Re: [compost_tea] Re: back pack sprayers to use for compost teas?

From: Ted Peterson <ted.peterson_at_tcsn.net>
Date: Tue, 16 Dec 2003 13:09:33 -0800

I thought that copper plumbing was desired becasue in a PH neutral environm=
ent, copper degraded less than lead or PVC. What does the concentration of=
 3ppm do? Would this occur in a PH 7 tea that was in the sprayer for a bri=
ef time? I would think that bacterial and fungal death from nozzle turbidi=
ty would be far more than the few microbes killed by a small amount of copp=
er leeched from a tank wall.

When we spayed for grapes, we used a tank that had previously used fungicid=
e. Now, we cleaned it thoroughly but there is little doubt that some of th=
e residuals remained. After all, we couldn't crawl inside the spray tank a=
nd clean each and every corner and small hole. Yet, we got adequate covera=
ge on the grapes.

I do believe in cleaning right after brewing. When I look at some of the c=
ommercial brewers on the market and ones Elain recommends, I notice that th=
ey use a system of piping and tubes to move the water. Now, I have done te=
sting with these systems and find that they are almost impossible to clean =
correctly. One reason is that anytime liquid moves past an angle or even a=
 slow bend, the liquid towards the inner or smaller radius moves slower tha=
n the liquid near the outer radius. This causes a situation where some of =
the material moving through the liquid settles and builds up near the inner=
 radius. This is especially crucial on 45 and 90 degree angles. So that m=
eans that some anaerobes will build up in those areas. Unless each and eve=
ry pipe is cleaned and sterilized thoroughly right after use, there will be=
 build up.

I don't think this is a big problem if the volume of aerobes is sufficient =
to get the tea to do what you intend the tea to do. Of course, if you don'=
t clean at all, there could be an eventual problem with highly anaerobic te=
a. The functional aerobes would be there but at some point the anaerobes w=
ould outcompete them for food.

Even a normal brewing process produces some anaerobes. I don't see how to =
eliminate them totally. What I want to do is create an environment that fa=
vors the aerobes so they naturally outcompete the anaerobes.

One of the experiments I did was to heat the water to 80 degrees. The bact=
eria did grow and DO showed activity. However, I was making an environment=
 that favored pathogens rather than functional aerobes and that was not my =
intention.

Another thing about temperature. In the winter, the bacteria that grow and=
 function in the 70 degree range are dormant (so to speak) and other bacter=
ia are functional. To brew tea at 70 - 75 degree range and then apply it i=
n a temperature of 55 degrees gives them little chance of survival in the w=
ild. So I try to get the tea water temp not more than 5 - 6 degrees higher=
 than the outside air temp. That way, the bacteria (I think) have a better=
 chance of survival.

I do know about switchers and other forms of low-temp bacteria but I have t=
o rely on my compost to give me enough diversity and my brewing methadology=
 to give me successful bacterial/fungal growth while keeping within the con=
straints of my site (where I'm putting the tea) environment. As Elaine say=
s, it's all a matter of balance.

Spraying bacteria that thrive in 70 degrees into an environment that is 55 =
degrees almost guarantees that they will not survive in sufficient numbers =
to do much good as far as I can tell by my research. I'm willing to be educ=
ated if I am wrong about this so if someone (Elaine?) has some data to the =
contrary, I am willing to completely change my methadology.

Ted Peterson
Earth-Wise/Spirit of the Earth



----- Original Message -----
  From: soilfoodweb_at_aol.com
  To: compost_tea_at_yahoogroups.com
  Sent: Tuesday, December 16, 2003 12:48 AM
  Subject: Re: [compost_tea] Re: back pack sprayers to use for compost teas=
?


  Hi Ted -

  It's the concentration of copper in the water when the tank is copper. T=
he critical concentration is 3 ppm. In a tank of copper, that concentratio=
n can occur just by simple equilibrium with water. Copper fittings are muc=
h less likely to result in copper reaching a toxic level.

  But your thoughts about the biological decomposition of surfaces should b=
e taken to heart. Why do we clean tanks between each run? To prevent the =
anaerobes from building up and resulting in exactly the kinds of problems y=
ou were talking about.

  Elaine Ingham
  President, Soil Foodweb Inc.
  SFI Corvallis, OR
  SFI Port Jefferson, NY
  SFI Lismore, NSW, Australia
  SFI Hilversum, The Netherlands
  SFI Cambridge, New Zealand
  www.soilfoodweb.com


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Received on Tue Dec 16 2003 - 20:16:59 EST

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