, 10 hour mission, should take, our records showed the B-24 flying in the same formation used from 250 GPH to 450GPH. Those that used more crashed out of gas on prior missions to Berlin.

 
What other answer could I (yell) ?ALL THEY CAN HOLD !

Bob
 
David Loring <dloring3_at_cox.net> wrote:
Tom - Thanks, that table is great. If you had that why do you say barometric pressure from one day to the next would account for changes in tea Oxygen levels of more than about 0.5-1.0ppm? The second part of the question has to deal with how much the barometric pressure changes from day to day.
 
I plugged in the numbers from the extreme low and high isobar map lines for the entire United States again and and the range of dissolved Oxygen was only 11.1 to 11.4ppm from extreme low to high. So I don't understand what the concern is about varying barometric pressure unless you're in a hurricane?? It seems likely that it only accounts for a small percentage of the variation in Robert Norsen's test results.
 
I think Roberts results are probably not caused by sampling errors (he seems to be familiar with the use of his DO probe) or barometric pressure variations, but I do think there could be a lot of significant information teased out of the data if all the conditions of the test were known. For instance, if the amount of compost added was small so that the lag time to maximum Oxygen demand was more than 10-12 hours then I wouldn't look to the compost materials to be significantly different given they were from the same batch. If the starting materials added were large, say more than 4oz per 5 gals. then it is more likely to make a difference in the way the bacteria competed from the very start. I expect the answer lies in air flow, either from worn air pumps or older diffusers, if such were used. The diffuser in my Sotillo tank seems to have changed over the last year, not a lot, but maybe enough to make a difference if the demand due to high sugar additions was high. If th
 e air
 pumps used were of the cheap variety then their output may have varied widely.
 
Dave
----- Original Message -----
From: tomjasz
To: compost_tea_at_yahoogroups.com
Sent: Wednesday, October 08, 2003 7:13 PM
Subject: [compost_tea] Re: barometric pressure and compost tea Oxygen levels


--- In compost_tea_at_yahoogroups.com, "David Loring" <dloring3_at_c...>
wrote:
> Stop making me do so much math :-} >
> Dave



OK,
http://water.usgs.gov/software/dotables.html





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Received on Sun Oct 12 2003 - 20:24:02 EDT

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